Starting out, which way to go???

[Osprey]

Okay, here's my dilemma. I've shot caplocks for 15-20 years so I'm familiar with lots of basic BP stuff, but I'm looking at starting with flintlocks. Got to shoot one a few weeks ago and it cemented the new goals. Torn between how to start - get a decent flinter complete so I can start shooting now and hunting this fall (looking at Pedersoli Frontier and PA rifles) or get a kit of better gear (TOTW Armstrong style kit is looking good, too) that will take much longer to get to the shooting stage. Been looking at this site a lot and learned much already, but any suggestions, recommendatons???

 

[nchawkeye]

If you can afford it, go with quality...

I started with flinters back in the 70s, have never owned a mass produced gun and never owned a percussion, they just don't appeal to me.

 

[mrbortlein]

Osprey,
If there is nothing stopping you from using a gun you currently have to use this fall, get the kit and make the gun the way you want it. It's much more rewarding making the gun your self, in my humble opinion.
mrbortlein

 

[Johnny Tremain]

http://www.flintlocks.com/

 

[Dan lbsmyr]

The fun (supposed to be fun)thing about working with traditional guns is that the questions never stop! That is half of the joy of this hobby/obsession. I know this is a common question so you might read the excellent archives on this site. You have already gotten good advice from the guys already posted. However, I would like to throw out a couple of additional comments since you asked and I have had 2 cups of coffee...One question for you is do you want to go through the process of building the rifle? Does that interest you or do you really just want to shoot/hunt? Building takes tools, time and patience. To spend $400-900 on parts alone and putting a deadline on the project is probably gonna add a bit of stress to your life. You did not mention if you have built before, so if you are a first time builder, that also will add time and patience. That stress may show up on your gun building. Now get rid of that deadline, and most of that stress turns to extreme JOY!
I am proud to say I have brought two people (and a third on the way) into muzzleloading. My brother wanted a good inexpensive gun already finished. we looked around and handled a few, and he ended up with a GPR percussion. He loves it! It has the handling and original look that he wanted, and it shoots awesome-very accurate. My other flegling, is a friend who is like me, (opinionated & stubborn) didnt want a percussion, and wanted to get parts so he could assemble his own gun. We are lucky to live near TOW so I took him to the shop. He was rightfully overwelmed by the decisions he had to make on the spot. He ended up with a Leman
parts set for approx $600 with a grade 4 maple upgrad that TOW graciously threw in because of stock backorder. As we were leaving the store he said "well I should have this done in about three months" The TOW guy said "you better not" and I said that is unrealistic. Anyway, I met him last nite to go over his progress with the gun and he is 5 months into the gun and he still has a decent amount of work to do on it, and he works alot on the gun.
However, He is estatic about the process and is having an awesome experience with the gun. He is already talking about the next one. He has forgotten about his "deadline" and is having FUN!
I think he did a great job on the gun for a first timer, and am proud of him and his skill building. His next one I am sure will be even better. So you asked for a suggestion, hunt this year with another gun as others have stated, get rid of your time table, buy a quality kit/parts, and have FUN! Sorry about the long wind typing
Dan

 

[billk]

Excellent advice. I too consider building one in the future. It will be my first gun building. Thank you for pointing out the deadline factor and how it can mess things up.

Billk

 

[flintlockmdj]

Go for quality, take your time, enjoy yourself.
All the deer in your area won't be killed this year there will be some left for next year. :thumbsup:

 

[Osprey]

Thanks for all the advice, especially the good, long winded sort! :thumbsup: I guess the real problem is I keep flip-flopping on exactly what I want. On one hand I want to start shooting flint (like an adolescent with his first girl, it's hard to wait :shocked2: ), but if I get a complete gun it'll probably only be stopgap until I can build what I really want. Never built a gun, but I've rebuilt Jeeps and carved decoys, so I hope the metal/wood experience will be applicable.

With such indecision the only course is to be patient and see what's out there. If I find one I like I'll get it, if not I'll keep learning more about building. Club shoot that I went to a few weeks ago has a bunch of guys that got me hooked, and I know a few of them get together once a week to build, so I'll do some brain pickin' for awile, too. Till I make a decision guess I'll stick with the caplock for this season (already have a few archery trips planned, so the time factor could be important). Thanks again, sure this won't be the last question...

 

[nchawkeye]

If you are that handy, you can build a rifle...I bought a Bob Watts .45 flinter back in the 70's...Had an experience with a black bear in the late 80's, that's when I wanted a .54...I bought my parts from the late Bob Hunt in Salem, NC...The barrel was inlet and the ramrod hole drilled and that was it....Took me 2 years and about 200 hours, which I have heard is typical...

The good thing, I still had my .45 to deer hunt with and changed the barrel to .40 after the .54 was finished...I feel that if a guy is restricted to 2 rifle guns then a .40 and a .54 are as good as any...

I used mainly hand tools, so I had very litte cash outlay for tools...I did borrow a Dremel from a friend and I used it to inlay the patch box,if you can use a Dremel its almost like cheating....

Oh yea..the flintlock was already assembled with my gun, if you buy a kit it can take quite a few hours to get it right...

 

[markinstettler]

"The good thing, I still had my .45 to deer hunt with and changed the barrel to .40 after the .54 was finished...I feel that if a guy is restricted to 2 rifle guns then a .40 and a .54 are as good as any..."

Well colour me happy! I've got a .54 GPR which convinced me that a better quality small game rifle (small game is what I spend the vast majority of my time on) would be worth the investment. I recently paid a deposit to a custom builder for a longrifle in .40. I'm expecting the rifle in late October.

I think that it is perfectly reasonable to start out with an inexpensive usable production rifle. My GPR has its problems (the patent breech is high on my list), but was well worth the money. I'll be spending about three times as much money on the .40 but in my opinion, now that I know that I'll use that rifle a great deal, it will also be well worth the cost.

Then again, I had no black powder experience before the GPR. If I had experience with a percussion rifle, I probably would have just put the money down on a nice custom flinter to begin with.

 

[Osprey]

I got dremels, and woodburners too. :grin: I already figure if I get a kit I'll want to get fancy and take twice as long, already envisioning a relief carved sika stag on one side and black bear on the other. Maybe a bear claw inlay?? :hmm:

Flip-flopped twice since the last post, I'm getting dizzy! Ordered the TOTW catalog and "Building the PA Longrifle", not sure if that's going to help or hurt...

Oh well, the absolute worst thing that will happen is I'll end up with two guns in the end. Terrible fate.

 

[Stumpkiller]

I got dremels . . .

No offense, but a Dremel should be the last tool you reach for in gunsmithing. The marketing jingle for Dremel should be "The quicker screwer upper." You want to go very slow and very cautious, especially on your fisrt build. Dremels lack the precision for metal work or the control for wood work. They do remove material fast and they have their place, but better you should make a little error slowly than a big, fast one. Metal don't grow back.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Yes, set the Dremel tool aside. When I use one it is only with the felt wheels with polishing compound to get scratches out of the metal. Even then you have to be careful.

 

[benvenuto]

I've struggled 7 years with a cheap rifle. My advice is save up and go for quality: a decent barrel and the best lock you can get. Nothing is more important than regular consistent ignition. After all the work I have done I can get 19/20 shots off with no trouble, but I have spent so much time in the workshop I stil can't shoot worth a damn :redface:

 

[Osprey]

What are you considering a cheap rifle? If I go the production route I'm not looking at $200 Traditions, but for the $600-$700 price of Pedersoli's and some Dixie rifles I've been eyeing I would hope they work consistently.

 

[cowpoke1955]

Another option may be a Lyman GPR flint kit. Midsouth has them for $301.36 Here's the link:[url] http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/[/url] . Several of us in here have built this kit. This is a relatively easy kit to put together and will give you a taste of building. Best of all, you'll have a good looking, straight shooting, solid new flinter in time for deer season :thumbsup: . Just a thought.

 

[Dphar]

Go with a better rifle. Cheap flintlocks are an abomination that often require hours of skilled work to get to function properly.
Check Jim Chambers Flintlocks for kits. Just looked at one a customer is doing and was impressed. All the dovetails were even cut.

Dan

 

[Dphar]

Unless you are VERY skilled the dremel is a disaster in the making and even then results in poor work.
I have one but its virtually never used on a gunstock. Metal yes, for some things.
Dan

 

The best thing you can do with a Dremel, is to cut the cord off and throw the body away. There are more aww shucks per ounce of weight, than any other tool out there, bar none. A chain saw has more use in gun building than a Dremel. It's supposed to help speed up what yer doing. Gun building is slow and easy. Take yer time and enjoy the process, and you will get a gun you can be proud of. Using a Dremel is like dryballing, It's not a matter of if you'll screw up, but when you will!

Bill

Custer's last order-- "Don't take any prisoners!"

 

[pulaski]

Osprey , do your self a favor and set the dremmel tool aside . I'm no expert but I've built around 20 rifles , never used a dremmel on a single one . The only power tool I've used is a drill press for drilling holes . From what you've said I would guess you have the talent with your hands , now you just have to throw out the clock, calander , and every other time reference and build . You'll finish it when it is time to be finished . If you get an urge to shoot go grab your finished rifles and shoot . Enjoy them now , as they may not see alot of you later . Good Luck!!