Tumbler

[Mike in FL]

What is the tumbler in a flintlock? Yes, I disassembled the lock on my Colonial kit but did not ID each part by name or function. I ask because in another thread someone mentionEd tumblers were not used in the age of flintlocks. So:
1 - what is a tumbler?
2 - what does it do?
3 - did original locks not have them?
4 - if not, were those locks slower than today's?
5 - if they didn't exist then, do you feel like we are 'cheating' by using them?
6 - anyone got a picture or drawing to help me understand what a tumbler does?
I've been shooting flint locks for years but never thought about the guts of locks. I just figured they were the same as back then. Now I'm wondering if the almost instant ignition of a Kibler is inconsistent with high quality locks of 1700 - 1800 guns. I'd hate to think we have better guns now than those made by the master builders of the 'golden age.'.

 

[Larry (Omaha)]

Here ya go!
Tumbler is the control center of the lock, determines full cock, 1/2 cock, and full down throw by it's clock position.
Originals had them, can't say if a lock never had one
Hope this helps
Larry

 

[ZUG]

I don't know where you got that tumbler info, but it is the main part that makes the lock function - the rotating axle that the cock is mounted to and is powered by the mainspring.

 

[wiscoaster]

Hard for me to see the red arrows in the pic above, but it's (I think) pointed to by "AA" in the top pic, and it's under the piece pointed to by "P" (which is called the "bridal"). The tumbler has the notches that the sear engages for half-cock and full-cock. The cock is fitted to the tumbler so as the cock rotates, the tumbler also rotates, and that's how the spring-loaded sear engages it. The main spring puts pressure on the tumbler through a kind of a lever system called the "stirrup", "D" in the top photo, if I'm seeing it right, though it looks a little different there than the locks I've taken apart. The sear engaged in the tumbler notch holds the cock until the trigger engages the sear and lifts it out of the notch, which frees the tumbler to be rotated, along with its attached cock - by the mainspring pressure on it.

The principles aren't that difficult, what always amazes me is the intricacy of the machining involved. That they could make something like that back then without CNC!!

 

[smokeum54]

It's basically the heart of the lock, what your hammer/cock is attached to.

 

[sportster73hp]

Being the shaft that the hammer/ cock rotates on/with i would think all flintlock would need the tumbler. What article may have said or meant is that early flintlocks may not have a FLY which is recommended for any Muzzleloader with a set trigger to prevent the sear from dropping back into half cock.

 

[Larry (Omaha)]

I don't know where you got that tumbler info, but it is the main part that makes the lock function - the rotating axle that the cock is mounted to and is powered by the mainspring.

What I said is correct, Tumbler is the control center of the lock, determines full cock, 1/2 cock, and full down throw by it's clock position. I didn't say it was total value of the tumbler. Control center and your "main part" seems like we are both talking the same language. Thanks for adding good info.
Larry

 

[rafterob]

What I said is correct, Tumbler is the control center of the lock, determines full cock, 1/2 cock, and full down throw by it's clock position. I didn't say it was total value of the tumbler. Control center and your "main part" seems like we are both talking the same language. Thanks for adding good info.
Larry

I believe ZUG was commenting on the original poster, not your reply.

 

[Mike in FL]

I got it from a recent thread here, but it seems that person was incorrect. That's where I got confused, thinking original locks were different than today's. Thanks for getting me un-confused.

 

[ZUG]

I believe ZUG was commenting on the original poster, not your reply.

That is correct rafterrob ---

 

[sturmkatze]

What is the tumbler in a flintlock? Yes, I disassembled the lock on my Colonial kit but did not ID each part by name or function. I ask because in another thread someone mentionEd tumblers were not used in the age of flintlocks. So:
1 - what is a tumbler?
2 - what does it do?
3 - did original locks not have them?
4 - if not, were those locks slower than today's?
5 - if they didn't exist then, do you feel like we are 'cheating' by using them?
6 - anyone got a picture or drawing to help me understand what a tumbler does?
I've been shooting flint locks for years but never thought about the guts of locks. I just figured they were the same as back then. Now I'm wondering if the almost instant ignition of a Kibler is inconsistent with high quality locks of 1700 - 1800 guns. I'd hate to think we have better guns now than those made by the master builders of the 'golden age.'.

Push up position… begin.

 

[sturmkatze]

I'd hate to think we have better guns now than those made by the master builders of the 'golden age.'.

Of course we do. Without being nasty-mean, today, we have super-fine tolerances and better engineering. It's all good. Don't overthink this stuff.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Some early guns were made without bridles to support the tumbler, but all would have a tumbler.