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Positioning the touch hole...I’d really appreciate some advice

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Larks

40 Cal
Joined
May 12, 2020
Messages
154
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Location
Queensland, Australia
Before I go ahead and drill the touch hole for my Baker Rifle build I’d really appreciate some advice on positioning it correctly:

The plan advises that the “hole should be centred with the pan and levelled with the top edge of the pan”........but.....just to be sure to be sure.....does the "top edge” refer to the top edge of the hollowed base of the pan? Or to the top edge of the level sides either side of the pan where it sits against the barrel??

The drawings seem to suggest the latter as it would position the hole closer to the centre of the “flat” that has been shaped into the side of the barrel (by the supplier), but I don’t want to assume anything at this stage given the kinda’ vital role that the touch hole plays.......

To complicate matters further: I’ve not been able to remove the breech plug to check the V notch that should be there as referred to in the drawing (it was suggested that it should be checked in a previous thread somewhere but it is very firmly in place) and a look down the barrel with my (very) cheap borescope is inconclusive.

In the image further below everything is right way up so the V notch in the touch plug "should" be centre left, but the breech plug face looks so rough it’s impossible to tell just exactly what is going on and I don’t know how deep or clear the V notch should appear.

I’m somewhat loath to try any harder to remove the breech plug for fear of damaging it and not being able to align it as squarely with the barrel again but measuring the depth of the breech plug (with cleaning rod) indicates that the forward face of it lines up with the front lip of the pan where it sits against the barrel.

So my thought on an initial plan of action is to locate and drill the touch hole and see if that lets in any light that might show up the expected V notch in the plug using the borescope down the barrel.......????? Or is that just a big and unlikely Hail Mary??

Failing that I can see that there’d be no avoiding trying harder to remove the breech plug and cleaning it up, drilling the touch hole would at least locate where the V needs to be filed into it (if it doesn’t already exist) - but I’ll cross that bridge when I come to it.

IMG_4997.JPG



Nothing is screwed down in the photos below however it shows well enough the position of the lock against the flat on the barrel (I realise the tang isn’t set down completely in these pics but even when it is there is still a slight gap between it and the barrel at the lower edge)

IMG_4999.JPG



IMG_5002.JPG




PICT0003.JPG
 
Well it’s done ..... as best as I could line it up.

The plan called for between .078 and .091 ( between 1.98mm and 2.31mm) so I’ve started with 2mm and will see how that goes.

It became pretty obvious that the drill went straight into the breech plug with no sign of any gap that would indicate the designed “V” notch in the plug so I did have to bight the bullet and put a bit more effort into getting that out.

It didn’t want to come easily and in the end it took a bit of heat but it is out now and there is definitely no V notched into it so I’ll now file that in myself.

It looks in the drawing like the V is cut right to the centre of the plug and I’d assume just the back of the touch hole:

IMG_5011.JPG



I don’t know why this new plug looks so cruddy on the inside...???

IMG_5010.JPG


IMG_5009.JPG



IMG_5012.JPG
 
All done, I cut the V to depth with a hacksaw and then filed out the V.

While I had the plug out I gave the barrel a decent clean. I was surprised to find quite a bit of surface rust inside so I ended up having to run some rust remover through it before scrubbing, cleaning and oiling it. However as a result I’ve made a bit of a mess of my browning around the breech area so will have to redo that tomorrow:

IMG_5020.JPG


IMG_5023.JPG



IMG_5025.JPG



A clear touch hole shown with a torch shining down the barrel - I’m happy with that

IMG_5028.JPG
 
That notch you had to file in your plug is why I never use the pre inlet stock from TRS. I always stock from a blank using their parts. That way I can get the touch hole just in front of the breech plug face. Yours is better than most and I'm sure will work fine.
I believe the old timers were putting 3/8 plugs in their barrels. We always use 1/2" in modern times.
 
Before I go ahead and drill the touch hole for my Baker Rifle build I’d really appreciate some advice on positioning it correctly:

The plan advises that the “hole should be centred with the pan and levelled with the top edge of the pan”........but.....just to be sure to be sure.....does the "top edge” refer to the top edge of the hollowed base of the pan? Or to the top edge of the level sides either side of the pan where it sits against the barrel??

The drawings seem to suggest the latter as it would position the hole closer to the centre of the “flat” that has been shaped into the side of the barrel (by the supplier), but I don’t want to assume anything at this stage given the kinda’ vital role that the touch hole plays.......

To complicate matters further: I’ve not been able to remove the breech plug to check the V notch that should be there as referred to in the drawing (it was suggested that it should be checked in a previous thread somewhere but it is very firmly in place) and a look down the barrel with my (very) cheap borescope is inconclusive.

In the image further below everything is right way up so the V notch in the touch plug "should" be centre left, but the breech plug face looks so rough it’s impossible to tell just exactly what is going on and I don’t know how deep or clear the V notch should appear.

I’m somewhat loath to try any harder to remove the breech plug for fear of damaging it and not being able to align it as squarely with the barrel again but measuring the depth of the breech plug (with cleaning rod) indicates that the forward face of it lines up with the front lip of the pan where it sits against the barrel.

So my thought on an initial plan of action is to locate and drill the touch hole and see if that lets in any light that might show up the expected V notch in the plug using the borescope down the barrel.......????? Or is that just a big and unlikely Hail Mary??

Failing that I can see that there’d be no avoiding trying harder to remove the breech plug and cleaning it up, drilling the touch hole would at least locate where the V needs to be filed into it (if it doesn’t already exist) - but I’ll cross that bridge when I come to it.

View attachment 237464


Nothing is screwed down in the photos below however it shows well enough the position of the lock against the flat on the barrel (I realise the tang isn’t set down completely in these pics but even when it is there is still a slight gap between it and the barrel at the lower edge)

View attachment 237470


View attachment 237469



View attachment 237468
You're correct in doing your research first! Some guy is no doubt going to get on here and (joking!) come up with a plan to drill 3 holes, in order to insure ignition! (joke!) :p
 
Nice job.
I'm not certain how it lined up in the end, but looking at the first picture of your lock on the barrel, makes it look like God was aiming a center punch right where the TH should be. There is a light reflection exactly where I'd expect the TH to be best positioned.
God likes (traditional) muzzleloaders.
 
Good clean work and well done following the procedure for compensating for parts that are not positioned correctly to to begin with.

I suspect the "cruddy" appearance of the breech face through your inspection camera was a result of reflections off of preservative grease. Pity they didn't use more of it or the barrel might not have rusted in other places.
 
Thankyou for all the comments and advice guys, I really appreciate the support on this forum.

I’ve almost finished (hopefully) the final assembly of the rifle and with everything now screwed down and snugged up I can see that I landed a little forward of centre of the pan. I’m disappointed as I really thought that I’d been quite careful and exact with this, I guess at least I got the height correct.

Sadly the slight gap between breech and tang is still there but otherwise everything seems firm and well fitting....so far....:

IMG_5036.JPG
 

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