Lock Upgrades on Pedersolis

[Nuthatch]

I have a couple of Pedersoli guns -- one trade gun and one Kentucky. While it took some fiddling to figure out how to get consistent ignition, it's a rare day that I see it be as fast as many people have shown on different online videos of Kiblers & such. Both spark very well and I figured out how to position the flint to get those sparks dead center in the pan. I've widened the touch holes to 1/16". I pick the vent every single time, both before loading the charge (to make sure the powder goes down all the way) and after (to ensure a clear path for the flame). The pan always flashes immediately -- no problem there. But there is a very perceptible delay before the main charge goes off, just enough to allow me to lose the sights in the flash & smoke of the pan and move a tad bit. I really can't tell where my sights are on the target when it goes off because the last thing I see before the shot isn't the sights but a puff of smoke.

I've considered selling the trade gun & upgrading to a Kibler or something similar. I've already swapped the Kentucky's lock for a percussion and it works great with that setup. But could I improve the guns by simply upgrading the locks? Are there after-market locks that are drop-in ready and that could turn these basic guns into something worth keeping?

I'll see if I can upload some video of a typical shot for reference if it helps.

 

[64Springer]

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[64Springer]

I have a couple of Pedersoli guns -- one trade gun and one Kentucky. While it took some fiddling to figure out how to get consistent ignition, it's a rare day that I see it be as fast as many people have shown on different online videos of Kiblers & such. Both spark very well and I figured out how to position the flint to get those sparks dead center in the pan. I've widened the touch holes to 3/16". I pick the vent every single time, both before loading the charge (to make sure the powder goes down all the way) and after (to ensure a clear path for the flame). The pan always flashes immediately -- no problem there. But there is a very perceptible delay before the main charge goes off, just enough to allow me to lose the sights in the flash & smoke of the pan and move a tad bit. I really can't tell where my sights are on the target when it goes off because the last thing I see before the shot isn't the sights but a puff of smoke.

I've considered selling the trade gun & upgrading to a Kibler or something similar. I've already swapped the Kentucky's lock for a percussion and it works great with that setup. But could I improve the guns by simply upgrading the locks? Are there after-market locks that are drop-in ready and that could turn these basic guns into something worth keeping?

I'll see if I can upload some video of a typical shot for reference if it helps.

3/16"?????

.187 diameter is quite the touch hole.

I hope you mean 3/32"/.093 inches.

With a .187 hole, you'd be lucky to keep the powder in the chamber.

 

[Nuthatch]

3/16"?????

.187 diameter is quite the touch hole.

I hope you mean 3/32"/.093 inches.

With a .187 hole, you'd be lucky to keep the powder in the chamber.

Oops, yes. Apologies -- I did that over a year ago. I just checked and it's 1/16". Original post edited. Thanks for that catch.

 

[Nuthatch]

This is typical on the trade gun.

 

[Grimord]

I suspect your ignition problems have to do with the Pedersoli patent breech. I have heard of some folks running a long, slightly smaller than caliber diameter, drill bit down to the breech and enlarging the patent breech area for better ignition.

 

[64Springer]

I suspect your ignition problems have to do with the Pedersoli patent breech. I have heard of some folks running a long, slightly smaller than caliber diameter, drill bit down to the breech and enlarging the patent breech area for better ignition.

Something I've contemplated on my Traditions pieces for quite some time.

 

[Nuthatch]

This is about the best it gets, which I think would be great if it were consistently this fast.

 

[Nuthatch]

Sparks well.

 

[64Springer]

That's a lott of sparks.

 

[EC121]

If the pan is flashing before the delay, then the problem is probably the breech set up. A replacement lock won't help that.

 

[DixieTexian]

Maybe cone the inside of the flash hole?

 

[Siringo]

.

I have a couple of Pedersoli guns -- one trade gun and one Kentucky. While it took some fiddling to figure out how to get consistent ignition, it's a rare day that I see it be as fast as many people have shown on different online videos of Kiblers & such. Both spark very well and I figured out how to position the flint to get those sparks dead center in the pan. I've widened the touch holes to 1/16". I pick the vent every single time, both before loading the charge (to make sure the powder goes down all the way) and after (to ensure a clear path for the flame). The pan always flashes immediately -- no problem there. But there is a very perceptible delay before the main charge goes off, just enough to allow me to lose the sights in the flash & smoke of the pan and move a tad bit. I really can't tell where my sights are on the target when it goes off because the last thing I see before the shot isn't the sights but a puff of smoke.

I've considered selling the trade gun & upgrading to a Kibler or something similar. I've already swapped the Kentucky's lock for a percussion and it works great with that setup. But could I improve the guns by simply upgrading the locks? Are there after-market locks that are drop-in ready and that could turn these basic guns into something worth keeping?

I'll see if I can upload some video of a typical shot for reference if it helps.

Make certain the patent breach is clean. I purchased a used trade gun that was nearly totally plugged. No wonder the precious owner got rid of it! I pour powder down the barrel slowly and tap be butt lightly to get the powder in the chamber. Then it goes off just as quick as my Kiblers.

On thing though is if you are wet patch between shots, the debris gets pushed right into the breach. So be careful.

 

[Snooterpup]

Maybe cone the inside of the flash hole?

Most likely not possible with most Pedersoli chambered breeches. Proper cleaning of that breech area is a must or exactly what you’re experiencing will happen. The chambered breech plug on mine was only about .25 caliber.

I have a couple of Pedersoli guns -- one trade gun and one Kentucky. While it took some fiddling to figure out how to get consistent ignition, it's a rare day that I see it be as fast as many people have shown on different online videos of Kiblers & such. Both spark very well and I figured out how to position the flint to get those sparks dead center in the pan. I've widened the touch holes to 1/16". I pick the vent every single time, both before loading the charge (to make sure the powder goes down all the way) and after (to ensure a clear path for the flame). The pan always flashes immediately -- no problem there. But there is a very perceptible delay before the main charge goes off, just enough to allow me to lose the sights in the flash & smoke of the pan and move a tad bit. I really can't tell where my sights are on the target when it goes off because the last thing I see before the shot isn't the sights but a puff of smoke.

I've considered selling the trade gun & upgrading to a Kibler or something similar. I've already swapped the Kentucky's lock for a percussion and it works great with that setup. But could I improve the guns by simply upgrading the locks? Are there after-market locks that are drop-in ready and that could turn these basic guns into something worth keeping?

I'll see if I can upload some video of a typical shot for reference if it helps.

Kiblers and many other custom or high quality flintlocks use a traditional flat faced breech plug. My experience with Pedersoli is that if you’re lucky enough to have a great sparking factory lock, the ‘lag’ is wholly due to their long chambered breech. Having had both, and most recently a Kibler Colonial, I personally would never go back to any flintlock that has a chambered breech.
Pedersoli’s chambered breech plug is long and narrow (about 1/4” diameter) and tends to act as a fuse. Please do not attempt to clean that area with any bronze brush as it can easily get stuck. That is a recipe for removing the breech plug/and or trip to a gunsmith.
Trading up to the Kibler is highly recommended, you will not be disappointed.

 

[smokepolehall]

I have a Pedersorry Scout, i took my vent hole liner out. I measure the threads in barrel n the vent liner. Vent liner protrudes into the chamber n its not coned on inside. Mine has been a work in progress n a big learning curve. Mine is .45 cal, when i pull vent hole liner out i can get a .32 cal cleaning jag to the BP. Vent hole liner kept it from getting to BP. So i ground it n coned vent hole liner. I won't buy another Pedersorry.

 

[Kansas Jake]

A .22 caliber brush works to clean the stupid patent breeches on these flinters. I also store mine with the muzzle down in the safe or at least angled down if hanging on the wall. This keeps oil and residue from building up in that tiny channel.

 

[#blackpowderbill]

An older thread with breech plug pictures. Pedersoli Patent Breech design

 

[deerstalkert]

from the smoke in your video i would guess you are using 777.
the ignition int the video was very much normal from my seat in the theater. but in person you may feel more of the delay.
one flintlock i have in 30 cal needs the vent pick left in the vent while the powder is poured and ball seated. if i do this every time it is a instant ignition. if i forget i need some ffff pricked into the vent to get it to pop.

 

[wiscoaster]

...While it took some fiddling to figure out how to get consistent ignition, it's a rare day that I see it be as fast as many people have shown on different online videos of Kiblers & such. ...

I have no proof other than personal observation and comparison, but it's my belief that Pedersolis probably have a longer fire channel from touch hole to chamber than do the Kibler rifle barrels. A different lock isn't going to address that at all. @Snooterpup explanation (above) seems about right to me.

 

[Tasbay]

Have to admit I gave up on the Flintlock on my Pedersoli Kentucky with it`s single trigger. Recently switched it to the Percussion and now get quick reliable ignition even though it grates me to have a Percussion lock on a Kentucky style rifle.