Walkers wild

Discussion in 'Handguns' started by bang, Jan 17, 2019.

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  1. Jan 17, 2019 #1

    bang

    bang

    bang

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    Took my Walker out for some lead throwing time. 35 grains and 454s. Handles nice. Only issue is sighting. It hits high and right some. Some my butt. How about around 12 up and 12 right. Not exactly sure what I can do about it. Nothing adjustable. One thing I noticed is the end of barrel is squared off. Wonder if it needs recrowned? Or is it something I'll have acount for?
     
  2. Jan 17, 2019 #2

    Gene L

    Gene L

    Gene L

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    12 x 12 at what range? I would experiment with the barrel wedge depth. I have heard it goes in from the right, unlike other BP revolvers if that's true and if it matters.
     
  3. Jan 18, 2019 #3

    rodwha

    rodwha

    rodwha

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    Could dovetail the front sight and deepen the notch in the hammer nose.
     
  4. Jan 18, 2019 #4

    8 BORE

    8 BORE

    8 BORE

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    I wouldnt file anything yet it sounds like a mechinacal problem. Check all other possibilaties first.
     
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  5. Jan 18, 2019 #5

    Carbon 6

    Carbon 6

    Carbon 6

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    Yes there is, In most cases a new shooter or a shooter with a new pistol needs to learn how to shoot it. Your grip alone can severely change the point of impact.

    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Jan 18, 2019 #6

    Carbon 6

    Carbon 6

    Carbon 6

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    Check it and make sure it's square.
     
  7. Jan 18, 2019 #7

    bang

    bang

    bang

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    Not me. Shot rem 44 at same on half dollar. Did reaim by same off and got within reason but something amiss.
     
  8. Jan 18, 2019 #8

    DOUBLEDEUCE 1

    DOUBLEDEUCE 1

    DOUBLEDEUCE 1

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    I would shoot it from a bagged rest to see where it is hitting consistently. Unless I missed it, what is the range you are shooting ?
     
  9. Jan 18, 2019 #9

    bang

    bang

    bang

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    Shot from rest, not bag, 25ft. Aim on target, consistant high right. If it was just an inch or so I wouldn't be concerned but like 12 n 12 not so good.
     
  10. Jan 19, 2019 #10

    Carbon 6

    Carbon 6

    Carbon 6

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    I'd still revert back to the chart I posted. Rests and sandbags can also change your point of impact. It's a handgun, it's supposed to be shot in the hands. I do all my load testing etc. off hand with handguns.
    At least try it before dismissing it.
     
  11. Jan 19, 2019 #11

    hawkeye2

    hawkeye2

    hawkeye2

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    I do hope you mean 12" high and 12" right at 25 yards and not feet. If feet is right then I would send the gun back, major issues. Twelve inches out at 25 yards from a rest is bad but correctable. 35 grains and .454" balls should be an accurate load but you might find one better as you work with it. Given the depth of the chambers in a Walker I would recomend using a filler, Cream of Wheat (not instant) in my case, to bring the ball out to the chamber mouth.

    The muzzle on my Uberti is square with just the slightest bevel, looks like about 45 degrees. I expect it was done to remove any burrs left from the machining and possibly no other reason. Yes the wedge goes in from the right on Walkers and the arbor should bottom out in the hole in the barrel when everything is right and it should require only a light tap with a small wood or rawhide mallet to snug up and set the barrel/cylinder gap. Does it work out that way? No, a light tap on the wedge in mine would pull the barrel back enough to bind the cylinder and create a barrel/cylinder gap that was quite noticeably larger at the bottom than the top (0.0" at the top). If the gun were useable in this condition it would shoot high as a result.

    The above chart that Carbon 6 posted is something every handgun shooter ought to have pasted to the lid of their shooting box.
     
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  12. Jan 19, 2019 #12

    Smokey Plainsman

    Smokey Plainsman

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    Why shoot a Walker if you’re only going to use but 35 grains?
     
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  13. Jan 19, 2019 #13

    hawkeye2

    hawkeye2

    hawkeye2

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    A target very similar to the above (post #5 by Carbon 6) is avaliable on eBay at a reasonable price. Search using 50 Self Correct paper shooting targets FREE SHIPPING and the seller is Harvey1957. He also has a number of other interesting targets.
     
  14. Jan 19, 2019 #14

    PluggedNickel

    PluggedNickel

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    If you have a reproduction Italian made Walker, like I do, mine is a Uberti. First thing to check is the arbor length. With all Colt reproduction revolvers it will be short in almost every case. Some Pietta's aren't though. It is easy to do, just remove the barrel assembly, turn it so it looks like in the picture below and push it back on the arbor. If the barrel frame part with the two lugs that go into the holes in the revolver frame goes in past flush with the frame, your arbor is short. A short arbor, will cause the barrel to tilt up if you push the wedge in too far. It is easily fixed. It will also cause the cylinder gap to be at an angle, tighter at the top, wider at the bottom. It isn't uncommon for the Walkers to shoot high though, but I would check this first before I did anything else.

    [​IMG]

    More info on the shim mod and why it's needed.
    http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Uberti_Open_Top_Revolvers_Part_1.pdf
    http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Uberti_Open_Top_Revolvers_Part_2.pdf
    http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Uberti_Open_Top_Revolvers_Part_3.pdf
    http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Uberti_Open_Top_Revolvers_Part_4.pdf

    You may wish to read his articles on tuning the Pietta, in fact I recommend Uberti users read this first as well.

    http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Pietta_Part_One.pdf
    http://www.theopenrange.net/articles/Tuning_the_Pietta_Part_Two.pdf

    I started out using old toilet seat brass bolts, looked like the bottom one to start. You can use brass round stock, or even steel washers if you like. Lots of options here.
    Of course you can save a lot of work by just using brass round stock at a closer size to start with. I like re-purposing old scrap metal, and tinkering, so I chose this route. You can also buy locator buttons sold by Dillon Precision as seen in some of the other articles. These will get you close to start. Part #14060 for locator button #3 See pictures at the end of this article and in Pettifogger's articles as well.
    [​IMG]
    I cut the bolt head down using my drill press, files, and emery cloth.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    I had measured the gap between the arbor face and barrel assembly hole to be .095" arbor too short.[​IMG]
    Using digital caliper, and micrometer I cut the thickness of the bolt head down to .095" using the drill press at low RPM, and my DeWalt hand drill with a sanding disc in the chuck. With both drills running this gave a very smooth, level finish. I final finished using a hard flat piece of steel block to rest every paper on 400 grit, 600 grit, 800 grit to final finish, checking thickness often to get to .095"[​IMG]
    Finished shim cut to close fit in barrel assembly hole.
    [​IMG]
    Finished shim.
    [​IMG]
    Sitting atop arbor, and in arbor hole.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    You can silver solder the shim to the arbor or use a dab of JB weld in the arbor hole to hold it in place if desired. I left mine lose.
    All reproduction Colt Open Top revolvers need to be shimmed. The arbors are always too short. Without the shim, the barrel assembly will flex upwards when you drive the wedge home. This moves the barrel from perpendicular with the cylinder face, causing the revolvers to shoot high as it also raises the sight. It also makes it near impossible to get repeatable wedge insert every time. With the shim in place the assembly locks up solid against the arbor and with the frame at the two pins on the frame assembly at the bottom of the barrel assembly. Now the cylinder gap remains constant, not flexing, no pinching at top. The wedge will go in the same distance every time. The revolver will shoot closer to POA, and generally lower than an un-shimmed revolver.
    For more info on why this needs to be done to all your Open Top revolvers see the links above to Larson E. Pettifoggers great articles in the SASS Cowboy Chronicles.


    [​IMG]

    Finished Walker with shim in place locks up like a steel drum! No flex, consistent wedge depth each time.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2019
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  15. Jan 19, 2019 #15

    PluggedNickel

    PluggedNickel

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    Yep, see my post above on how to fix this for good!
     
  16. Jan 19, 2019 #16

    hawkeye2

    hawkeye2

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    PluggedNickel a very good post on how to fix the problem. There are many ways to change the gap ranging from complex to utterly simple and as can be expected some work better than others. I'm not going to offer any of the alternatives and when I posted earlier I hadn't intended in getting into how to fix the issue. I figured someone would step in and you did. :thumb:
     
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  17. Jan 20, 2019 #17

    m-g willy

    m-g willy

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    12" HIGH AND 12" TO THE RIGHT?
    Is it shooting tight groups, or more of a pattern hanging around 12" high and 12" to the right?
    If you are getting tight groups that are hitting way off your point of aim ,it isn't the gun..it is the sights(easy fix)
    But if your shots are spread out looking more like a shotgun pattern,,it might be undersize chamber mouths.
    You can get an accurate chamber measurement by loading a round ball into an empty chamber,,then remove the nipple and tap the ball out with a brass rod .
    Then drive a ball through the barrel and see what the difference is between the two with a caliper.
    Perfect fit would be both being equal.
    But a barrel anywhere from .001-.004 over chamber mouth size is good to go.
    I have seen cylinder mouths as tight as .450 with barrels measuring .456
    The only way to fix that is to ream the cylinder mouths,,(Which isn't to hard)
     
  18. Jan 20, 2019 #18

    bang

    bang

    bang

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    My arbor was under .032 from stop. I used a piece of .032 steel wire rolled in a circle and flattened it on an anvil little at a time till the frame mating was just a blonde hair overlap. Bent the wire out a tad so it fit snug and won't fall out.
    I'm thinking mine made it out of factory without barrel end deburred. Going to put fine emery and oil under a marble and give it some debur till I see even perimeter to barrel max diameter.
     
  19. Jan 20, 2019 #19

    8 BORE

    8 BORE

    8 BORE

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    Seems like a waste of money to buy a Walker then rebild it, to make it shoot straight.Oh well
     
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  20. Jan 20, 2019 #20

    PluggedNickel

    PluggedNickel

    PluggedNickel

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    Is is a waste of money to buy a ML and tune the lock? I don't think so! But that is just MHO!
     
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