.451 Volunteer

[nwtradegun]

the britts used them against the American team at the creedmoor range in new York city in the late 1800s

 

[ResearchPress]

By the time of the Creedmoor international matches the military match rifle, of which the 'Volunteer' is styled after, were supplanted by full match rifles.

The Irish and later British teams used Rigby and Gibbs-Metford rifles. These had pistol grip stocks, vernier sights, no ramrod - all military styling had gone.

David

 

[Heelerau]

Gentlemen, put 5 alloys down range at 200m, first shot was ver high, hit the top of the target frame, the rest came down lower, 85 grains of FFg goex. The rifle seemed to have less recoil. and the 5 shots strung vertically. When I swapped back to my usual bullets, pure lead, it felt like I got better combustion due to more friction in the bore if that make sense. The second target, same load, kept them all in the black. with a bit of drift to the right hand side, but roughly a 9 ring group. I could not remember the correct adjustment for windage, which I have now written down in my range book. I was able to fine tune the elevation this time with a mates better scope. I also chronograpphed the last 4 shots 1195, 1196, 1192, 1208 1197.7 fps average, so my loading technique is not to bad. I suspect I can improve this load with a bit more minor sight adjustment to get it central, and also look at the way I am holding the rifle on the bench rest, I may also be canting slightly so will get my mate to watch me next time at the range. I did chrono some paper cartridges at about 865 to 885 fps which was interesting with the 2 1/2 drams of ffg. I tried some different paper which turned out to be not linen rag, I shot very high a 50m off the bench. The day had no wind but the light was a bit fickle, going from bright to overcast quite quickly. Rob, put 5 alloys down range at 200m, first shot was ver high, hit the top of the target frame, the rest came down lower, 85 grains of FFg goex. The rifle seemed to have less recoil. and the 5 shots strung vertically. When I swapped back to my usual bullets, pure lead, it felt like I got better combustion due to more friction in the bore if that make sense. The second target, same load, kept them all in the black. with a bit of drift to the right hand side, but roughly a 9 ring group. I could not remember the correct adjustment for windage, which I have now written down in my range book. I was able to fine tune the elevation this time with a mates better scope. I also chronograpphed the last 4 shots 1195, 1196, 1192, 1208 1197.7 fps average, so my loading technique is not to bad. I suspect I can improve this load with a bit more minor sight adjustment to get it central, and also look at the way I am holding the rifle on the bench rest, I may also be canting slightly so will get my mate to watch me next time at the range. I did chrono some paper cartridges at about 865 to 885 fps which was interesting with the 2 1/2 drams of ffg. I tried some different paper which turned out to be not linen rag, I shot very high a 50m off the bench. The day had no wind but the light was a bit fickle, going from bright to overcast quite quickl/

 

[Heelerau]

Gents, a mate on the American Long Rifle Forum, a very kind and knowledgeable chap, sent me some of these bullets and a sizer die, even though he used different Lyman numbers going back to the late '50s and '60s, I am pretty sure this bullet is the same as the Whitworth 457121PH 475 grain. anyway once again a cold blowy day, I shot 13 rounds and got the best group yet. As this bullet is nearly 100 grains lighter than my regular bullet I set the bull into the top of the ring on the front sight, so aimed off with its inherent vagaries. I still do not have a good scope for this range, but did get a few shots spotted after I had already put 3 down range, which were within 2 inches of each other ! So I just shot for a group. Looks like by the way the rifle is shooting close to point of aim, so bullet weight has not made much of a difference. Same charge of 85 Grains of Goex FFg. Counting the best 10 shots, discount the 3 shots in the 3 ring, bar one slightly wide shot in the 7 ring it is at worst a 9 ring group, with a few 10s at a guess [/URL[URL=http://s1012.photobucket.com/user/heelerau/media/P8210013.jpg.html]

 

[sheba]

My early (RIgby rifling) PH volunteer came with Lyman bullet mold 451114 and is 450grs

 

[Blackfingers]

Hi all, been following this thread since I also have the Pedersoli Volunteer rifle. The other day I received my Lyman #457121 conical mould in 495grs. Made a bunch today and will try some maybe next week. I have many 530gr Blue Falcon bullets remaining and will certainly get through them in time. But to be truthful, I needed to make my own to assure of a constant stream of bullets at reasonable cost. My Chiropractor removed his x-ray room and I got the lead! The furthest I plan to shoot will be around 200yds, only punch paper once a month at my ML meetings, don't need artillary, just the best I can get for the money.

 

[Heelerau]

How well did your rifle shoot? The bullet I have just got the mould for is about 485 grains. I have heard from some pretty knowledgeable people that these early Rigby rifled .451s were not very consistent. Crudely speaking mine seems to be at this stage. I am now at the tinkering part of things to see if I can further improve the grouping at 200m.

 

[Heelerau]

I won my first medal yesterday with my old Volunteer .451, my late mate Dean Tugwell' shade must have been standing next to me ( he gave me this rifle just before he died, he mentored me when I was a kid starting out with shooting muzzle loading arms) It was a howling gale, 13 shots off the bench at 100m, then 13 shots off the bench at 200m. I finally have a decent scope so can now make sight corrections at the longer range. One chap had a Bugg slug rifle in 38, the other a .451 Gibbs. I equal scored with the winner ( he won on count back with a 10) we both dropped a shot, me it was a blank, forgot the bullet. I am using the 485 whitworth bullet, 87 grains of FFg Want, wonder wad over powder and card wad on top. Bullet slightly hardened with tin. I still have to make up a proper allow of 30/1 lead tin . First target is 100 m the second 200m The one shot in the bottom of the target is due to a wet patch staying in the barrel, when ever that happens I find the shot goes low for some reason. First two shots are high as I tried the ring forsight before changing to a fine post and ball for the 100m as I cannot lower my rear sight enough. Went back to the ring sight for the 200m

 

[Heelerau]

Late reply, turns out I was getting inspite of gas thread tape a lot of leakage through the cone threads, the bolster had gas cut badly before I got the rifle. I subsequently drilled out and retapped the bolster the next size up and Rick Weber made a new platinum lined cone ( the original Weber cone actually finally blew out) When I commenced shooting the rifle with the new cone the POI had lifted 4 inches at 200m and the group sighted up considerable more. Unfortunately that rifle was lost when my farm burnt down in a bushfire last year. I have since bought a Parker Hale 3 band Volunteer but this one is Henry rifled so now I have to go through the whole palaver of getting a new rifle to shoot. Has anyone here shot the Henry rifled version like mine? I am wondering if I may need to go straight to a paper patched bullet, such as was used in the martini Henry rifle. I will be using a 1part tin to 30 parts lead alloy this time. That was the next step with my old rifle. This new rifle also has signs of gas cutting in the bolster, but now where near as bad as my original rifle. I have also purchased a lovely Dr Goodwin aperture rear sight so will have proper windage adjustment now. The rifle will need to have its barrel bedded before I get going as well. Might also change the front sight to a Lyman one with a set of different sight inserts. It is the top rifle, the bottom one is an original 3rd model SA marked Pat 53, the middle a PH Navy rifle.

 

[ResearchPress]

. . . I have since bought a Parker Hale 3 band Volunteer but this one is Henry rifled so now I have to go through the whole palaver of getting a new rifle to shoot. Has anyone here shot the Henry rifled version like mine? I am wondering if I may need to go straight to a paper patched bullet, such as was used in the martini Henry rifle. . .

I had a Parker-Hale ‘Volunteer’ with Henry rifling and a 33” (2-band) barrel.

I used a pure lead grease groove bullet with a plain card wad and 90 grains of TPPH (similar to Swiss No. 4 (1.5Fg)). I didn’t do anything with bedding. The bullet was the Lyman #457125 that‘s used with the 45-70 cartridge for example. It took more sizing down than some would recommend, but worked for me to put in medal winning scores. You may be able to find similar but a better fit without sizing? I never used paper patch with this rifle. I set an MLAGB National Record with it at 600 yards that remained in place for several years before been beaten by one point.

David

 

[Heelerau]

Thank you David, I see you used the lighter Whitworth bullet for the 100yd to 200yd work, and the .45/70 type bullet for 200yd plus. Is the barrel to wood fit better in the .451 rifle than its rifled musket stable mates? the early post was supposed to read the group tightened up considerable, bloody spell come grammar check
Kind regards
Gordon

 

[ResearchPress]

Is the barrel to wood fit better in the .451 rifle than its rifled musket stable mates?

Sorry, can't help with that; the Volunteer was the only Parker-Hale I have owned so have nothing to compare things with. I sold it maybe 15 years ago.

David