Black Powder Banned at my Gun Club!

[Brazos John]

We had a fire at the Come and Take It Reenactment at Gonzales, Texas, last year.

Last year in Gonzales, Texas, at the Come and Take It Festival, during the skirmish reenactment, a wad (that shouldn't have been loaded!) started a tiny fire. A couple of Texas Army militia went out, one stomped on the fire, and it splashed like stomping in a puddle! Others ran out, and we started pouring our canteens on the fire, to no avail.
We waved to the spectators, and yelled to bring water bottles. The volunteer militia (spectators) responded, and we got the 20' diameter fire extinguished.
The funniest part of this was, just a few hours earlier, we were in the parade with fire trucks from a dozen different near-by communities, but none of the trucks were here for the skirmish fire.

It can certainly happen.
Murphy says that you'll have an audience when it happens!

 

[Terrier]

Having carpet in front of a shooting position is just careless on the part of whomever runs that place. It's a collection point for unburnt powder, plain and simple, and a fire waiting to happen. Someone must've had a hidden agenda and wanted the BP smoke to go away and was just waiting for an excuse.

I'm very happy and feel lucky that I have my own 200 yard range off my front porch.

 

[Flintlock Whiskey]

Black Powder has been banned on our Club Range until further notice. A shooter on the Public Range started a fire with his 1860 Colt Replica Revolver. It was a Freak accident as indicated by his explanation. It wasn’t real grass but the Astroturf in front of the Firing Line. Maybe they should have concrete or bare dirt instead of something flammable. This is the second burn mark since the first of the year. I don't believe the first one was caused by a Muzzleloader.

“I feel really bad about what happened at the range, I hate to be the guy that got black powder banned. As near as I could tell, the fire was the result of a percussion cap hitting the "grass" in front of the shooting positions. I saw the fire start and signaled the range master. The fire moved fast (I'm sure you've sen the damage). I was shooting from a standing position, .44 ball, 25 grains of powder and a lubed wad, nothing unusual and pretty sure I hit the target. Anyway, that's the basics - if there is anything else I can tell you just let me know.”

I’m hoping that the Board comes to its senses and removes the Ban. Otherwise, I’m going to have to join another Club a little further north.

Walt

I personally don't know the parties involved, but the astroturf is kind of a stupid idea at a gun range.

 

[Flintlock Whiskey]

Murphy says that you'll have an audience when it happens!

In my experiences, Mr. Murphy is a bastard!

 

[pajeepman]

Had one of our members start a fire a couple of times. Seems he was shooting old military ammo. (tracers)
He watches what ammo he shoots now.

Happened at a range near Dayton, Ohio. Now they have a sign saying no tracers. From what I heard it caught tires on fire at the far end of the range. I know BP can't be used at the indoor ranges near me(probably normal anywhere). I need to check I to a few local rod and gun clubs to see about shooting BP there.

 

[BP Addict]

Be aware, as others mentioned, that even the by-products of the combustion process from 'modern' arms can be the source of a fire. I agree that they should remove the carpet.

Likely they something 'relatively clean' there to pick up spent brass that falls forward of the shooting line more easily. If that happened at my Club, I'd get together with other BP Shooters and lay a skim0oat of self leveling epoxy concrete or similar there ...

You are correct! The carpet is easier to pick up fired brass from and was cheaper than concrete.

One of the Board members suggested vacuuming the carpet until the rains come back. I was like, huh? It never occurred to me that unburnt Smokeless Powder would accumulate on the carpet creating a Fire Hazard. That explains why it started so quickly!

Thanks!

Walt

 

[TFoley]

I think this one near me has a huge initiation fee like that.
Bench Rest Rifle Club of St. Louis
But, I will say that no one else has a 1000 yard range that close to town...
Usually at clubs with an initiation fee like that you become a vested owner of the real estate and a member of a corporation rather than just a dues paying member with usage rights.

Only 1000 yards? Oh dear. We have a goodly number of ranges longer than that here in crowded little UK, and for $10,000 you could shoot at one of our popular 4000m ranges - calibres up to 40mm - every day for 200 days.

 

[XVIIc Wheelock]

Our range just banned shooting B/P in their excellent outdoor facility, even when instruction, etc. is not in session. When asked, they gave no reason, just "that's the way it is now". Big let down for our group. They banned indoor B/P shooting years ago..."clogs up their exhaust filtering system" (that maybe I could understand).
https://www.mountaincreekrange.com/

 

[waksupi]

Modern rifles using slow burning powders have a lot of unburnt ejecta. I learned that from shooting at my bench rest with snow on the ground. Much more likely to have started their fire.

 

[Felix the Cat]

This has nothing to with Black Powder.. it is very rare that BP is ever ejected in an unburned state. The flying particles seen coming out of BP guns are usually burning residue, not powder.

Most nitro powder guns eject unburned propellent, particularly those overloaded with slow powder. The pressure drop at the muzzle as the bullet exits can cause powder grains to extinguish.

BP breaks down quickly in the presence of moisture. Even in hot dry climates, morning dew is enough to cause breakdown. Nitro powder is pretty much waterproof.

Range designs that use absorbent coverings for range floors to reduce noise have to ensure that it can be cleared of propellent debris. Normally noise mitigating rough surfaces should start several meters from the firing line.

A vacuum cleaner used to sweep up explosive residue has a tendency, unless it is especially designed to do so, of repurposing itself into a short life span turbojet engine..!

I suggest your range management team need to go back to school!

 

[Johnny Tremain]

TOO MUCH POWDER

Davenport Formula would have kept that range open.

 

[ord sgt]

One of the Board members suggested vacuuming the carpet

And this is one of the board members? Vacuuming any gun powder is a huge mistake. No way, Jose.
The outdoor carpet was/is a poor decision. It does catch any unburned powder, as you found to be the case.
At my R/P club, on the pistol range, we have smooth plastic sheets to catch any errant brass cases from going into the dirt. These sheets are exposed to the weather and get rinsed every rainstorm. It helps that they slope away from the firing line.

Many years ago, my local M/L dealer decided to hold a bp match at an indoor range. Many problems arose, as one might guess. The exhaust fans were overwhelmed with too much white smoke by the first volley of the match.
After the smoke cleared, another shot sent burning bits of powder into the stress seams, igniting the residual smokeless power that was swept there. We had to wait for the powder to burn off before continuing the match.

 

[Collie]

Please tell me that's a typo.

Here in UK our gun club outdoor range, whilst only having a 8-point 100m range, a 6-point 50m range, and a six-point electric target 25m outdoors, and two four-point 25m indoor ranges, I pay £200 PA.

No range fees. No joining fees, either.

For that, I can shoot seven days a week on the outdoor range - anything that is range legal [up to 75cal BP and 3500fps and 7500J unmentionables], and four evenings a week indoors - up to .45cal BP, and pistol calibre unmentionables.

We also have twelve guest days a year and pre-booked visits to Bisley NRA shooting centre.

...and archery.

Oh, and evening shooting on the outdoor ranges until the light-meter clicks the red light to 'ON'.

Of our >450 membership, at least a quarter are NRA-qualified RCOs, and we have two importers of foreign firearms in the membership [one for DesertTech], as well as three rifle-builders for TR and F-TR.

We currently have a waiting list of around fifty would-be shooters...we find that we get a fall-off of about ten a year, due to 'natural wastage', but many more wanting to join in.

Unfortunately it's not a typo. The Dallas Gun Club actually has those prices posted on their site. There aren't any really good public ranges nearby either

 

[Frontier's]

Lol who puts artificial grass in front of a shooting range? Must have been one of them book smart people in charge.

 

[Cvkotvkse]

Only 1000 yards? Oh dear. We have a goodly number of ranges longer than that here in crowded little UK, and for $10,000 you could shoot at one of our popular 4000m ranges - calibres up to 40mm - every day for 200 days.

And that is without being in HRM's service at the time?

Only 1000 yards? Oh dear. We have a goodly number of ranges longer than that here in crowded little UK, and for $10,000 you could shoot at one of our popular 4000m ranges - calibres up to 40mm - every day for 200 days.

 

[Frontier's]

By the way, you should post this gun ranges contact info so we all can send an educated email or phone call to them.

 

[Wawyasto]

B.S.

Unburnt powder from tens of thousands of rounds and hundreds of shooters collects in astroturf. Enough that something hot touches and lights it off.



Range needs to wash down their filthy range with water once in awhile and lift the idiotic ban, but good luck explaining to the FUDDs that poor maintenance caused it.

 

[Sir Boniface Harrison]

At my club we have a fire hose for ready use. Even though we have had temperatures as high as 102f, and on one occasion one of my patches was left smouldering on the dry grass, no one has suggested that BP be banned (there's only me and two other guys use BP anyway). The smouldering patch was quickly extinguished with no harm caused. Astroturf?? Words fail me...

 

[Old-Duckman]

This new rule sucks and hopefully they'll come to their senses and remove it. At least you have a club you can shoot at. The only club near me has a whopping $10,000 initiation fee and a $195 monthly fee to join.

Those fees are insane!

 

[Howard Pippin]

That’s crazy? What kind of maxi state is that?

There's not many good reasons living as isolated as we are in parts of Montana, but you sure gave me a good one here. We have a local range about a mile from town, pretty primitive the toilet is pretty crude, the sun shade isn't big but the range does go to 1057 yards with target stands at 100, 200, 300, 400, and 500. The next step is 1057 yards. Most of the time when you go you're by yourself, there are only about 3 club events all year. The dues are $20 a year.
Squint