Which Revolver?

[Mogadishu Meanderer]

https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index...odel+Army+Revolver+-+Oversize+frame+and+grips

But… but…. But…this one is Made in ‘Murrica!!!!

 

[wiscoaster]

But… but…. But…this one is Made in ‘Murrica!!!!

I like your spare mags, errr.... cylinders pouch.

 

[45D]

Reliable only pertains to one cap n ball revolver.

The Ruger Old Army.

They're twice the price of the Italian pieces but they're ten times the gun.

Not necessarily, I've worked on quite a few!! They can have ignition problems as well as collapsed springs, worn plungers, throw-by issues, timing issues . . . they aren't without blemish . . .
Oh!! AND because of the silly "holes instead of a ratchet" system, no Gated conversion available. THAT would have definitely given it the most "versatile revolver ever made" but . . .

As far as reliability, switching from flat springs to coils will give the same reliability as a Ruger. A Remington changed to 100% coils is nothing but a 19th century Ruger!!

15 years actually. Ruger’s son didn’t see the return on investment to produce them because nowadays is all about the pennies, not the customer base. But on the other hand the Colt 1860 has been out of production for 135 years longer than the Ruger and plenty of makers have made repros to fill the nostalgia need. May be in 2108, on the anniversary of the production cessation someone will have the great idea of making a repro of the ROA to honor the best C&B revolver ever produced… and they will all be 5.5”bbl with beveled and deeper chambers, fixed sight, bright Stainless with mother of pearl grips Don’t think many of us will be around to see it, but, day dreaming is free!!

It won't be THAT long . . .

Mike

 

[Crow Choker]

Well, I mentioned the 1860 Army in my other post (#14), did so as I is one of the most popular, graceful, thought of, and if tuned and run right, one of the most reliable. It is a 44 and the OP did advise he wanted a 44. Ifin a 36 was wanted, either the '51 or '61 Navy. As I mentioned, if not familiar with the different models/manufactured cap and ball revolvers, find someone or a group of shooters where all are to be found and handle em, see what fits ya, maybe you could shoot them.

As mentioned the Ruger Old Army is the strongest of the bunch, more reliable, and for the most part doesn't need much tweaking if any, but historical wise they don't fit into anything from the 1800's. They do cost more and will hold their value if taken care of. I love mine, but its not my favorite. As I mentioned in my other post, my Colt Dragoons are my favorites, with the 2nd Model taking first place, guess since it was my first Dragoon. If the weight is no issue, maybe get a Dragoon, but if you were to get one without trying a '60 Army or Remington you may be discouraged at the weight and need to seek something else. I like the looks of the Colts over anything else, but that's just my opinion. Others think the Remington is nicer looking.

I like my Remington's, not my favorites by any means, but they are nice revolvers. They do have a different feel to them in hand and shooting vs the Colts and Ruger, so that's why if just starting out trying what is available is the best route. Some shooters say they can't get used to a Colt after shooting a Remington and vice versa. Yep, there is a different feel, but it doesn't bother me. After several shots one or the other fits like an old pair of boots. I can go from one to the other "with equal enthusiasm" as Sim Carstairs of Outlaw Josey Wales fame mentioned while ferrying Josey across a river singing whatever popular songs were of Union or Confederate popularity, depending on his customers affiliation.

 

[45D]

Well, I mentioned the 1860 Army in my other post (#14), did so as I is one of the most popular, graceful, thought of, and if tuned and run right, one of the most reliable. It is a 44 and the OP did advise he wanted a 44. Ifin a 36 was wanted, either the '51 or '61 Navy. As I mentioned, if not familiar with the different models/manufactured cap and ball revolvers, find someone or a group of shooters where all are to be found and handle em, see what fits ya, maybe you could shoot them.

As mentioned the Ruger Old Army is the strongest of the bunch, more reliable, and for the most part doesn't need much tweaking if any, but historical wise they don't fit into anything from the 1800's. They do cost more and will hold their value if taken care of. I love mine, but its not my favorite. As I mentioned in my other post, my Colt Dragoons are my favorites, with the 2nd Model taking first place, guess since it was my first Dragoon. If the weight is no issue, maybe get a Dragoon, but if you were to get one without trying a '60 Army or Remington you may be discouraged at the weight and need to seek something else. I like the looks of the Colts over anything else, but that's just my opinion. Others think the Remington is nicer looking.

I like my Remington's, not my favorites by any means, but they are nice revolvers. They do have a different feel to them in hand and shooting vs the Colts and Ruger, so that's why if just starting out trying what is available is the best route. Some shooters say they can't get used to a Colt after shooting a Remington and vice versa. Yep, there is a different feel, but it doesn't bother me. After several shots one or the other fits like an old pair of boots. I can go from one to the other "with equal enthusiasm" as Sim Carstairs of Outlaw Josey Wales fame mentioned while ferrying Josey across a river singing whatever popular songs were of Union or Confederate popularity, depending on his customers affiliation.

Pretty much agree! The downfall for me with the ROA is the cylinder length (unmentionable) which pretty much dictates "standard" length. With the Dragoons "fixed", the longer cylinder ( again, unmentionable) has room for 300gr + heavyweight bullets. Though heavy ( the ROA is heavy!), the Dragoon is the " King of the hill" loaded with "energetic" ammo!!

Mike

 

[CaptainVane]

Wasnt get involved cause its all opinion therefore no one is wrong.
I had always liked the Rem hence when i became fortunate with enuff disposal income the first i bought was my 58 Rem in .36. Very shortly after I bought a 51 Colt .36.
And honestly…. I love the Colt more. Something about knocking out the wedge to disassemble. The Rem feels more modern. The Colt feels more period correct. The Rem stays on my dresser as a display queen that i love and wont ever sell.
But when i go to range to blast lead, its the Colt that goes with me.

 

[beardedhorse]

Good advice on trying before buying. My .44 caliber Uberti 1858 New Model Army Remington is a stainless steel target model well tuned with new springs and fitting. Like shooting it immensely except the sights are stainless and not black like the stainless Ruger Old Army. Have to paint them with fingernail polish. Ruger target sights come black and are easier to see. The Ruger is.45 caliber, not .44. More massive cylinder and can be loaded with heavier charge.
I'd choose the Old Army for those needing larger grips and heavier revolver. It has been the one to beat in cap and ball matches where a modern looking revolver is permitted. Those used to shooting the unmentionable Super Blackhawk will feel right at home with the Old Army. Used ones are in the $800.00 range. Not that hard to find on used gun sites but tend to be snapped up quickly.
The smaller and lighter New Model Army is good for those with smaller hands. Found a new in box Pieta New Model Army by private owner for less than $300.00 but it is blued and the rear sight is a groove on the top strap and not adjustable. I find Remingtons more fun to shoot. From a bench, accuracy is comparable between my Ruger and Uberti target revolvers. The Remington is a great grouse gun when hunting muzzle loading season. Prefer it to Pieta made versions. Have been warned to be cautious of non Uberti or Pieta versions of the Remington. And avoid cheap brass frame knock offs.
Fired caps can jam in the Remington but not a common occurrence. Swaged .457 round balls by Hornady for the .45 caliber Ruger. about $22.11 per 100) are harder to find at the stores than the .454's ($18.99) recommended for the .44 Remington. That is why I have Lyman molds for both. Don't use .451 round balls in the Old Army. CCI, Remington size #11 caps work on either depending on nipple size. I favor RWS #1075 but having trouble finding these more expensive caps.
I personally prefer Remingtons over the Colts without a top strap. The Remington is the simplest and easiest to remove its cylinder. A current popular fad was inspired by the movie Pale Rider, to have spare loaded cylinders but not advised by some for capped percussion ones. They are quicker to reload than reloading from scratch but then so are spare loaded revolvers (ala The Outlaw Josey Wales) Clint was using cylinders with center fire cartridges in the Pale Rider Remington conversion.
Cimmaron or another company sells Remington with both kinds of cylinders. Might have to go through a FFL dealer to get the cartridge conversion.
The Ruger has separate parts in the loading lever and cylinder pin that could get lost and you have to have a screw driver to rotate a locking screw to align its notch right before removing the cylinder.

 

[45D]

The Ruger is.45 caliber, not .44. More massive cylinder and can be loaded with heavier charge.

The Ruger has separate parts in the loading lever and cylinder pin that could get lost and you have to have a screw driver to rotate a locking screw to align its notch right before removing the cylinder.

Actually, the ".44" Open-top and Remington platforms are .45s as well ( so they're all. 45's) which is why 45C - 45acp conversions work so well in them.

And!!!! I forgot ( thanks!!) about the "puzzle piece" loading lever the ROA has!! It's a PITA!!!! ( another "flaw" in best c&b ever made !!! )

Mike

 

[Mogadishu Meanderer]

Not necessarily, I've worked on quite a few!! They can have ignition problems as well as collapsed springs, worn plungers, throw-by issues, timing issues . . . they aren't without blemish . . .
Oh!! AND because of the silly "holes instead of a ratchet" system, no Gated conversion available. THAT would have definitely given it the most "versatile revolver ever made" but . . .

As far as reliability, switching from flat springs to coils will give the same reliability as a Ruger. A Remington changed to 100% coils is nothing but a 19th century Ruger!!



It won't be THAT long . . .

Mike

May be on the 20th anniversary 45D will start making them beauties, I read he is pretty crafty and skillful making such things!!! LOL, if you start, I will buy one, May be two. But they have to be as I specified.

 

[45D]

May be on the 20th anniversary 45D will start making them beauties, I read he is pretty crafty and skillful making such things!!! LOL, if you start, I will buy one, May be two. But they have to be as I specified.

Nope, not me

 

[Bad Karma]

Regarding grip size, I learned to shoot single-action revolvers by curling my little finger under the bottom strap. This keeps your hand from riding up the grip with repetitive shots. It keeps your hand in one place on the grip, which aids consistent shooting. It was my understanding that the Navy-sized grips, including on the Model P unmentionable, were designed and intended to be shot this way. The longer grip frame of the Colt M1860 Army revolver may enable some folks to get all their fingers on it, but you actually lose some stability that way, which may be the reason Colt went back to the Navy-sized grip for the later Model P.

If you feel a revolver’s grip frame is too small for your hands, this technique may be worth a try.

However, the 1860 Colt was a very popular gun on the frontier, and it continued to be issued well into the 1870’s. People must have liked that longer grip. Benteen sent a report to the Ordnance Department stating that the “cylinder spring” (probably the hand spring) of the Remington revolvers frequently got out of order. The chief complaint with the Colt was not really about the revolver, but about the ammunition for it. For their cap and ball revolvers, the troopers were issued paper cartridges that would open up and spill powder when jostled.

Notchy Bob

Good post. I curl my pinky under the bottom of the grip on the Army too. I‘ve used the Army grip on model P’s for years and the Super Blackhawk on any Ruger. I’m not a huge man, 6’2 and until recently about 215, but my hands are really big, wide and square. Most firearms are made with average people in mind. Of course

How long has the Ruger Old Army been out of production?
20yrs? 25?

not sure I own any revolver newer than that. I have a feeling I’m not alone in this. Also, I’m noticing the prices on Old Armies are slipping a bit. Still expensive but much more reasonable for what they are.

 

[Bad Karma]

Nope, not me

@Rich44 might be our man!

 

[45D]

@Rich44 might be our man!

Nope . . . not that I know of anyway . . .

Mike

 

[Bad Karma]

Nope . . . not that I know of anyway . . .

Mike

I doubt he’s entertained the idea. Just seems to have the talent to pull it off…

 

[45D]

I doubt he’s entertained the idea. Just seems to have the talent to pull it off…

I'm sure he probably does!! Several CNC's will make things easier though!!

Mike

 

[ZUG]

Getting back to the OP question here is my take on it:
For my FIRST BP revolver I would pick the Remington 1858 made by either Italian manufacture. My second BP revolver would be the 1851 Colt style revolver in either .36 or .44 caliber made by either Italian manufacture. Yes - I know there were no .44 caliber 1851s, but they are nice plus they are less weight than a .36 caliber gun. I would only buy a steel framed revolver - just me and it's my opinion.

 

[Trot]

Get the one you like, I don't think it matters if it's your first or not. They all have their little idiosyncrasies, but nothing hard. Just get what you like and go at it!

 

[necchi]

https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index...odel+Army+Revolver+-+Oversize+frame+and+grips

have you ever touched one? If so, how is it different? The description is vague,,,
Anyone else know anything about this "over-size" offering?

 

[Johnny Tremain]

The only problem I have with the 1851 is that it never was 44.
I got a 1860 Pietta given to me. Never fired. Had a bad wedge for the factory.
Shoots like the dickens now. So Im biased.

 

[M. De Land]

My youngest son, received a 36 cal Pietta as a present from a buddy of mine. He turned around and bought a 44 cal for #2 son so they could shoot together.

Then a bunch of stuff happened we won't go into. The bottom line is that I was going to get a black powder revolver to shoot with my sons, and the project fell by the wayside.

I'm looking for suggestions on a first BP revolver. I'd like to stay in the 44-45 cal range. I'd like a reliable gun that's fun to shoot.

Any ideas?

I'd go whole hog and buy a Walker, I'm sure having fun with mine and I already have four others !