Philadelphia Derringer Help!

[rcbif]

Got this little thing today at a gunshow for 10 bucks. It's missing the trigger guard, and is otherwise complete.

But I do have a concern...... The slight gap as shown below. Is this normal? How is this barrel assembly made? Is the barrel screwed in separate from the rear trunnion/tang part? Think it's safe to fire, or leave it as a shelf piece?
And finally, anybody know where I can get a TG for it? Thanks!

Gap is more visible on right side/top than left side/top.

left side

bottom ( looks like a bit of grinding?)

 

[Norinco]

Yes, that gap is normal for such a gun. The breechplug is probably bottomed out, but the fit and finish around that area makes it look otherwise.

 

[George]

I wouldn't guess about the safety of the gun from a picture, but not all of them were made that way. I have one and you cannot feel the joint, can only really see it because of the different colors of the metals.

Spence

 

[rabjr]

You actually got a good one. A friend gave me a kit derringer to put together for him a while back. I couldn't believe what I saw when I examined the barrel/breech. They had screwed the barrel on an 1/8" to 1/4" past the line up of the flats and their way of fixing it?? :shocked2: They just filed the barrel to meet up with the breech which in turn placed the front sight at a cant. :shake: Just gave me another reason to hate the company that sold the kit. Theres absolutely no reason to produce junk like that no matter how cheap it is. :shake:

 

[rcbif]

Ok. Since I doubt the gun is accurate, I'll probably just use it for making noise. What would be a good charge to try? 20g of FFFG for a start?

I'll probably stop by a local muzzle-loading store unless I can get some more opinions on the gap before firing it. It does pop caps good though.

 

[George]

What would be a good charge to try? 20g of FFFG for a start?

I shot 15-25 grains FFFg and a patched .440 ball in mine. Here's a link you might enjoy showing the building and shooting of the gun, and he tested 30 and 40 grains FFFg.
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2008/03/05/building-a-blackpowder-kit-pistol/

Spence

 

[rawhide]

looks like a cva kit or jukers I had one awile back fun to shoot. mite try dixe gun works or tow for a tg.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

Those are fun little guns, I've owned and traded off a couple of them and the lady of the house has one now.
The barrel and breechplug are an odd arrangement. Rather than the normal male thread on the breechplug the male thread is on the barrel and the breechplug is female. Why? :idunno:
Yes, noise and display is about all they are good for but you got a steal at the price.

 

[rcbif]

I did look a bit closer at it, and the barrel does say Jukar.I e-mailed dixieguns yesterday to see if they can get me in touch with someone for a TG. I loaded it up today with 20g FFFG, some toilet paper, and a few bb's and put a hole in a pop can from a few feet. Fun little noise shooter.

 

[DOUBLEDEUCE 1]

It looks like you'll need to pin the barrel. I couldn't tell if it was done from the right side of the stock. Also, there is a small wood screw that goes through the tail end of the lock plate. Give Deer Creek a call for the trigger guard. They sell the kits and spare parts.

It was worth the ten bucks. :thumbsup:

 

[mazo kid]

It looks like you'll need to pin the barrel. I couldn't tell if it was done from the right side of the stock. Also, there is a small wood screw that goes through the tail end of the lock plate. Give Deer Creek a call for the trigger guard. They sell the kits and spare parts.
It was worth the ten bucks. :thumbsup:

Yep, the barrel needs to be pinned to the stock. I built a Dixie kit in the 70s and recently traded a buddy for another. Both have escutcheons on either side of the stock for the pin. http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2008/03/05/building-a-blackpowder-kit-pistol/
Spence, thanks for that website!

 

[phoenix511]

You made a good purchase at $10

I've had one since the 1980's probably from Dixie. Lots of fun to shoot with 0.440" ball, 15 grs 3Fg. Mine has a coil spring lock, which was not very "snappy" as supplied. I changed out the coil spring to one more powerful, and honed the lock plate, now works much better, and used lots of grease on the tumbler shaft. Good noisemaker, looks cool with the butt sticking from your vest pocket.

In my tests,0.440 ball/15gr 3Fg would penetrate only one side of an empty aluminum beverage at 25' so don't expect much from it.

 

[rcbif]

You made a good purchase at $10

In my tests,0.440 ball/15gr 3Fg would penetrate only one side of an empty aluminum beverage at 25' so don't expect much from it.

Well I picked up some supplies from The Log Cabin Store in Lodi Ohio and got it all complete. It turns out that a TG from a Traditions pistol is an exact match. It cost what I paid for the pistol, but I think I still came out ahead :grin:

With the above stated load I penetrated a pop can full of water and one layer of a cardboard box at 2ft :haha: However this is perfect power for what I want, so I dont have to worry about a ball ricocheting and hitting a development behind my woods.

Here she is. Not sure if I will re-stain it to match my Traditions Trapper Pistol or not :hmm:

 

[Zonie]

The barrel should have an underlug on the bottom about 1" - 1 1/2" from the muzzle.

If it does, you should layout exactly where the center of the lug is and drill a cross hole thru the stock and the underlug for a pin.
The pin holds the front part of the barrel in the stock.

If the barrel doesn't have an underlug there you should add one and then drill the hole for the cross pin.

My original CVA had a .137 diameter pin but a 3/32 or 1/8" pin would work fine.

 

[mazo kid]

The barrel should have an underlug on the bottom about 1" - 1 1/2" from the muzzle.

If it does, you should layout exactly where the center of the lug is and drill a cross hole thru the stock and the underlug for a pin.
The pin holds the front part of the barrel in the stock.If the barrel doesn't have an underlug there you should add one and then drill the hole for the cross pin.My original CVA had a .137 diameter pin but a 3/32 or 1/8" pin would work fine.

I agree with putting the pin in place. You wouldn't even have to use an escutcheon, or you could simply make plain small brass ones up.

 

[Zonie]

I don't think a person would even need a home made escutcheon unless they wanted to "dress it up a bit".

Lots of guns, pistols included that just have a pin holding the barrel into the stock.