Traditional ML Season Support Base.

[canyonman]

Amen to that. eace:

Larry

 

[Blue Smoke]

well i posted on 2 modern muzzle loading fourms if they would be intrested in such said primitive season.Yes they would.if your guys are serious about getting more people involved in the growth of traditional muzzle loading and a primitive season maybe we sould really consider that the future lies with those that hunt with a muzzle loader already.If we could figuare out a way somehow that all muzzle loader hunters could come together i think traditional muzzle loading would see a real growth for years to come.I think if a nation wide pole was done on all the hunting forums and gun forums i think you would see an over wheelming support for such said season if it dosnt take away from what is already on the books.the support is out there,its just how are we going to round up that support for the state legistures to consider?
or are you guys really not intrested at all?

Hey buckknife why don't you make up your mind?
buckknife
enthusiast


Reged: Jun 28 2003
Posts: 208
Loc: Iowa Re: In-Lines "Cheapen" your hunt... [Re: Twanger]
#402705 - Fri Jul 25 2003 02:49 PM Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply



I dont think a inline cheapens the hunt in any way.I own both inline and sidelock and hunt with both.
what is a tradtional hunting weapon?Whos to say.
Many people are into the fur area and history and that is what is traditional?
There are some who feel any thing less than a custom built flint lock is too modern.
Its all a matter of choice i belive.Me i like muzzle loaders,all of them are intresting from the newest inline to a hand gonne.
Hand gonne is a hand held cannon dating back to the 1400s that was the first working muzzle loader that shot a projectel.
So what is traditonal in one persons mind my not be in anothers.All a matter of individuals choice.Be it modern or old world.
Some intresting facts about muzzle loaders.
Hand Gonne-1400s
Flashpan-1400s
Matchlock-mid 1400s
Wheellock-1517
snaphanuce-1570
Flintlock-1612
Percussion cap-1805
Inline-i am told there is a inline flint lock in musseum some where dating back to the 1700s..Dought if many of these were made.
Then we have the modern inline.
So next time any body says your hunt is being cheapend by using a inline ask them if there using a matchlock,for this is most likly the first hunting muzzle loader made which was held to the shoulder and shot like a gun as we know it.
Who is to say where a traditional muzzle loader begins.They will tell you where they think it ends im sure.

 

[tg]

I think it is pretty well documented by the intent of the original seasons that the modern inline ML guns should never have been let in but they are here and likely to stay so what this thread is about is how to segrate a season for the traditional type guns, and doing so if possible by not interfering with the currecnt use of modern stuff, and pleas don't start with the 1700 inline thing again it has nothing to do with or in common with a modern centerfire that has been retooled to load from the wrong end.It is so sad to see the rationalizations continue.

 

[tg]

Oh I forgot one thing...
"what is a tradtional hunting weapon?Whos to say.'

I AM! so pay attention...

 

[Blue Smoke]

tg if you will see this is what buckknife had to say about Inline hunting on another Forum.

Blue Smoke

 

[Pork Chop]

I haven't been following this thread all that intently, so if this is old news, just skip over it.

I read your post about segregating a part of the season for the "traditional" guns. While I agree that the original intent of the primitive seasons was to allow folks to hunt with non-modern weapons. The argument about hand gonnes, matchlocks, etc is interesting, but it is somewhat futile in my mind. The reason for that is that most folks don't have a clue what they are (note that the author went so far as to describe the hand gonne here - indicating that even folks on this forum are unfamiliar with them), therefore the legislators would not consider them. The issue that I see is that if we keep fragmenting the hunting season, where will it stop? Will there be a deer season for each weapon type? Will there be a single shot shotgun season, a pump shotgun season, a semi-auto shotgun season, a bolt action rifle season, etc.??

If there is to be a primitive muzzleloading season, then in my opinion, it should be just that - primitive muzzleloaders. Iron sights, no protective covers (other than a "cow's knee"), no shotgun primers, no sabots and so forth. I don't see a problem with plastic stocks in that season, nor do I see a problem with the use of replacement black powders. Those are pragmatic - there are a lot of plastic stock weapons that fit the bill, except for the stock material. On the powder, true black powder is getting difficult for many people to find, and the argument of ordering 25lbs via mail order is problematic. Few folks have the need for that much powder, and it can cause storage issues.

I think that the more prudent course of action would be to lobby the legislatures to return the primitive hunts to their intended format. Yes, the inline guys will gripe, but, in their hearts, they know that the inline was designed to circumvent the intent of the law, by meeting the letter.

 

[tg]

"I think that the more prudent course of action would be to lobby the legislatures to return the primitive hunts to their intended format. Yes, the inline guys will gripe, but, in their hearts, they know that the inline was designed to circumvent the intent of the law, by meeting the letter'

I suspect it may be a state to state matter of how it can best be achieved, there may not be a viable option in some states, others may make progress by one method or another, I do think that promoting true traditional guns, sights and projectiles it will help build a base of hunters that have been educated rather than indoctrinated, no personal flame intended Blue Smoke I suspect those who might feel a stinging sensation at my words know who they are and those who feel the same as I are equally aware of the truth they hold.

 

[buckknife]

one shot trollen here are you?Yes these guys know i used to shoot inlines.That was 2 years ago.I posted recently on 2 modern fourms about a primitive season,on greyberards out doors it was pretty much meet with a good response,on huntamerica it started that way till trolls like blue smoke derailed the thread into a us them.i stated the season pretty much as tg had proposed it,with in 4 or 5 responses they wanted peeps,then fiber optic,conicals and then they started in on me,did there best to bait me into a us them thing and still are.now they are wanting me banned just for starting the thread,Thanks oneshot,or blue smoke you can keep your inlines and now i see that there is no hope for your kind.That great thread you brought up from 2 years ago is when i bought a inline again for some dumb reason,but after hanging around your kind of people and your 200 yard shoots as a given,i sold it and got back on couarse.
I went to huntamerica hoping to find a common ground were your kind and the traditional crowd could find a good solution for both,i was wrong.You guys harresed me and did the best you could to derail the thread,and succeded.
Tell me bluesmoke how can you be againts a primitive season there aand here you want one?you just starting the troll and it will be only a matter of time before you try to derail this thread.You one of the teed-off huntamerica inline crowd that thinks you have the right to have a modern forum here,but it aint gonna happen.I also will never ever again stick up for your kind,to bad all i wanted to do was possible bring a new idea to you to hunt a new season and get more people involed in tradtional muzzle loading.I wont stick up for the inline crowd anymore,first chance you get you cut someone off at there knees.

 

[roundball]

This kind of personal attack post is not welcome here.

We use this Forum to try and have professional, adult level conversations.

Dredging up somebody's post from another board that's 2.5 years old the way you did is nothing more than a childish attempt to provoke an argument and everybody who reads it sees it that way.

That behavoir is not welcome here at all.

 

[Runner]

Buckknife, anyone that stopped to read what you wrote knew you were trying to find a middle ground. I started trying that several years ago. There is no money in it, and most of the folks you were talking to on HA have money invested or coming in off the inlines. Rattus is the White dealer. One guy makes long heavy conicals. Another does prep and custom jobs. Another owns nine whites I think. You walked into a no win setup where the hard feelings are over two years old, from when the forum was split. I have been the person keeping things on subject in the traditional forum there for a long time now. I recently just up and quit because I had all I could take of them coming to that forum to harrass people who wear "buckskin panties" in their words. It is different if someone says anything in their forum tho. Now they are all gonna leave the forum because they will not ban me for doing exactly the same things they have been doing for two years. I wish you success in your attempt to find that elusive middle ground tho! Grow a thick skin if you wish to to make it. It is a shame tho, because rattus really is a very nice guy and a traditional hunter. There are some good people there in with the rest.

 

[buckknife]

Runner i left there also,probably banned by now anyway after my last post.I do belive now if a primitive season is ever to come about it should be done how pennsulvaina did it originallly.I wish you the best of luck in your state and hope you succeed with whater coaurse of action that is needed to be sucessfull. :front:

 

[roundball]

Buckknife, anyone that stopped to read what you wrote knew you were trying to find a middle ground. I started trying that several years ago. There is no money in it, and most of the folks you were talking to on HA have money invested or coming in off the inlines. Rattus is the White dealer. One guy makes long heavy conicals. Another does prep and custom jobs. Another owns nine whites I think. You walked into a no win setup where the hard feelings are over two years old, from when the forum was split. I have been the person keeping things on subject in the traditional forum there for a long time now. I recently just up and quit because I had all I could take of them coming to that forum to harrass people who wear "buckskin panties" in their words. It is different if someone says anything in their forum tho. Now they are all gonna leave the forum because they will not ban me for doing exactly the same things they have been doing for two years. I wish you success in your attempt to find that elusive middle ground tho! Grow a thick skin if you wish to to make it. It is a shame tho, because rattus really is a very nice guy and a traditional hunter. There are some good people there in with the rest.

It really is a shame...the only issue I have with any of this back and forth is the behavior.
I could care less that there are several different opinions about things...always has been, always will be...but none of this is important enough to start slandering other people literally by name, etc...that is so childish, and shows the world how insecure and immature someone is.

If someone has an opinion, post it in a simple neutral tone and let it go...forums are not dueling grounds...read the posts, use what you can and leave the rest...this is a hobby for cryin out loud.

People who make those kinds of posts would probably never do it in front of their Wives or Children...and I worry about people with that sort of short fuse, road rage mentality walking around loose with loaded firearms.

 

[buckknife]

Roundball i think i will be sending my money to the TMA,it took a good cluben over my head but i realize now this organiztion is truely need.I will encourage others to do the same.Just hope they will accept me. eace:

 

Roundball i think i will be sending my money to the TMA,it took a good cluben over my head but i realize now this organiztion is truely need.I will encourage others to do the same.Just hope they will accept me. eace:

Buckknife,.... I assure you ol'bud, you are welcome to join the TMA!! :hatsoff:

YMHS
rollingb

 

[canyonman]

Buckknife, anyone that stopped to read what you wrote knew you were trying to find a middle ground. I started trying that several years ago. There is no money in it, and most of the folks you were talking to on HA have money invested or coming in off the inlines. Rattus is the White dealer. One guy makes long heavy conicals. Another does prep and custom jobs. Another owns nine whites I think. You walked into a no win setup where the hard feelings are over two years old, from when the forum was split. I have been the person keeping things on subject in the traditional forum there for a long time now. I recently just up and quit because I had all I could take of them coming to that forum to harrass people who wear "buckskin panties" in their words. It is different if someone says anything in their forum tho. Now they are all gonna leave the forum because they will not ban me for doing exactly the same things they have been doing for two years. I wish you success in your attempt to find that elusive middle ground tho! Grow a thick skin if you wish to to make it. It is a shame tho, because rattus really is a very nice guy and a traditional hunter. There are some good people there in with the rest.

It really is a shame...the only issue I have with any of this back and forth is the behavior.
I could care less that there are several different opinions about things...always has been, always will be...but none of this is important enough to start slandering other people literally by name, etc...that is so childish, and shows the world how insecure and immature someone is.

If someone has an opinion, post it in a simple neutral tone and let it go...forums are not dueling grounds...read the posts, use what you can and leave the rest...this is a hobby for cryin out loud.

People who make those kinds of posts would probably never do it in front of their Wives or Children...and I worry about people with that sort of short fuse, road rage mentality walking around loose with loaded firearms.



Very well put, that is the exact kind of attitude we should all have. :RO:

Larry

 

[buckknife]

Thankyou Rollingb,sending you a pm.

 

[Claude Mathis]

tg if you will see this is what buckknife had to say about Inline hunting on another Forum.

Blue Smoke

Frankly, I don't care what he said on "another forum". That is is no relevance here, unless of course you are out to attack the man personally.

If you have a beef with him, contact him directly, don't try to discredit him on this forum.

People change their views about things and I'm content to let people speak for themselves.

 

[Runner]

I told the proper people to spread the word at the rendezvous last weekend that there was a TMA. The idea was met with pretty much universal approval.

 

[waltcowan]

Is there a strong enough support base at this time to maintain a traditional ML seasson in any/some states, and I am refering to a non watered down definition of traditional, pre-cartridge era guns ignitions, sights and projectiles which would requires modifications on many production level guns, and for the sake of discussion let us have a cut off date of 1850.This will help avoid "wiggeling" in a lot of modern stuff under the guise of "a blank is a blank" I am looking at a true but not perfectionist with iron barrels and mandatory horesback transportation type traditional season..guns and gun gear not clothing or all of the other things that get tossed in to muddy the waters.

are you saying no gps's, walkie-takkies, flashlights or any other post 1850's equipment?

 

[buckknife]

Rollingb my check is in the mail,thankyou for your help :front: