Do you adjust your load or POA for distance?

[longcruise]

For hunting, I don't do a lot of load development. I decide on a caliber that is suitable for the game. Usually deer and elk so elk adequate is the objective. For me, that's a ball and a 54 minimum. No such thing as too big though. Usually load up at about 90 grains. Both my 54s shoot that load with better than adequate accuracy. So a single sight in that's about 2" high at 50 is workable out to 100. The possibility that I'd shoot at 100 is very slim but if everything is perfect a slightly above center hold on the chest is going to work.

I know guys who adjust powder charges for distance and they seem to do well with it. Think it comes down to the gun. One of my 54s shoots the same group size at 50 grains and 90 grains. Not the same POI though. I might try shooting it at five or ten grain increments to see if it remains consistent for target shooting.

 

[Forrest Smith]

Just to throw another log in the fire, how about using the same volume of powder, but changing from 2F to 3F for more velocity further out? It is hotter/faster and maybe alternative to changing the volume.

 

[Nuthatch]

My .50s are zeroed at 100 yards, which puts me about 3” high at 50 yards. I’ve never actually checked that 100-yard zero though. I check that I’m 3” high at 50 yards and have really only just plinked at steel gongs at 100. I hit them often enough to know I’m on at that distance and I miss often enough to know I probably shouldn’t take that shot on a live animal unless I’m really steady, calm & have good conditions. Past 100 yards is a no-shoot with roundball for me — hunting-wise.

I load the same for every shot and adjust the POA when at closer ranges fob small targets. There’s a 2” gong I set at about 10 yards that I still haven’t been able to hit because of the hold-under. But the 90-yard 6” gong gets smacked plenty.

 

[ADK Bigfoot]

I have shot a .50 TVM Early Virginia in competition for years. I shoot 70 grains 3F Goex to point of aim at 25 and 50 yards. At 100 yards, I increase the charge to 80-85 grains of 3F and hold for center. I win more matches than I lose, and have used the same for the New England Flintlock Championships each summer with good results. I have a 100 yard target shot offhand with a 4" group, scoring 49-2x with that load.

ADK Bigfoot

 

[Bad Karma]

I’m sighted in about 2 inches low at 100 yards with round ball rifles. I don’t hold over or under at hunting ranges, I aim dead center, sort of the “maximum point blank range“ system for muzzleloaders. This is the method I began using after missing a few shots on antelope and deer. I’d been holding a bit high or a bit low depending on the range and my dad busted me on it. “Always aim for hair if you want to hit hair” I have bullet rifles that I sight in dead on at 100 yards and then adjust the sights (tang or Williams FP) as needed for longer distances.
Whatever method you decide to use, stick to it. Courage of your convictions is a very important factor in hitting with a bow or rifle.

 

[oldwood]

Up until I was 60 yrs. old , I could simply level the front sight in the rear notch. I used a turn in 66 inches barrel custom longrifle in .50 cal.for deer and competition target shooting. That rifle liked 80 gr . fffg. Killed many deer with it. I like keeping things simple so I didn't have to think where the sights should be . Sight the rifle in with the sight picture you like , keeping it simple . My hunting buddy of 1/2 century plus uses the " move the front sight up and down in the rear sight groove for different distances. I can't fault his choice , as he is a better shot than me , just figure his brain is more advanced than mine. My favorite long rifle is a 38" barrel , .62 cal. , using 90 gr. FFG. The trajectory out to 150 yds was so predictable , i sighted it in for 100 yds. using the level the sights method , I killed a deer at 165 yds , my lifetime furtherest shot with any gun , ctg. , or m/l. Can't use anything but a custom 38 inch .50 cal long rifle w/ a peep sight nowadays. Started in the woods when I was 6 yr. old trapping , started hunting at 12 yr. old. Guess that makes it 70 yrs. in the woods. Loved every min. of it. Note......When my vision got fuzzy about 15 yrs. ago , I started using high contrast targets . Out to 75 Yds. , a 4 " square of orange duct tape on a white background , is good for me . At 100 yds. a 6 " orange sq. of duct tape is best , and with the tang peep sight , and top of front sight blade on top of the orange sq. , I get consistant hits good enough to hit a deer at 100 yd. or slightly more. .....oldwood

 

[Ed C.]

I want to thank everybody for the responses and suggestions, understanding that the best method is what works for each individual. I like the idea of increasing the powder load for the 100 yard shots and after that I like the idea of moving the blade in the notch. I do best if I have a definite point to aim at. I'm very inconsistent when trying to guess elevation compensations. I don't want to be adjusting my sights (they are adjustable elevation and windage). It took a while to get my load procedure and sights to be about perfect at 25/50 yards. The only time I shoot 100 yards is just before and at matches. I will get out this week and try the two methods mentioned above and make a note in this thread.

 

[SDSmlf]

I want to thank everybody for the responses and suggestions, understanding that the best method is what works for each individual. I like the idea of increasing the powder load for the 100 yard shots and after that I like the idea of moving the blade in the notch. I do best if I have a definite point to aim at. I'm very inconsistent when trying to guess elevation compensations. I don't want to be adjusting my sights (they are adjustable elevation and windage). It took a while to get my load procedure and sights to be about perfect at 25/50 yards. The only time I shoot 100 yards is just before and at matches. I will get out this week and try the two methods mentioned above and make a note in this thread.

For target work at known distances, varying powder charges is a definite option, although for target shooting, accuracy is king, and I have found varying powdering charges from ‘ideal’ or ‘most accurate’ typically opened up groups. That said, I’ve usually found, as previously mentioned, an accuracy hunting load (say out to 100 yards), then a powderpuff/plinking/squirrel load that works at 25 yards without a sight adjustment.

It will be interesting to hear your test results.

 

[Mike in FL]

I have a .50 cal Investarms Hawken that shoots very well at 25 and 50 yards with 60 grains of FFFg. At 100 yards it is about 6-7" low. I don't want to be adjusting the sights and by aiming high I can't see the target anymore so it becomes a guessing game. I did try to research this on the forum and a few people said that they raise the charge up to 80, even 90 grains for 100 yard shots. Just wondering what you all do for 100 yard shots?

You know how when we aim the front sight appears as a ball nestled into the "U" of the rear sight? One way to adjust for lo her distances is to change that visible ball shape to more of an obligation g shape - I mean yoh will see more of the front blade I side that U. Experiment with how much of that front bead you see for whatever distance.

 

[The Crisco Kid]

One load for hunting sights and sights set so the front is even with the top of the blade for 100 yds. I like a wide notch with plenty of light on the sides of the front. From then on, I use the old "full bead or fine bead" in the notch for what ever range. The front sight is never above the target but it may be way above the rear sight for target shooting gongs way out there. That's way beyond the range I'll try a shot at a deer.

 

[Poguetx]

I always use the same load and adjust POA. I figure the mountain man would never know what distance the grizzly bear would pop up. At matches with known distances, I do see guys that adjust their charge, but I always just adjust my POA. For my 50 cal Hawken, the bullet drop is almost identical to a 22lr out to 100 yds, so aim 6-8 inches high.

 

[Ed C.]

I always use the same load and adjust POA. I figure the mountain man would never know what distance the grizzly bear would pop up. At matches with known distances, I do see guys that adjust their charge, but I always just adjust my POA. For my 50 cal Hawken, the bullet drop is almost identical to a 22lr out to 100 yds, so aim 6-8 inches high.

That is what I have been doing but it hides the target and evidently I'm not very good at making that compensation. I need to have the target in my sight picture but do not want to be playing with adjusting my sights. I only shoot paper bears so I'll try a heavier load and moving the blade in the notch when aiming this week. I did have a brown bear in Alaska charge me, stop about 3 feet in front of me with a growl and pawing the ground. Happened in about 2-3 seconds. I didn't have a gun but couldn't have used it anyway had he pushed the attack. I slowly backed away, the bear was merciful and we both got to go home that day! I had stumbled into an area of thick brush that they were using for dining/sleeping.

 

[HSmithTX]

I require my fixed sight rifles to land the bullet exactly on top of the front sight dead level with the rear. At what distance depends on what that rifle is. There are no competitive muzzleloader shoots around here, I hunt with them. My ML rifles are zero'd at 85-100 yards, the ball will not get over about 3.5" above or below the aim point over the distances I will shoot at game with the velocity I shoot, I will hold a bit low up close and a bit high out long but it'll be within about 3" of where I intend to hit. You can't hit (easily) what you can't see but you can learn a trajectory easily, zero it out long and hold low up close where you can really see better. My load development method is to figure out roughly what velocity I want to have, generally 1500-1800, and start shooting below that and work up 5 grains at a time until it's shooting good groups. If POI is still low and charges are heavy I will file the front sight down until it shoots on top of the front sight, if charges are low to mid I will keep adding powder until it shoots on top of the front sight or charges get heavy and file the front sight. If by chance it shoots high before groups shrink I will change the front sight for a taller sight after I find the good groups with moderately heavy charges and do the math to see how high it needs to be,

 

[76 shovelhead]

80 grains 3f. 490 .ball 15thou patch. mink oil. 100 yd zero. 2-3 high at 50. i hunt deer and want the extra reach.

 

[64Springer]

80 grains 3f. 490 .ball 15thou patch. mink oil. 100 yd zero. 2-3 high at 50. i hunt deer and want the extra reach.

A good set-up.

And would allow the OP to aim a bit low at 25 and 50 while being able to see his target.

 

[LME]

You and I have had the same experience. I had rather aim a little high on 100 yard shots than to change loads for distance. I some times load down for closer shots but when going over 60 grains my accuracy is not as good..

I said 60 grains and I meant 80> I guess my ancient mind is slipping?

 

[DementedMindOfJac]

I have a .50 cal Investarms Hawken that shoots very well at 25 and 50 yards with 60 grains of FFFg. At 100 yards it is about 6-7" low. I don't want to be adjusting the sights and by aiming high I can't see the target anymore so it becomes a guessing game. I did try to research this on the forum and a few people said that they raise the charge up to 80, even 90 grains for 100 yard shots. Just wondering what you all do for 100 yard shots?

Okay, no. I adjust the eye-piece on my tang-mounted peep-sight, but I get where you're at.
When I was a nipper, barely half again as tall as a '47 Walker I heard terms like "hold fine," "hold half, " "hold full" or "hold over."
That refers to the way a man pictures an Englisher Khaki through the battlesights of a (mostly,) 7mm Mauser. At 50 yds, the v notch has only the tip of the front sight in the very bottom of the v centered on the belly-button. Hold fine. At around 120 yds, you raise the front sight halfway twixt the top and bottom of the notch, on the belly button. Hold half. And so on...
Does your Hawken have the "longhorn" style rear sight? or the modern type square box type?

 

[Ed C.]

Okay, no. I adjust the eye-piece on my tang-mounted peep-sight, but I get where you're at.
When I was a nipper, barely half again as tall as a '47 Walker I heard terms like "hold fine," "hold half, " "hold full" or "hold over."
That refers to the way a man pictures an Englisher Khaki through the battlesights of a (mostly,) 7mm Mauser. At 50 yds, the v notch has only the tip of the front sight in the very bottom of the v centered on the belly-button. Hold fine. At around 120 yds, you raise the front sight halfway twixt the top and bottom of the notch, on the belly button. Hold half. And so on...
Does your Hawken have the "longhorn" style rear sight? or the modern type square box type?

It is what I'd call a modified buckhorn. A wide slope going down to a very narrrow notch allowing for a fine bead to be used.. Very good for factory sights having easy windage and elevation adjustments. I have a thing....once I get my sights set up I will not play with or adjust them unless it changes. I have two identical unmentionables. One is set up with a scope, the other iron sights just so I don't have to be taking the scope on and off when I want to shoot open sights.

 

[French Colonial]

I think you should spend several days experimenting with patch and ball thickness and then powder charges until you find the powder charge that gives you pinpoint accuracy......

Then when someone sets a target at a different distance, throw it all away and dump in as much powder as you think you will need....that should work.

 

[Ed C.]

I think you should spend several days experimenting with patch and ball thickness and then powder charges until you find the powder charge that gives you pinpoint accuracy......

Then when someone sets a target at a different distance, throw it all away and dump in as much powder as you think you will need....that should work.

Step one is done. It will not change anything I can't go back to to try a heavier charge. Then I'll know. All part of the fun. I'll let you know tomorrow.