Fusile vs Fowler for future Smoothrifle

Discussion in 'Smoothbore' started by Jfoster, Feb 25, 2019.

Help Support Muzzle Loading Forum by donating:

  1. Feb 25, 2019 #1

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    36 Cal.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Messages:
    206
    Likes Received:
    9
    Hello all. Im trying to decide between fusile or fowler to do a smooth rifle with. Ive found both in a kit format that offer a rear sight. My concern is butt area of the stock itself. I am very familiar with modern rifle/shotgun stocks in terms of shape and drop which it appears most colonial style fowlers stocks resemble. Im concerned with the fusile that the stock may be uncomfortable or awkward when fielding. Im sure it was designed the way it was for a reason, but wanted to see if others have came across issues in the past. Plan is a 20ga. Game will be mostly deer/turkey/squirrel/rabbit. I will occasionally wing shoot with whatever i go with. Not sure if that info will help.

    Thanks for any help
     
  2. Feb 25, 2019 #2

    Comfortably_Numb

    Comfortably_Numb

    Comfortably_Numb

    40 Cal

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2019
    Messages:
    326
    Likes Received:
    82
    Location:
    Dark Side of the Moon
    Define: Fusil. Define: Fowler. Define: smooth rifle.
     
    Cruzatte likes this.
  3. Feb 25, 2019 #3

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    36 Cal.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Messages:
    206
    Likes Received:
    9
    Fusil- Specific model would be Fusil Ordinaire type D.

    Fowler- colonial or virginia tyle fowling piece with a stock profile more akin to that of a rifle.

    Smoothrifle- smoothbore 20ga tapered octagon to round. 42”. With a rear sight.
     
  4. Feb 25, 2019 #4

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    36 Cal.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Messages:
    206
    Likes Received:
    9
    Fusil- Specific model would be Fusil de
    I am essentially trying to build one hunting long arm to cover the most game. Having hunted many years with slug guns as well as buckshot through rifles sights, i just prefer to have a rear sight for reference. I have used them for everything from deer to dove. My main concern is the stock profile at the butt. I dont suspect there to be any issues with the fusil (which i am leaning toward), but wanted to check with those who have gone before me.
     
  5. Feb 25, 2019 #5

    Comfortably_Numb

    Comfortably_Numb

    Comfortably_Numb

    40 Cal

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2019
    Messages:
    326
    Likes Received:
    82
    Location:
    Dark Side of the Moon
    Fusil De chasse can be vey punishing with the curved comb. I have never been able to shoot any of the "off the shelf " guns with out a belt in the cheek. Generally something with a straight upper comb with about 1 1/2" drop at the nose and 2 3/4" at the heel fits most people pretty well. I have never been able to wing shoot with anything with a rear sight, maybe others can, but I can't. I have never needed a rear sight on any smooth bore except a turkey gun with a lot of choke. Of course turkeys are generally standing still so it's pretty much like shooting a rifle.
    You might consider a 16ga, you'll do a lot more small game hunting than deer hunting and the 16 will shoot shot better.
     
    Treestalker likes this.
  6. Feb 25, 2019 #6

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    36 Cal.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Messages:
    206
    Likes Received:
    9
    The “punishment” is something i was concerned with because of the curved comb.
     
  7. Feb 25, 2019 #7

    Treestalker

    Treestalker

    Treestalker

    45 Cal. MLF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    916
    Likes Received:
    99
    Sounds like a great project; but if you're going to shoot up trees at squirrels, don't put too much drop in the buttstock, if you do, when you raise the gun to shoot with the butt on your shoulder, the barrel will 'climb' far above your line of sight. If it is too shallow, you will be uncomfortable shooting level at game off the shoulder. Try to get a ML gunsmith to fit you up before you purchase a gun, if you can't, I find a drop of about 3 inches more or less is good (for me). 20 ga seems a little light to me for turkey, but I've never hunted them. For all around use, you can always load it heavier. I would probably build a fowler style, choked a little, a smooth rifle is just that, a rifle with a smooth bore that back in the day was probably used more with a patched ball. It was less expensive to build. Good luck and keep us informed of your choice and results! Truly, George.
     
  8. Feb 25, 2019 #8

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    36 Cal.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Messages:
    206
    Likes Received:
    9
    3.25” is the stated drop on the particular fusil i was looking at. However i feel i will more than likely go with a colonial style fowler in the end that has more of a rifle style stock.
     
  9. Feb 25, 2019 #9

    Treestalker

    Treestalker

    Treestalker

    45 Cal. MLF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2014
    Messages:
    916
    Likes Received:
    99
    Right on!
     
  10. Feb 25, 2019 #10

    54ball

    54ball

    54ball

    62 Cal.

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2004
    Messages:
    2,745
    Likes Received:
    104
     
  11. Feb 25, 2019 #11

    jackley

    jackley

    jackley

    40 Cal.

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2012
    Messages:
    416
    Likes Received:
    144
    Location:
    Wyoming at the base of the Big Horns
    I shoot skeet, trap, sporting clays with english fowlers, NWT gun, SXS's in flint and percussion. Hunt over 100 days a year upland game hunting with the afore mentioned guns.
    With that being said. I have killed bear, deer, elk and turkeys with a fusil de chasse in 20 ga.. Have never had problems with recoil. But I have never hit anything flying with it. I"m sure there are people that can but I can't. The drop in the stock is just to much for me.
    Jerry
     
  12. Feb 25, 2019 #12

    tenngun

    tenngun

    tenngun

    Cannon

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2008
    Messages:
    9,495
    Likes Received:
    756
    Location:
    Republic mo
    My Centermark TFC is my favorite gun. The Centermark is less then a perfect copy of the originalbut the general stock shape is very close to the originals. And I find it very comfortable.
    A smooth rifle was also called a rifle mounted fusil back in the day was just that, a rifle with a smooth bore. It ain’t made for wing shooting.
    The officers fusil wasn’t made as a hunting gun. It’s lighter and easier to handle then a musket, and better made, it will put meat in the freezer and pay you back in fun for the money invested.
    The colonal fowler is made for fowling, but will handle ball well of the three choices the fowler is probably the closest to the one gun that does it all. In twenty bore it will drop everything from Rocky to Bulwinlke, old Tom Bambi and Thumper.
    The other choices will do it all to. Learning your gun an building the muscles memory to shoot your gun well is more important then shape. But my hats off to any old boy that could take a dove or two with a smooth rifle. I would rather hunt a moose with a fowler then dove with a smooth rifle.
     
  13. Feb 25, 2019 #13

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    36 Cal.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Messages:
    206
    Likes Received:
    9
    Thanks Tenngun. Always appreciate your input.
     
  14. Feb 25, 2019 #14

    54ball

    54ball

    54ball

    62 Cal.

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2004
    Messages:
    2,745
    Likes Received:
    104
    In my opinion this the best English Smoothbore available.
    http://dunlapwoodcrafts.com/component-sets/english-fowler-rifle

    A 10 or 12 can do anything a 20 can do but....better,;) at least for upland game.
    Her's on on the CM blog....Gosh what a nice Gun..
    http://contemporarymakers.blogspot.com/2015/06/rifle-by-ed-wenger.html

    Challenging build?" You dern tootin" but all really great guns are.

    Here's another goodie....

    https://www.flintlocks.com/RK-06.htm

    and another...

    https://www.flintlocks.com/RK-07.htm

    I do believe the Chambers Smooth rifle is based off of RCA 118 (or 119 if I'm mistaken) ...the Haymaker rifle.

    One thing about these English guns and Lancaster Rifles, they have a lot of English influence. Modern shooters tend to really like the looks and feel of English guns and Lancasterian Rifles.
     
  15. Feb 25, 2019 #15

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    36 Cal.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Messages:
    206
    Likes Received:
    9
    I really like the RK07, but alas i am devil handed. Thus compounding the situation.
     
  16. Feb 25, 2019 #16

    54ball

    54ball

    54ball

    62 Cal.

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2004
    Messages:
    2,745
    Likes Received:
    104
    Talk to Barbie or Jim Chambers....

    Request the RK-O6 PA Fowler as the architecture is so similar with no lock inlet and no sideplate inlet. See if they can special order that for you. You may have to wait on it. It's worth a shot.

    Then.....substitute a LH Siler for the lock.

    Inletting a lock is not a big deal.

    I just checked their FAQ and looks like this is doable.
    Can certain inlets, such as the sideplate, be omitted?
    On special orders, yes. However, no special ordered stocks may be returned, and delivery time will be longer. There is no additional charge for this service, however.
     
  17. Feb 26, 2019 #17

    plmeek

    plmeek

    plmeek

    40 Cal.

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2007
    Messages:
    278
    Likes Received:
    47
    Location:
    Denver, CO
    Check out Danny Caywood's website (http://www.caywoodguns.com/). He offers just about everything you are considering and many of his models are offered RH or LH.
     
    Cruzatte likes this.
  18. Feb 26, 2019 #18

    Toklo Etee

    Toklo Etee

    Toklo Etee

    32 Cal

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2018
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    28
    Not all French guns have the "cows foot"....this Fusil Fin has a straight comb. Some of the Fusil Fin parts recovered in the South also had a unique rear sight as well
     

    Attached Files:

  19. Feb 26, 2019 #19

    Toklo Etee

    Toklo Etee

    Toklo Etee

    32 Cal

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2018
    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    28
    Sorry about the inverted image.....these guns have long barrels...48"+
    The last picture is of the R E Davis Fine Fusil kit
     

    Attached Files:

  20. Feb 26, 2019 #20

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    Jfoster

    36 Cal.

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2014
    Messages:
    206
    Likes Received:
    9

Share This Page



arrow_white