Figure this out (please)

[Emet Huntsman]

When I first got my TC I was having the same problem. I could not shoot a pattern no matter how hard I tried. Then I noticed -- my rear sight had play in it! It would move ever so slightly with the recoil of each shot.
I changed it out and my groups tightened up.

 

[Tom Compton]

You can tighten an adjustable sight by using a spring from a click type ink pen cut to length (trial and error) on one side of the sight.

TC

 

[lonehunter]

Thanks for all the input from everyone, i was trying to get ideas from fresh minds and i thank you all :bow: :bow: this site is the best!!!
I have changed the sights, as suggested, ran up through the powder charges as suggested, tried FF as suggested, tried circle fly cards and felt wads, several lubes, patch material from .010-.022
swabbed between shots, not swabbed between shots.
starting to lean towards binding in the stock, shooter error (nut behind the butt) not ruling it out, but cant comprehend the two groups being as tight as they are, seems as tho it would be all over the place if it was human error, and no groups at all. I don't know but i will get another shooter to be sure. Thinking about treating it like a center fire, floating the barrel from the wedge forward and re bedding from the wedge to the tang. I WILL win this battle, have been wanting a .54 too long to give up. I will keep you posted as to any progress made.
Witnessed a colerain barrel that was doing similar, he was tired of fighting with it and replaced it with a rice, i may do the same eventually, but i need to figure this out so i can sleep at night, a rifle that is not accurate is nothing more than a stick that makes noise, and worthless to me.
thanks again!
James :v

 

[LRB]

Two things Lonehunter has not mentioned, is that this is a shallow groove 1-66 barrel. The grooves are no deeper than a standard T-C, and it is coned. It is acually a tad over coned, as if not careful the ball will twist the sprue a bit when loading. Just me, but for accuracy, I do not trust shallow groove, or coning, but his problem may lie elsewhere. I have shot the gun, very carefully bench rested, and got no better results than Lonehunter. If nothing else, Lonehunter has perseverance. He has burned much powder, and many balls with this rifle. I would have given up by now. Hell, I did on my Colrain. Thank God I did, I bought a Rice barrel, and now enjoy shooting again. Two outings on my range, and I had a winner.

 

[Many Klatch]

Wick, some of the oldtimer Chunk Gun shooters at Friendship used to swear by plugging the barrel, urinating down it and letting it stand full over night. Said it tightened up the barrel considerable. I don't know if it works or not but if all else fails I guess you could just p&%* on it. :grin:

Many Klatch

 

[rabjr]

Wick, some of the oldtimer Chunk Gun shooters at Friendship used to swear by plugging the barrel, urinating down it and letting it stand full over night. Said it tightened up the barrel considerable. I don't know if it works or not but if all else fails I guess you could just p&%* on it. :grin:

Many Klatch

Boy if that don't sound like something the old timers told to the new comers just to ruin their barrel or make it so it didn't shoot as well as it should have. I have to wonder if anyone actually saw an old timer do this.

 

[Skychief]

Lonehunter, Probably not the issue, but want to throw this out.

Have your range sessions taken place in partly sunny/ partly overcast conditions? :hmm:

Have you tried shaders over your sights to eliminate any glare?

:idunno: Skychief.

 

[lonehunter]

Yeah,forgot to mention about the shallow rifling, and coning, getting senile i guess, comes from hanging out with ole guys :haha:
I am in the process of sanding the barrel channel at the moment, not much, but, it is awful tight, takes a pretty good blow to get the barrel out. altho in theory that should be good, But i want to explore all options before i cut the end of the barrel off.
Perseverance :hmm: :idunno: More like not smart enough to know when to quit. :v

Hey, Skychief! Yes i have set up shade for the sights, weather, well, its always the same, HOT!
Actually Wick made one of the finest rear sights i have ever had. And we replaced the front site with a very nice blade. Great sight picture, best i own. The sights are best thing about this rifle at the moment.
Thanks for your input!!!
Actually :v

 

[RJR]

Wick, Not meaning to question you, but my GM .54 barrel is 1 in 70 twist with .010 to .012 rifleing. Very visably deeper than standard TC or Lyman shallow groove. Is it possible this is a faster twist conical barrel with shallow grooves?

 

[lonehunter]

Wick, some of the oldtimer Chunk Gun shooters at Friendship used to swear by plugging the barrel, urinating down it and letting it stand full over night. Said it tightened up the barrel considerable. I don't know if it works or not but if all else fails I guess you could just p&%* on it. :grin:

Many Klatch

Boy if that don't sound like something the old timers told to the new comers just to ruin their barrel or make it so it didn't shoot as well as it should have. I have to wonder if anyone actually saw an old timer do this.

:rotf: :rotf: Swampy, you want pictures? :rotf: :rotf: Im gettin old, and running out of options! :haha:

 

[rabjr]

Wick, some of the oldtimer Chunk Gun shooters at Friendship used to swear by plugging the barrel, urinating down it and letting it stand full over night. Said it tightened up the barrel considerable. I don't know if it works or not but if all else fails I guess you could just p&%* on it. :grin:

Many Klatch

Boy if that don't sound like something the old timers told to the new comers just to ruin their barrel or make it so it didn't shoot as well as it should have. I have to wonder if anyone actually saw an old timer do this.

:rotf: :rotf: Swampy, you want pictures? :rotf: :rotf: Im gettin old, and running out of options! :haha:

Ehh no I'll pass. :haha: Was just a thought! :wink:

 

[lonehunter]

Nope just double checked, looks like 1/60 :v

 

[lonehunter]

Oops, typo, 1/66 twist :v

 

[RJR]

Lonehunter, double check the manufacturer of the barrel, GM .54s have always been 1 in 70 on their IBS barrels. Could it be a TC round ball barrel or an Oregon barrel?

 

[lonehunter]

Its a GM, probably is 1/70. i did the ole flag on the ramrod, get it to turn 1/4 turn, measure and multiply x 4. trick. kept getting different measurements,BUT,they all equaled over 60 inches. that's not the most accurate way to check, but its fairly close. I could have been off a little bit, just wanted to be sure it was not 1/48.
Thanks :v

 

[paulvallandigham]

Your jag/patch is not thick enough. Either use a thicker patch, or double up on the patches, so they stay in the grooves. It takes a Light Touch on the rod to pull the rod out, without preventing the rod from turning immediately in the grooves. OIL the patches heavily before driving them down the barrel. That way, they " Stick" in the grooves, but the amount of friction in the barrel does not cause problems with the rod moving out.

When I measure ROT, I do it several times, unless I already know what the ROT is for a particular barrel. It takes about 3xs doing this before you get the right touch, and then you need to try it again at least 2 more times( total 5 or 6) before you can be confident of the results.

If your jag and patch combinations don't work, Try using a bore brush pushing an oiled cleaning patch(s) to do this measuring. The bristles hold the fabric, and stick through the fabric to get down into the corners of the grooves, and hold the patch(s) in place.

See the article on measuring ROT under the Member's Forum, under "Articles" on the index page to this forum. :hatsoff:

 

[tjohnson56]

You didn't by chance get new glasses did you? I got new Bi-focals and couldn't hit the south end of a bull with a bucket of rice till I forgot to put them on after checking the target with field glasses. Soon as I shot without the glasses my group got much better.

Maybe have someone else shoot the gun or try a different gun and see if it's you or the gun. :idunno:

 

[hanshi]

Hmmm... :hmm: . I don't think there's anything that hasn't been covered in these posts. Might be time to give some thought to the old "black cat bones in an east flowing stream under a full moon" thing. Or at least consult a juju man. :idunno:

 

[lonehunter]

From what direction do you throw the cat bones? And at what angle? :haha:

I sanded on the stock, think i have taken the binding possibility out of the equation, fits very well now, snug but will come out with a lot less effort.
Next will be to remove the portion of barrel that has been coned, If that does not work, i will order a rice barrel and be done!

I would like to take this time to thank EVERYONE that has responded to this thread, all suggestions are appreciated. That is what sets this sport apart from all others, The generosity shown on this forum is amazing in the world we live in today! Thank you all! :bow: :bow: :v

lonehunter
Hanshi, I did consult a juju man! He goes by the name of Wick! :stir:

 

[aeatwood]

When you are ready to give up, saw the barrel off short enough to eliminate the cone and re-crown it.

If it shoots, then worry about re-shuffling the ramrod pipes to make it look ok.

I have an identical barrel, and shallow grooves and all it will drop 5 shots into less than 2" at 100 yards. It acts like it wants to do better, but that is the limit of my eyesight. I can usually do 1 or 2 groups like that a day, and then my eyes get tired.

Getting old stinks - better than the alternative, however.