Burst Barrel

[gwill]

I don't understand the logic behind turning a safety issue into a guessing game.

 

[gwill]

My post wasn't directed at Colorado Clyde. I just haven't gotten the hang of the reply function. Sorry.

 

[coloradoclyde]

No problem :wink: and I agree with you 100%
Judging by laffindogs last comment I think we can assume that it was operator error and not a mechanical issue with the gun.

 

[pargent]

Was he trying to shoot a stuck rod and jag out of the barrel? :hmm:

 

[hawkeye2]

Neither do I. If the information on what he was shooting and may have caused the problem is available why haven't we seen it? Lets cut to the facts and when we can have a meaningful discussion regarding what happened and why as well as how to avoid it in the future.

 

[matt denison]

The poiint has been that it has been a guessing game all along. He is aware of what some of you have said and to be honest some of it is insulting to him. He didn't accidentally use smokeless. No barrel obstruction, no short started ball in the barrel, not a double charge that he can imagine - afterall, if you make a mistake loading and you know it you'd never pull the trigger.

That barrel simply ... let go. Gave up. Blew. 60 gr of real Goex took it out. The only indicator is the small grey area along the split that was mentioned earlier. Perhaps or even probably an inclusion or other flaw in the steel.

I know that it is hard for some to accept that a barrel will let go without gross neglect or abuse but it does happen. That is why many smiths proof BRAND NEW barrels.

Here come the arguements.

 

[Wes/Tex]

No argument here, have seen it happen twice. One I suspected was operator error but the shooter went to his grave swearing it wasn't, he didn't impress me as a fellow who lied. The other had to be a flaw in manufacturing, just had to be. Similar low pressure load and it just let go...KABOOM! That was it. Fortunately, no one was hurt there either. It's a very rare phenomenon but its a possibility, just like lightning strikes!

 

[hawkeye2]

I had stayed out of this thread because I was hoping that the original poster might be in contact with his friend and provide us with additional data that might help in diagnosing the cause, also I felt that I wouldn't be able to add anything that hadn't already been said (I still can't) regarding the cause. Most barrel failures are the result of operator error or abuse but I will grant that anything can fail even with the utmost care though it doesn't happen very often. The barrel should have contained the 130 grain load without damage that lead to its failure later but it is possible that the damage was done at that point. I agree that no one would fire a gun after knowingly have made a potentially dangerous mistake in loading (Bubba excepted :grin: ) however in many years of safeting on the line I have seen quite a number of shooters unknowingly make mistakes. Fortunately no one was injured nor were any guns damaged though you wouldn't believe the shapes a metal rammer can assume after it has been fired downrange. Not to say the potential wasn't there. The only barrel damage I have seen has been confined to breechloading guns including Civil War carbines fired with a percussion cap. In almost all of these instances the damage was the result of localized anomalies in the earth's magnet field which could be linked to increased alien sightings in the area and it is obvious that no one should be held accountable :haha: .

"He is aware of what some of you have said and to be honest some of it is insulting to him." I don't believe anyone meant to intentionally insult the OP or to treat him disrespectfully in any way however he didn't provide many details and some may not be aware of his level of experience or knowledge so some replies could seem insulting though they were trying to be helpful and cover all potential causes. :v

After 105 posts the only thing we don't know is if it was a porcelain or stainless sink :idunno: .

 

I have talked to the man personally. He told me exactly what happened. I have kept quiet because I didn't want to ruin every one's fun. 5 pages of speculation and supposition and it ain't over with yet. Carry on.

Hint: you are all wrong

For you to make a stupid game out of something this serious is appalling. :barf:

 

[matt denison]

Thanks for chiming in, Jack (or whatever your name is) That is a typical comment from you as you seldom particapate unless you are appalled. It was not a game, that is your misunderstanding. Seems to me it was all a game to the previous 79 people who were trying to "guess" what "foolish mistake" this gentleman had made.

 

[Skychief]

I wonder why I don't hear about more smokeless barrel bursts as compared to black powder barrel bursts.

With the much higher pressures in a lot of smokeless loads and subsequently the barrels firing them (as compared to our muzzleloaders), why don't more of them burst?

Something else to consider would be the lopsided ratio of smokeless guns in use compared to black powder guns! If I had to hazard a guess....100:1? Still, I know of no smokeless barrel to have ever ruptured/split except a very very few that I have read about.


Do any of you have any thoughts about the seemingly low incidents of smokeless barrel failures as compared to black powder barrel failures?

 

It was not a game, that is your misunderstanding. Seems to me it was all a game to the previous 79 people who were trying to "guess" what "foolish mistake" this gentleman had made.

Let's see... "I know the answer, but I want you to guess". That sounds like a game to me.

So, sharing that "foolish mistake", in the hope that no one would repeat it, seems to be unimportant to you. So be it. :shake:

 

[pargent]

Forgot about that one A learning curve ,refresher , and the main reason I don't like shooting others guns with brass barrels . :thumbsup:

 

[Leatherbark]

Simple yes or No Answer please.
Is that gun from Mississippi?

I hope not. I have a Mississippi smoothbore Carolina type gun. Many shots through it though.

Bob

 

[matt denison]

"Let's see... "I know the answer, but I want you to guess".


I did not say that, you did. Those are your words, not a quote from me. Re read my post and think before you type.

I don't want to turn this into a personal thing.

Some have misinterpreted my post, sorry about that. You are reading your own emotions into my words. Forgive me for interupting. I'll bow out now before this turns into a feud.

 

[Skychief]

I wonder why I don't hear about more smokeless barrel bursts as compared to black powder barrel bursts.

With the much higher pressures in a lot of smokeless loads and subsequently the barrels firing them (as compared to our muzzleloaders), why don't more of them burst?

Something else to consider would be the lopsided ratio of smokeless guns in use compared to black powder guns! If I had to hazard a guess....100:1? Still, I know of no smokeless barrel to have ever ruptured/split except a very very few that I have read about.


Do any of you have any thoughts about the seemingly low incidents of smokeless barrel failures as compared to black powder barrel failures?

Anybody have any thoughts or insights?

 

[pargent]

They do indeed burst and for all the same reasons mentioned in the replies to this topic .

 

[hawkeye2]

I don't believe there is a lower rate of smokeless barrel failures. The vast majority of barrel failures I am familiar occurred in breech loaders 99.99% of which were smokeless guns. It is far easier to ruin a smokeless barrel than a muzzleloader but we are getting way ff

 

[Skychief]

I agree it is way ff if the rate of failure is similar. It may be and I did not realize it. If a larger percentage of "our" barrels let loose for reasons unknown, I would think we stand a chance of learning something from the dark side barrels.

IF that would be the case, I would say we were right on topic.

And yes, that's a lot of "ifs".

 

[talon]

That's it. From all the speculation over the years as well as actual tests, there is no steel that is perfectly safe for muzzleloading or smokeless barrels. We should all just scrap our guns & use the barrels for tomatoe stakes.