Burning Embers

[APG]

I've gotten into making paper cartridges for my Pedersoli 1861 Springfield muzzleloading rifle. A lubed minieball with 55 grains of 2fg power. So I'm loading and firing faster than I would be measuring each load. So I'm kind of concerned that I maybe pouring powder into a barrel with smoldering embers. Has anyone experienced a powder flash doing this? I know they did load quickly when they were using this in our Civil War. But they had other concerns than some powder going off prematurely. So just wondering if anybody has had the powder going off when loading quickly? Thanks.

 

[ADK Bigfoot]

In twelve years of N-SSA team shooting, I had one "cook off." It was an incredibly hot day, the team I had been "farmed out" to was going full relays. I had never fired that fast for so long before. On about shot 15, my powder charge went "POOF" as I dumped it down the barrel. My palm was singed and it stung pretty good. I still carry a fleck or two of unburnt powder in my right middle finger to remind me.

ADK Bigfoot

 

[ord sgt]

While practicing for an upcoming regional match, I was speed loading when I experienced a "cook off". Dumping the premeasured charge of FFFg from a tube, the powder landed on a burning ember. It's a rather curious sight to see flames erupting from the barrel and going between my fingers. Never did find the plastic tube that held the powder.

 

[hanshi]

I never, repeat, never, load anything close to quickly. For one thing I'm as slow as warm tar. Any time I get in a hurry I start dropping stuff and that goes for everything needed to load a muzzleloader. I don't have to worry about attacks from any tribes of "First Peoples" or angry redcoats. And I would never - Heaven forbid - shoot at a grizzly.

 

[APG]

So what I'm getting out of your replies is it happens, not often and it's not going blow my hand off. I'm not speed loading by any means. I just don't want to wait several minutes or run a wet patch down the bore. Thanks for the replies.

 

[Scota@4570]

" So I'm kind of concerned that I maybe pouring powder into a barrel with smoldering embers."

If you are using the paper cartridge for wadding the concern is valid. It may not go off when you dump the powder, what happens if it lights when you are ramming the bullet?

I would not ram the paper cartridge with the ball, unless I wiped between shots. Then, what is the point of ramming the paper?

I do not wipe between shot all the time. I do not think it is necessary from a safety standpoint.

 

[user 36911]

I swab between shots. I'm forced to not load too fast.

 

[APG]

" So I'm kind of concerned that I maybe pouring powder into a barrel with smoldering embers."

If you are using the paper cartridge for wadding the concern is valid. It may not go off when you dump the powder, what happens if it lights when you are ramming the bullet?

I would not ram the paper cartridge with the ball, unless I wiped between shots. Then, what is the point of ramming the paper?

I do not wipe between shot all the time. I do not think it is necessary from a safety standpoint.

I am using no wadding of any type. I'm shooting Minieballs which need no patch, wad or any thing like that.

 

[dave951]

In years of reenacting and in N-SSA competition, I’ve ad precisely one cook off. That would be in hundreds of thousands of shots, only once. Keep shooting and quit worrying

 

[hawkeye2]

I've skirmished for 35+ years and my wife for 25+ and neither of us have had a cook off. I've had the gun so hot once I had to put a rag through the top sling swivel to hold it while I loaded, no problem. I've seen cook offs, never an injury and one occurred while pouring powder in for the first shot after a 10 minute interval between relays.

 

[user 36911]

In years of reenacting and in N-SSA competition, I’ve ad precisely one cook off. That would be in hundreds of thousands of shots, only once. Keep shooting and quit worrying

It only takes once to blow your hand off or maybe kill you.

I still look both ways when crossing the street. Even though i've never been hit by a car/truck.

 

[Juice Jaws]

That's why I blow down the barrel. I know, I know, but I do it.

 

[user 36911]

That's why I blow down the barrel. I know, I know, but I do it.

I never considered that unsafe. I do it too. I don't do it to put out embers though.

 

[sawyer04]

That's why I blow down the barrel. I know, I know, but I do it.

I blow down the barrel also, just the way I have seen old timers, I wonder if years ago there was more of a chance of glowing embers because of powder and patch material used at that time.

 

[simonbeans]

To help explain how N-SSA skirmishers shoot their muskets with minie balls, or at least when I was a member decades ago, we would use a tube, cardboard or plastic to hold both the powder and the minie. The minie was removed and the powder poured into the barrel from the tube, which was NOT inserted into the barrel. It was just dropped to the ground. The minie was inserted and rammed down. Cap, aim and shoot. I saw one shooter from a PA unit who was tall and using a Zouve, shoot 7-8 rounds a minute. His arms were so long and the musket barrel short enough he could ram the minie home with one stroke. Never put the tube or if you use some paper down the barrel with a minie.

 

[HatchetJack95]

I'd say as long as you're not loading straight from the horn you should be safe. While ramming down your ball it helps to grip the ramrod between your fingers and your thumb instead of slamming it with your palm, because if the powder did go off, it would put the ramrod through your hand. Never seen it happen, but there you go

 

[dave951]

I never considered that unsafe. I do it too. I don't do it to put out embers though.

That is HUGELY unsafe. Think this through. When the gun is fired, it becomes a very low oxygen environment. Remove cap, blow down the barrel etc and you've added oxygen that could allow an ember to flare hot enough for a cook-off.

Again, after hundreds of thousands of rounds fired both blanks and live, the ONE cook-off I had was traced back to improper cleaning by the person I loaned the gun to previously. Properly clean and maintain the gun and a cook-off is extremely remote. Life is not completely risk free. You could also be struck by lightning or a meteor on the firing line. Quit worrying and shoot and have fun

 

[user 36911]

That is HUGELY unsafe. Think this through. When the gun is fired, it becomes a very low oxygen environment. Remove cap, blow down the barrel etc and you've added oxygen that could allow an ember to flare hot enough for a cook-off.

Again, after hundreds of thousands of rounds fired both blanks and live, the ONE cook-off I had was traced back to improper cleaning by the person I loaned the gun to previously. Properly clean and maintain the gun and a cook-off is extremely remote. Life is not completely risk free. You could also be struck by lightning or a meteor on the firing line. Quit worrying and shoot and have fun

I don't get what you're trying to say? The gun is fired. Cap is removed if it's a caplock. Blow down bore to add some moisture to the fouling but mostly to see smoke come out the nipple or touch-hole. I then swab and load.

Where's the danger?

 

[Whitworth]

That is HUGELY unsafe. Think this through. When the gun is fired, it becomes a very low oxygen environment. Remove cap, blow down the barrel etc and you've added oxygen that could allow an ember to flare hot enough for a cook-off

That's got me thinking, is it truly a low oxygen environment? Is all the oxygen from the breakdown of the Saltpeter consumed in the combustion process? If so why would an ember continue to glow? The old Science class test for oxygen with a glowing splint and seeing if flares up or grows brighter when stuck in a smoky bore would be an interesting test. Perhaps the jet of gas blasting out of the muzzle leaves behind a low pressure condition that the atmosphere rushes in to fill and thus sustains the ember? YMMV

 

[dave951]

I don't get what you're trying to say? The gun is fired. Cap is removed if it's a caplock. Blow down bore to add some moisture to the fouling but mostly to see smoke come out the nipple or touch-hole. I then swab and load.

Where's the danger?

Blowing down the bore introduces oxygen. There is enough O2 remaining in your expelled breath to support combustion. Carbon Monoxide and Dioxide are both heavier than air. Remove the cap and they flow out just like water when cleaning the barrel with clean air flowing in from the muzzle. Introduce air with oxygen by whatever means and an ember certainly can flare.

You mentioned swabbing then loading. When doing that, it about doesn't matter if you like blowing down the muzzle cause you're wiping the bore. In N-SSA competition shooting minies, we never wipe or swab between shots. The minie bullet was designed to nearly eliminate that need. I've gone over 60 shots straight without wiping and no loss of accuracy and more importantly no cook-off. Casual plinking or shooting PRB is a different critter.