Why cushion wads?

[Britsmoothy]

Fair point CJ :hatsoff:

Brits.

 

[paulvallandigham]

The lubed cushion wads I have used leave streaks down the bore, with bare metal- albeit thin stripes-- showing. I put more lube on the cushion wad, to overcome this deficiency, only to create the donut hole patterns, because the cushion wad was now too heavy. And, I was still getting lead streaks in the bore, which bent the edges of the wads, and allowed gas to blow by, cutting the lead shot, and opening patterns. Only after taking the advice I received here on the forum did my patterns begin to become even, and my pellets counts rise( in the pattern at 30 yds.)

 

[Mike Brooks]

And, I was still getting lead streaks in the bore, which bent the edges of the wads, and allowed gas to blow by,

The cushion wad should stop any gas from getting by. They really get the squeeze put on them when they start heading out the barrel.
I have recently discovered some pre lubed fiber wads from circle fly that work great in my cartridge guns....which I know aren't M/L's...but they are light weight and I can shoot 50 to 60 or more rounds with very clean barrels and no leading. I'll be trying some of these in a M/L one of these days.
Some guns I can shoot a full fiber wad, some 1/2, and others don't like fiber wads at all. Most guns I have shot all like lubed 3/8" felts. I always shot a cushion wad of some sort for the lube which prevents ,,,or helps to prevent leading by carrying lube. Not to mention you can load and shoot all day with no fussing around with cleaning or wiping. Just the way I do it, don't make it right for everybody though.

 

[paulvallandigham]

I have some new pre-lubed wads that are black or gray in color that I am going to try. I would have to dig the bag out to recall who made them, but I have not given up on the idea of being able to shoot lots of shots without having to scrub out leading in my bores. You inspire me. :thumbsup:

 

[Mike Brooks]

Paul, try some felts from circle fly, you'll like them.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Thanks for the suggestion, Mike. They are on my shopping list. :thumbsup:

 

[Stumpkiller]

I'm sure I'll never find it, but I had a shot loading description that was: powder, wad of tow, shot and another wad of tow. This was from a pre-F&I War source. Probably predating the overpowder card . . . so the wad came first. ;-)

 

[Capt. Jas.]

A cork wadding has been extolled for the virtue of increafing the range and clofenefs of the fhot of pieces
AN ESSAY ON SHOOTING, Edie, 1789

 

[Mike Brooks]

Never tried cork, but I suspect it would work extremely well.

 

[varsity07840]

And, I was still getting lead streaks in the bore, which bent the edges of the wads, and allowed gas to blow by,

The cushion wad should stop any gas from getting by. They really get the squeeze put on them when they start heading out the barrel.
I have recently discovered some pre lubed fiber wads from circle fly that work great in my cartridge guns....which I know aren't M/L's...but they are light weight and I can shoot 50 to 60 or more rounds with very clean barrels and no leading. I'll be trying some of these in a M/L one of these days.
Some guns I can shoot a full fiber wad, some 1/2, and others don't like fiber wads at all. Most guns I have shot all like lubed 3/8" felts. I always shot a cushion wad of some sort for the lube which prevents ,,,or helps to prevent leading by carrying lube. Not to mention you can load and shoot all day with no fussing around with cleaning or wiping. Just the way I do it, don't make it right for everybody though.

Mike:

Are the wads you're using in your cartridge rifles
the ones they list as .460 dia for 45-70 & 45-90?
How thick are they?

Duane

 

[roundball]

Never tried cork, but I suspect it would work extremely well.

I agree, as they're probably lighter than fiber wads...and because places like Circle Fly doesn't make/offer them I assume they probably cost a lot more than fiber wads and/or cork might not hold any lube at all.

On a related note, for me at least...I wish some place like Circle Fly would offer their 1/2" prelubed fiber wads in a 3/8" thickness.
I know the 1/2" can be sliced/split but that takes more time and lacks some precision of course...seems a manufactured 3/8" version of a prelubed fiber cushion wad would be good...but I must be in the minority or by now if the demand was there it seems a 3/8" would have become available as a product by now.

 

[Mike Brooks]

Mike:

Are the wads you're using in your cartridge rifles
the ones they list as .460 dia for 45-70 & 45-90?
How thick are they?

Duane

I use .030 or .060 vegetable fiber wads sized .460 . Considering trying felt soon.

 

[Mike Brooks]

Never tried cork, but I suspect it would work extremely well.

I agree, as they're probably lighter than fiber wads...and because places like Circle Fly doesn't make/offer them I assume they probably cost a lot more than fiber wads and/or cork might not hold any lube at all.

On a related note, for me at least...I wish some place like Circle Fly would offer their 1/2" prelubed fiber wads in a 3/8" thickness.
I know the 1/2" can be sliced/split but that takes more time and lacks some precision of course...seems a manufactured 3/8" version of a prelubed fiber cushion wad would be good...but I must be in the minority or by now if the demand was there it seems a 3/8" would have become available as a product by now.

The cork wads I have seen are about 1/8" thick and won't carry lube. they would replace your 1/* hard cards and/or your overshot card.
The reason they probably don't make 3/8" fiber is because fiber board might not come in 3/8". I think 3/8" would probably be ideal too. I'm still a big fan of 3/8" felt. :thumbsup:

 

[CoyoteJoe]

Circle Fly does list 3/8" fiber wads, though not the pre-lubed variety. The also list two different thickness of felt and cork. Below is from their website:


3/8” Fiber Wads, 500 count bag. These wads are made from a denser material than the 1/2” material we offer and work well as a cushion or spacer in shotshells that need a thinner wad for proper column height. Being biodegradable, these wads are particularly well suited for modern shotshells without plastic wad litter. Can be used without a nitro card. Available in 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 16, 20, 24, 28 gauges, .360”, .372”,.430”, .450”, .455”, and .460”.$12.00

1/8” & 1/4” Cork Wads, 250 count bag. We offer this material with modern shotshell reloaders in mind. This wad is used primarily as a shotcup filler for custom loadings with smokeless powder. Offers excellent shock adsorption for the shot charge when used with magnum loadings. May also be used in nitro for black applications. 10ga thru 32ga. & .320” thru .510”. 1/8”... $6.00 1/4”... $8.00


Wool Felt Wads. W.W. Greener in his book “The Gun and It’s Development” says this about wool felt; “The secret of good shooting is in the employment of a first-class felt wad over the powder; and it is inperative that this wad be of good quality. The texture must be close and firm, but the relative hardness or softness of the wad is of less moment. The felt wad serves to clean the fouling in the barrel left from the firing of the previous charge.” We are offering a 1/4” and 3/8” thick pressed wool felt wad in sizes 10ga. thru 28ga... These wads are not to be mistaken for the woven wool or synthetic material generally sold elsewhere as felt. 100 count bag... 1/4” Thick: $10.00 3/8” Thick:$13.00

 

[roundball]

The cork wads I have seen are about 1/8" thick and won't carry lube. they would replace your 1/* hard cards and/or your overshot card.

The reason they probably don't make 3/8" fiber is because fiber board might not come in 3/8". I think 3/8" would probably be ideal too. I'm still a big fan of 3/8" felt. :thumbsup:

Unfortunately, as a commercial lubed wad, felt probably soaks up too much lube and becomes too heavy and/or could have inconsistent weight from one wad to the next based upon the "lube control techniques" used.

There is one existing 3/8" prelubed option I'm aware of but its pretty expensive to shoot a lot and that's using 3 Oxyoke 1/8" prelubed wool wads.

I just Emailed the place that makes the wads for Circle Fly and asked if there is any way their manufacturing process might allow for the possibility of a 3/8" prelubed fiber cushion wad like the existing 1/2" wad.

 

[pmwest]

A cork wadding has been extolled for the virtue of increafing the range and clofenefs of the fhot of pieces
AN ESSAY ON SHOOTING, Edie, 1789

From the same publication:

It is worthy of notice, however, that in the second set of experiments, the number of grains thrown into the mark is uniformly greater than in the first set, although, as we have already mentioned, the only difference between them was, that, in the first set, the wadding was made of card-paper, and in the second, of hat, both cut to the size of the caliber: are we to attribute the difference in the results to this circumstance?

There is a disclaimer after the mention of cork that the writer had not fully tested that material. He also states that wads punched from “hat” were his preferred material. I have read in other publications that cork was as good, or a close second to felt.

 

[Leatherbark]

Back in the 80's when the T.C New Englander came out I bought my 12 gauge barrel. The manual said back then to use 2 cushion wads over the powder and 1 cushion wad over the shot.........I killed a lot of squirrels with a 100 grains of Pyrodex RS and 1-3/8 ounce of #6's with that wad combo..............I also stung a few and sent them scurrying off to lick there wounds. But I did learn about when to shoot at game when using a cylinder bore shotgun............Maybe the game I missed up close were caused by the fiber wads causing holes in the pattern.....................Bob

 

[Capt. Jas.]

A cork wadding has been extolled for the virtue of increafing the range and clofenefs of the fhot of pieces
AN ESSAY ON SHOOTING, Edie, 1789

From the same publication:

It is worthy of notice, however, that in the second set of experiments, the number of grains thrown into the mark is uniformly greater than in the first set, although, as we have already mentioned, the only difference between them was, that, in the first set, the wadding was made of card-paper, and in the second, of hat, both cut to the size of the caliber: are we to attribute the difference in the results to this circumstance?

There is a disclaimer after the mention of cork that the writer had not fully tested that material. He also states that wads punched from “hat” were his preferred material. I have read in other publications that cork was as good, or a close second to felt.

Yep and I like old hat felt as well.
Just trying to show a possible earlier date of a cushion like the OP was searching for.
I believe that book was almost a word for word plagiarism of a work about 10 years prior.
:grin:

 

[Glen1313]

I think you make a valid point. I personally don't think anyone back in the day purposely used, nor was instructed to use so called 1/2" fiber cushion wads. I believe those to be a relatively modern BP shot shell Wad development. During the 50-70 or so years that muzzleloader shotguns fell dramatically out of popularity (about 1910-1970) somehow, shotshell loading configuration was passed on to muzzleloading shotgun shooters. I've shot sporting clays using only the VM Star loading method. It worked fine. Further, I'm not convinced the 1/2" fiber wad helps in any way. I've used them, dry & lubed, cut in 1/2, and in 1/4s...1/2" fiber cushion wads either would hurt my patterns. 1/4" cut fiber wads made no improvement to my patterns or loading ease whatsoever. VM Star was right as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Glen1313]

Thin wad cards and a "puckerfull" of spit, as I recall reading, was the solution. For the most part, I've found his recommendations to be effective. The 1/2" fiber wad IMHO, is not only unneccessary, time & money wasteful, but even worse;detrimental to good patterns. But, there are some that report positive affects. I've just not seen any from my guns, with the exception of the skychief method loading with the fiberwad on top of the shot. In that case, I've seen better and more uniform patterns.

But, I frankly don't think there was any such thing as a 1/2" fiber wad used in muzzleloading shotgun heyday. I think it was taken from early BP cartridge development and mistakenly passed forward as a wad sequence. For the most part, I feel they are a waste of time and money unless youre loading a skychief load. JMO...