Help with new to me 45 flintlock

[Loja man]

Hey all,
Hope you have had a great day! So I picked up a nice little 45 Cal poor boy at friendship this last weekend. I was able to put about nine rounds through it over the weekend. The touchhole was pretty worn and oversized on it, probably a solid 1/8. It was extremely fast ignition!! First target picture is from 25 yards offhand at friendship. Then I had the vent replaced with a Chambers white lightning vent by one of the smiths at Frindship. I’m home now and was able to take it out this afternoon. A lot more delay today. Second picture is shooting from today off a rest at 25 and 50 yards. Last target picture is shooting freehand at 25 and 50 yards! Very humbling!
I was using 3F in the barrel as well as for primer. I did try priming once with some 4F with no noticeable difference. I also put a new Flint on today. I was making sure my vent hole was clean. Today it was like shooting a percussion when you have hang fires.
Thoughts? Am I really that bad? ;-) Don’t answer that one
Aaron

 

[Flintandsteel]

Make sure your white lightning touch hole is at least 1/16”

 

[TDM]

I can’t throw any rocks at you. Those hits are a good day for me most of the time. But if your ignition time changed that noticeably then certainty check the vent hole for 1/16” as @Flintandsteel said. Did you notice any resistance at the breech around the vent liner when you cleaned her?

 

[Loja man]

I will check the size tomorrow!
TDM I totally spaced that the shooting box that came with the gun had everything but a jag. I cleaned it using the patch worm. At times it did seem to catch but…it may have been the worm tip grabbing something?
Ignition was night and day diferente. Before the new vent it was almost as fast as a cap gun or as fast. Today it was like a cap gun with a bad hang fire.

 

[TDM]

I will check the size tomorrow!
TDM I totally spaced that the shooting box that came with the gun had everything but a jag. I cleaned it using the patch worm. At times it did seem to catch but…it may have been the worm tip grabbing something?
Ignition was night and day diferente. Before the new vent it was almost as fast as a cap gun or as fast. Today it was like a cap gun with a bad hang fire.

Ok, it’s possible that the vent liner threads are protruding into the bore or a flash of metal from the drill and tap is slightly obstructing the vent. Just a possibility, but if you have access to a borescope I’d take a look to bee sure.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Make sure your white lightning touch hole is at least 1/16”

F&S said it first. That's pretty basic issue with flint ignition.

 

[Larry Akers]

If you have not already drilled out your touch hole--don't. I have concluded, in my 60 years shooting and building flintlocks, that ignition speed and reliability is less determined by the size of the aperture and more by the length of the flash channel. I make my own liners and their flash channel is .025" or less with an .055" aperture. If you can't see powder granules in the aperture at the outer surface of the liner, the flash channel may be too long. How you prime also makes a big difference in ignition reliability. Bank powder against the touch hole and tap the breech to insure there is a powder trail from the pan to the main charge. It has been proven by high speed photography that so priming is NOT slower than banking away from the touch hole, but does result in significantly more fire from the prime entering the breech. I once had a passer-by comment on the ignition speed of my rifle that "the ball is out of the barrel before the hammer has hit its stop."

 

[rafterob]

More than likely the vent liner protrudes some into the barrel. Not a big deal there. Very possible there is a small burr or something obstructing the flash hole. First thing, take a drill bit that fits the hole and just push it through by hand and turn it a few times. That will clear out any burr. If you can tell the bit is going easily into the barrel cavity, then there should not be any interference from the breech plug. Use 4f for prime if you have it. I do not bank my prime in either direction but just lay a nice even line across the pan bottom from one end to the other. Load with a pick in the hole and then remove the pick. Those are my few tips, good luck!

 

[Loja man]

I checked the vent hole this morning before heading to work. It is smaller than a 16th that was all I was able to determine at that point. Will keep you all updated!

 

[waksupi]

If you have not already drilled out your touch hole--don't. I have concluded, in my 60 years shooting and building flintlocks, that ignition speed and reliability is less determined by the size of the aperture and more by the length of the flash channel. I make my own liners and their flash channel is .025" or less with an .055" aperture. If you can't see powder granules in the aperture at the outer surface of the liner, the flash channel may be too long. How you prime also makes a big difference in ignition reliability. Bank powder against the touch hole and tap the breech to insure there is a powder trail from the pan to the main charge. It has been proven by high speed photography that so priming is NOT slower than banking away from the touch hole, but does result in significantly more fire from the prime entering the breech. I once had a passer-by comment on the ignition speed of my rifle that "the ball is out of the barrel before the hammer has hit its stop."

Agreed, I've made hundreds of muzzleloaders, have never enlarged a vent, and have always had good ignition

 

[Loja man]

I’m working at my parents place next-door to my house. Came home for lunch. So I just looked on the barrel with a flashligh!! The new vet liner sticks past the barrel wall about a 1/8 on the sides and maybe 3/16 in the middle!!
So…..

 

[TDM]

I’m working at my parents place next-door to my house. Came home for lunch. So I just looked on the barrel with a flashligh!! The new vet liner sticks past the barrel wall about a 1/8 on the sides and maybe 3/16 in the middle!!
So…..

Whew! That’s way too much. Your asking for cleaning problems and stuck jag problems for sure. The only two options I know of is to remove the vent liner and file it down or remove the breech plug and file it flush in place. I’m assuming the vent liner has a flush head, so you’d have to cut a slot in it for a screw driver to fit. Removing the liner is what I’d suggest and you can order a new liner to use too if you didn’t like having the slot.

 

[Loja man]

Grrrr!!!!! That’s really frustrating! The smith really cranked that touch hole liner in with a pair of channel locks! I’m concerned with cutting a slot in it and trying to back it out…. I guess they’re new threads and it’s only been in there a few days. Yet comparing the amount of torque you can put on a channel lock versus a screwdriver doesn’t seem promising. I guess he was trying to seat the touchhole liner firmly so it might come out easy …Removing a breach plug that’s been in there 20+ years also doesn’t seem promising!

 

[TDM]

Grrrr!!!!! That’s really frustrating! The smith really cranked that touch hole liner in with a pair of channel locks! I’m concerned with cutting a slot in it and trying to back it out…. I guess they’re new threads and it’s only been in there a few days. Yet comparing the amount of torque you can put on a channel lock versus a screwdriver doesn’t seem promising. I guess he was trying to seat the touchhole liner firmly so it might come out easy …Removing a breach plug that’s been in there 20+ years also doesn’t seem promising!

Yep, there is no easy solution. I can’t believe the Smith just drilled and tapped and installed it without checking the clearance. But it’s done now. I don’t like fooling with breech plugs, it’s just a good way to mar up your metal. After thinking about it, the best thing is to use a screw extractor to remove the vent liner. A cheap set from HF will work fine and give you a choice of sizes. When you get and install your new liner a borescope would sure come in handy, but you can use a tight cleaning jag and patch to gage when enough has been filed off.

 

[Loja man]

Gurrr!!!! So frustrating! I was so excited that they were able to take care of it while I was there and I didn’t have to! If I knew more about them I would’ve asked him about the clearance inside the bore….. now it looks like I’ll be out the 40 bucks for the liner and his work on installing it plus the cost of a new liner and my time to install the new one!! I may try slotting the face of it with a Dremel first to see if I can back it out. I do have some screw extractors already as back up….

 

[XVIIc Wheelock]

Buy a couple spare correct liners from TOW...you may have to damage the present liner to get it out. Liners are not expensive. Make sure to chamfer the pan side of the liner slightly also. If this is the only problem you have, you are one lucky shooter!

 

[hanshi]

I dislike the idea of tightly cranking a vent liner, it makes it difficult when it will need to come out. I gently "snug" the liner so it can be removed without damage. I've had to remove a few liners for just the problem you are dealing with. I don't have any WL liners and all the ones I do have sport a screwdriver slot. I remove the liners of "new" guns, drill them to 1/16" and enlarge the inside cone. I've also had to file off some of the length to prevent snagging.

 

[Loja man]

So I slotted the vent linnet with a drimel. No go with backing it out with the screw driver. So out came the screw extractor! It finally gave!
So looking down the barrel my eye was a little off. It was sticking past the inside wall of the barrel not quite 3/32.
So where to go now…I like the idea of a slotted vent liner for ease of swapping..but how often dose one wear out a vent linner? If I installed another Chambers liner that doesn’t have a slot, would I be able to back it out after many years of use without having to re-drill and tap? This barrel is already tapped for a 5/16 threaded vent. I don’t know that the barrel could be retapped any bigger.
Do the vent liners come with a slot or do you slot them yourselves? Do you fit it close then cut the slot in it before finally setting it and standing it flush?

 

[SmokepoleSam]

Always put antiseize on the threads. Some have a slot and some have an hex wrench hole(RMC) rmc makes a 5/16-24 and white lighting I think is 32tpi in all their sizes so I would put a slot in the WL liner. HTH

 

[smoothshooter]

More than likely the vent liner protrudes some into the barrel. Not a big deal there. Very possible there is a small burr or something obstructing the flash hole. First thing, take a drill bit that fits the hole and just push it through by hand and turn it a few times. That will clear out any burr. If you can tell the bit is going easily into the barrel cavity, then there should not be any interference from the breech plug. Use 4f for prime if you have it. I do not bank my prime in either direction but just lay a nice even line across the pan bottom from one end to the other. Load with a pick in the hole and then remove the pick. Those are my few tips, good luck!

I would not want the liner protruding into the bore.
I would do whatever it takes/cost to either replace or alter the liner.