Smoothbores shooting round ball really high

[rich pierce]

Both my smoothbores flintlocks have barrels with big breeches and are thin at the muzzle, so the sight line down the barrel automatically adds elevation. A lot of elevation. My 20 gauge shoots 4” high at 25 yards when I hold so I barely see the top of the front sight, which is taller than originals. It’s got an Ed Rayl barrel so will not bend easily. If I load down the gun (say 30-40 grains of FFG) it will not shoot good groups. None of this will matter for deer hunting as at 60 yards the gun shoots into the black, not high.

I’m thinking that for woods walks where many targets are close that I may do a cob job front sight height extender.

Other solutions?

 

[Nav]

At what range is it on for the current sight elevation?

 

[rich pierce]

At what range is it on for the current sight elevation?

About 60 yards

 

[Nav]

I would leave it there and just hold under closer. Always easier to hold under with irons than hold over and obscure the target. Helps to shoot with both eyes open too. But, if you need to be on a 25 then do it.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Both my smoothbores flintlocks have barrels with big breeches and are thin at the muzzle, so the sight line down the barrel automatically adds elevation. A lot of elevation. My 20 gauge shoots 4” high at 25 yards when I hold so I barely see the top of the front sight, which is taller than originals. It’s got an Ed Rayl barrel so will not bend easily. If I load down the gun (say 30-40 grains of FFG) it will not shoot good groups. None of this will matter for deer hunting as at 60 yards the gun shoots into the black, not high.

I’m thinking that for woods walks where many targets are close that I may do a cob job front sight height extender.

Other solutions?
View attachment 244116

Since you want to see more front sight, look at the full bead and some barrel.

 

[Flintandsteel]

If you have a load developed, bend the barrel.

 

[Cruzatte]

I'm watching this thread as I've had similar experiences. On my Track of the Wolf fusil de chasse I used their sight for rifled barrels and the gun shot low, a good problem to have.

On my Caywood, if I load a .610" ball with wads, it shoots high. However if I patch a .600" ball rifle style, see no barrel but just the tip of the bead, I'm right on. Incidentally, the interesting detail about these two guns is that each has different drop, the Caywood having more, the TOW gun considerably less.

 

[Cruzatte]

If you have a load developed, bend the barrel.

He says he has an Ed Rayl barrel and it won't bend easily. So that's probably not a good idea.

 

[Flintandsteel]

Any barrel will bend. 12L14, 1311. It will spring back more, but it will bend.
No tree branches, but a solid bench and blocks, large c clamp.

 

[rich pierce]

Since you want to see more front sight, look at the full bead and some barrel.

Will try it but thought that gives more elevation. It’s what I do for 100 yard gongs. Would be the easiest solution. Will try and report back.

 

[rich pierce]

Any barrel will bend. 12L14, 1311. It will spring back more, but it will bend.
No tree branches, but a solid bench and blocks, large c clamp.

I’ve bent a thinner soft barrel but it was quite the project. It needed doing cause a careless barrel maker sent me a barrel in a thin rectangular cardboard box. Guess he was out of tubes. It was half an inch off from straight as received.

I suppose on this thick-breeched barrel all of the bending would be from the wedding band forward. I guess I’d place the clamp halfway between muzzle and wedding band.

 

[Nav]

I’m trying to wrap my mind around “bending“ a rifle barrel…nope, nothing. Can’t do it. To me a bent rifle barrel is a tomato stake.

 

[IanH]

I’m trying to wrap my mind around “bending“ a rifle barrel…nope, nothing. Can’t do it. To me a bent rifle barrel is a tomato stake.

Let me wrap it for you:

 

[Britsmoothy]

What is your current load?
Sometimes what we think is enough means the ball is leaving the muzzle at a unfavorable moment of recoil induced elevation.
Could you try increasing the charge weight or the pressure by adding card wads?

 

[rich pierce]

What is your current load?
Sometimes what we think is enough means the ball is leaving the muzzle at a unfavorable moment of recoil induced elevation.
Could you try increasing the charge weight or the pressure by adding card wads?

My regular load is 70 grains of FFG, patched round ball .600 diameter, and I also tried reducing to 60 and 50 grains. Upping the charge to 100 grains groups the best of all loads so far but it kicks a bit.

 

[nchawkeye]

I'm just impressed that someone with your experience will ask on an open forum...

No way to have a lower rear sight and a flip up for longer ranges? Or, could you move the rear sight up the barrel where it will set lower?

Just brainstorming..

 

[Flint62Smoothie]

No way to have a lower rear sight and a flip up for longer ranges? Or, could you move the rear sight up the barrel where it will set lower?

REAR SIGHT - Likely no rear sight on Rich’s smoothie …

BARREL PLANE - Sounds counter-intuitive but I shoot all my smoothies showing barrel, sometimes a lot. It does sound like your’s might be quite different, however.

I visualize a pencil lying across the breech and the base of the front sight sits on a pencil. In fact that is how I practice for competition, by taping a suitable diameter dowel across the breech for ‘cheeking’ practice and dry firing at home.

BENDING BARRELS - No worries there Rich, as one said, there will be some ‘spring back’, but I’ve bent many a barrel, octagonal barrels rifles too, using a jig setup like IanH showed, barrel on hardwood V-blocks to keep it a good 3-4” about the bench top.

Yes, you’ll need that height due to the spring back !

I bet I’ve bent 8 or more MZLs by now, 4 or 5 being mine, one a massively wide breech and yes, kept the bend forward of the transition … not that you can see it. Previously when gunsmithing, I bent many more, even modern rifles and single-shot Schuetzen barrel to get point of aim to keep the sights centered, maximizing sight adjustment capability … and greatly improving the looks of the completed rifle of course (nothing worse than rifles costing a few $1,000 with sights well off to one side, doh!). And another dirty secret … factory barrels may not be straight!

Personally I don’t get what the big deal is about bending barrels, it’s not rocket science, it’s sooooo much easier than that! I just don’t understand the mystique is about it really. Like I just had sent 2 barrels off to Bobby Hoyt to have one rifled and the other honed smooth. The 1st thing he did, before he did any work I wanted done, was check the barrels for straightness and had to straighten one of them. No big deal …

 

[Britsmoothy]

Where does it shoot on 100gn?

 

[LongWalker]

Take a look at a Beech front sight, or the flip-up "moon sight" on a nitro-express double. Either approach would give you a way to quickly change elevation.

I had great plans for a moon sight for my double: one blade for ball at 50 yards, the other for shot loads. Then I remembered I can't hit anything with a shotgun, and just put on rifle sights!

 

[rich pierce]

I'm just impressed that someone with your experience will ask on an open forum...

No way to have a lower rear sight and a flip up for longer ranges? Or, could you move the rear sight up the barrel where it will set lower?

Just brainstorming..

I have no rear sight. Just sight off the top of the barrel at the breech.