H2O2-- Never again!

[StewartLeach]

Well, I guess I just had to try it. After reading and hearing about how quickly a witch's brew of soap, water and hydrogen peroxide can clean a barrel I mixed it up and applied it to my heavily fouled 40 caliber squirrel rifle. Dismounted the lock, plugged the vent with a toothpick, wrapped a rag around the muzzle to catch spills, poured the solution down the barrel and let it sit for enough time to drop the lock in a plastic tub of warm water and dish soap (my usual cleaning solution).

Instant iron oxide formation!!!!! First thing I noticed was rust in the little scratches on the end of the barrel left by cutting off the patch strip after starting the ball. Dumped the solution and started dry patching. Every patch was rust stained. Alarming, to say the least.

Patched several times with water only to remove the evil mixture, then dried with many patches, including my usual procedure of running a dry patch clear to the breech plug then standing the rifle upside down for a few minutes. Final patch was with BC's Barricade.

What experiences have others had with H2O2?

White Fox

 

[coloradoclyde]

Puzzling because it works well for so many people but not for others. I wonder if it is the materials and methods that you used or some other factor coming into play......perhaps an adverse chemical reaction.
I have never had an issue. I mix equal parts murphy's oil soap, store bought hydrogen peroxide and rubbing alcohol. I do not use Ballistol and I never let the solution soak in the barrel.
I either wipe in wipe off...or us the pump method and a nipple bottle. for a flintlock I use the dump and pour method and I use real BP (goex) only. :idunno:

 

[Grizzly Adams]

It may work for some, and it my wreak havoc on others- by that token, it's not worth the risk to me. :idunno:

 

[necchi]

I was ready to write a big long story,,
,,nah, ain't gonna do it again.
short,, no need for h2o2.
:idunno: it's a myth from folks that don't understand what h2o2 or h2o h2so4 means.(period)

 

[coloradoclyde]

At risk of starting an argument I am going to give you my opinion.

Rust is steel or iron that is actively oxidizing. Bluing, Browning and magnetite are forms of passivized steel, and they are highly resistant to rusting and will not flash rust unless the passivized layer is removed.
Before I condemn the hydrogen peroxide I would examine the condition of the steel.

Steel that comes out of a caustic tank will flash rust almost instantaneously. As does virgin steel fresh from the hearth. Steel from a steel mill has been acid treated to passivize it so its not a complete rust ball by the time it gets to the customer.
Just something to consider. :v

 

[necchi]

Well said, :bow:

 

[Stumpkiller]

Told ya.

H2O2 is unstable and gives up O. Iron(Fe) likes O and makes Fe3O4. Iron Oxide. Aka: Rust.

Also - chlorine depassifies steel (even stainless steel will rust after a chlorine exposure). So if you use tap water from a municipal source you are aiding in that.

 

[coloradoclyde]

I have well water...heat will also depassivate stainless steel. but it is easy to repassivate.
Clorine will also pit stainless and remove chrome.

 

[Flint62Smoothie]

I just use dihydrogen monoxide ...

Simple, dirt cheap and available everywhere!

 

[coloradoclyde]

That stuff is so corrosive it can disintegrate entire mountains. :grin:

 

[Twisted_1in66]

Well, I guess I just had to try it. After reading and hearing about how quickly a witch's brew of soap, water and hydrogen peroxide can clean a barrel I mixed it up and applied it to my heavily fouled 40 caliber squirrel rifle.

***SNIP***

What experiences have others had with H2O2?

White Fox

Your problem is that you added water instead of the 91% isopropyl alcohol to the mix. It should be 16 oz. Murphy's Oil Soap, 16 oz. 91% Isopropyl Alcohol, and 16 oz. Hydrogen Peroxide (H2O2). That's commonly referred to as MAP (Murphy's, Alcohol, Peroxide) solution. I mix mine in a 48 oz. container and pour it into smaller bottles to take in the field with me. Hydrogen peroxide and water will ALWAYS cause rust. Notice there is no water in MAP. If you mix the H2O2 with Murphy's Oil Soap and don't include the alcohol, it will also rust. The Isopropyl Alcohol mixed in with Hydrogen Peroxide and Murphy's Oil Soap stops the rust and keeps the cleaning properties of the H2O2.

Had a chemist friend explain why the alcohol stops the hydrogen peroxide from causing rust, but doubt that I could repeat why. However, I've used it for about 16 years now and never had a problem with rust. It works great!

Mix up a batch leaving out the water and including the alcohol this time and give it a try. Be sure to use the 91% alcohol and not the 72%. Both are usually on the shelf next to each other. If you want to mix a smaller or larger batch, just be sure to use equal amounts of each ingredient.

Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:

 

[AZbpBurner]

After several decades of effective hot soapy water bore cleaning, I've never felt it necessary to use any other 'witches brews'.

 

[Dave Marsh]

After several decades of effective hot soapy water bore cleaning, I've never felt it necessary to use any other 'witches brews'.

+1 Amen. :thumbsup:

 

[Spikebuck]

After several decades of effective hot soapy water bore cleaning, I've never felt it necessary to use any other 'witches brews'.

+1 :thumbsup:

Early on I tried some commercially available cleaners, but nothing seems to clean any better than plain old water. Available everywhere...free...effective. Can't see getting better than that!

Only time I use anything else is on the smoothbore to get the lead out from time to time.

 

[MacRob46]

Well, I guess I just had to try it. After reading and hearing about how quickly a witch's brew of soap, water and hydrogen peroxide can clean a barrel I mixed it up and applied it to my heavily fouled 40 caliber squirrel rifle. Dismounted the lock, plugged the vent with a toothpick, wrapped a rag around the muzzle to catch spills, poured the solution down the barrel and let it sit for enough time to drop the lock in a plastic tub of warm water and dish soap (my usual cleaning solution).

Instant iron oxide formation!!!!! First thing I noticed was rust in the little scratches on the end of the barrel left by cutting off the patch strip after starting the ball. Dumped the solution and started dry patching. Every patch was rust stained. Alarming, to say the least.

Patched several times with water only to remove the evil mixture, then dried with many patches, including my usual procedure of running a dry patch clear to the breech plug then standing the rifle upside down for a few minutes. Final patch was with BC's Barricade.

What experiences have others had with H2O2?

White Fox

I have used it for 26 years with never a bit of rust. You have to dry the bore thoroughly then liberally oil it. You certainly should not have instant formation of rust. I use two parts denatured alcohol, two parts Murphy's Oil Soap and two parts peroxide. Maybe your mixture is the problem. I also plug the barrel with my thumb, touch hole with a toothpick and slosh the solution around a bit. It seldom stays in the barrel longer than 30 seconds. Second application if needed.

 

[The O'Dea]

-Lads,
Has anyone tried to turn lead bars into gold? I for one have not, and that's why for the past fifty(50) plus years I have used nothing but soap 'n water! No rust, no fuss. Back in the early 60's I took up shooting muzzle loading, and I was taught by these gentlemen who were my age now. They knew what they were about! AND, I still to this day blow down the barrel of my original M1841 rifle with the Bill Large barrel.
Life is good

-The Irish Mick
Arizona Territory

 

[Dewey]

The only way for the isopropyl alcohol to stop H2O2 from forming rust would be for them to react to produce acetone. But I doubt that that happens to any great extent unless the barrel metal is acting as a catalyst. Usually, a chemist would use 30% hydrogen peroxide to do that reaction, not 3%.

Myself, I clean with warm water and soap.

(Murphy's oil soap, which bty does NOT contain oil - it contains potassium soap manufactured from vegetable oil. The other constituents of Murphy Oil Soap are sodium EDTA, propylene glycol, fragrance, surfactants, and water).

The water will dissolve the potassium salts in the fouling just fine with no need for the peroxide, and the soap will help take care of any water insoluble compounds. Scrubbing is needed - not just soaking! Then rinse with water, dry well and oil/grease to protect the metal.

At the range, I do use a modified NMLRA mix of isopropanol, Murphy's and water (no peroxide) sprayed on a cleaning patch to wipe the barrel after every couple of shots.

Just my $ 0.02 .....

 

[Billnpatti]

There are many witch's brews for cleaning your gun. :stir: I think they are the result of many people simply looking for a better way of getting that crud out of their rifle's bore. I could be wrong but I seriously doubt that there is a better and/or cheaper way of doing it than just plain old soap and water. It just simply does the job quickly, easily and cheaply. I don't think you can improve much on that. But, inquiring minds want to know and far be it from me to stifle curiosity and inquiry. I must admit to having tried all sorts of brews to clean my rifle. I have finally settled on plain old soap and water as the best way to get the crud out. But, that's just me and I fully realize that there are many people out there who have their own "perfect" cleaning brew. Oh well, not everyone can be right......just me. :rotf: :rotf:

 

[coloradoclyde]

I am sure that if someone conducted a poll, that water or soap and water would be at the top by a mile ....and rightfully so.

But there are other ways to skin a cat.
Such is the joy of muzzleloading....It's a DIY dream. :grin:

 

[bpd303]

I use the witches brew MAP when away from the homestead, then clean thoroughly when I return with soap & water. That along with 3in1 oil to protect has worked decades for me.