Flash hole

[BCWILL]

Original Barnett .57 Pistol.
Platinum Liner ?

 

[KevinC]

Manton was very particular about his breech chambers. He was all about getting faster ignition, especially with his shotguns.
I had the privilege of going over a couple of Manton originals. They were amazing.
I have also seen brass lined pans, as well as precious metals in the touch holes and pans. Most all I have seen were high-end European guns.

 

[M. De Land]

Manton was very particular about his breech chambers. He was all about getting faster ignition, especially with his shotguns.
I had the privilege of going over a couple of Manton originals. They were amazing.
I have also seen brass lined pans, as well as precious metals in the touch holes and pans. Most all I have seen were high-end European guns.

Were the flash holes in these high end guns actually liners made and threaded of precious metal or where they just flash holes in the barrel wall with a rivet of precious metal swaged in to line the barrel wall vent ? The ones in the pictures look much larger than modern stainless vent liners.
I'm wondering how they plated holes with Gold or Platinum as the melting temperature of both is a good bit higher than any iron or steel used in gun construction. Was/is there a chemical process to plate with precious metal like chrome or nickle plateing ?

 

[le125verne]

This is an image of an 18th century internal touch hole coning tool. Internal coning was known and practiced.

View attachment 238899


The breech plug was removed, and the tool was inserted to turn the bur in the touch hole to make an internal cone.

Touch hole liners were not exactly common on top line English and other Continental rifles, but the gold and platinum liners were known. Touch hole liners do not show up on rifles and fowling guns made in North America. There was a carryover of the liners into the percussion age as it was believed that a vent was needed or the internal pressure from a percussion ignition could burst the barrel. Once it was sufficiently determined that barrels wouldn't burst, the practice of a percussion vent liner was discontinued.

Thank you for the picture. Of all the "old tools" I have salavated over, I have never seen this one. This picture is now burned into my mental "backboard". Happy hunting.

 

[KevinC]

Were the flash holes in these high end guns actually liners made and threaded of precious metal or where they just flash holes in the barrel wall with a rivet of precious metal swaged in to line the barrel wall vent ? The ones in the pictures look much larger than modern stainless vent liners.
I'm wondering how they plated holes with Gold or Platinum as the melting temperature of both is a good bit higher than any iron or steel used in gun construction. Was/is there a chemical process to plate with precious metal like chrome or nickle plateing ?

I do not know, I have never removed one. I would only be assuming if I gave an answer. But I'm sure they were not plated. As a guess, I would think they were alloy, like our gold tooth fillings to give added life.

 

[M. De Land]

I do not know, I have never removed one. I would only be assuming if I gave an answer. But I'm sure they were not plated. As a guess, I would think they were alloy, like our gold tooth fillings to give added life.

I sure am curious as to how they lined them back then. I'll do some googling and see what shows up ! Some one surely has to know what and how they did this back then

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Well I know, but nobody ever believes me.
The gold touch holes were made from 24K and riveted in, no threads involved. They had a parabolic taper on the inside and were drilled through after they were riveted in. I assume platinum may have been done the same way, but I'm not sure. I don't know how soft platinum is.....
Anyway, gold doesn't wear as fast as steel in this application, that's why they used it. The gold lined pans and frizzen were used to combat corrosion.

 

[Mulebrain]

Amazing they did vents with 24k! I have some 24k and its really soft and malleable

​

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Amazing they did vents with 24k! I have some 24k and its really soft and malleable

​

That's why they used it, easy to make a rivet.

 

[appalichian hunter]

Question, my wife collects Georgian period jewelry, most of it is 10 kt gold how available was 14 kt during the time period discusses. 10 kt is harder than 14 kt. is 14 kt used now because it is easier to source.

 

[M. De Land]

Well I know, but nobody ever believes me.
The gold touch holes were made from 24K and riveted in, no threads involved. They had a parabolic taper on the inside and were drilled through after they were riveted in. I assume platinum may have been done the same way, but I'm not sure. I don't know how soft platinum is.....
Anyway, gold doesn't wear as fast as steel in this application, that's why they used it. The gold lined pans and frizzen were used to combat corrosion.

Well I believe you as it was the only physical way I could think of for them to do this as I also mentioned a possible riveting process earlier.
I know both platinum and Gold melt about 400 degrees higher than does steel so I couldn't envision a brazing method but then began to wonder about how chrome and nickle are plated onto steel (electrolysis I think)or perhaps a chemical method.
I reasoned these guns were made and lined probably before electrolysis would have been understood ruling that process out for plating so it pretty much would have had to be a physical technique.
So if I understand this correctly a port in the shape of a parabolic taper was formed in the barrel side wall, a rivet of Gold or Platinum swaged in this cavity, struck off flush on the exterior, perhaps cupped on he interior and then the vent drilled in the precious metal insert ?

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Well I believe you as it was the only physical way I could think of for them to do this as I also mentioned a possible riveting process earlier.
I know both platinum and Gold melt about 400 degrees higher than does steel so I couldn't envision a brazing method but then began to wonder about how chrome and nickle are plated onto steel (electrolysis I think)or perhaps a chemical method.
I reasoned these guns were made and lined probably before electrolysis would have been understood ruling that process out for plating so it pretty much would have had to be a physical technique.
So if I understand this correctly a port in the shape of a parabolic taper was formed in the barrel side wall, a rivet of Gold or Platinum swaged in this cavity, struck off flush on the exterior, perhaps cupped on he interior and then the vent drilled in the precious metal insert ?

That's pretty much it.