First build. Looking for advice on how to start.

[Tx635]

I am looking to build a rifle from this kit. I'm looking at this one from track of the wolf. I'm planning on building it during the summer after I move into and get settled in my new apartment. I do have some carpentry experience as well as access to either the majority of tools I've seen being used to build some rifles or could acquire them if need been. I've been in construction mostly masonry but have done most things in this profession.
I would like to make a rifle similar to what would have been used on the Lewis and Clark expedition.
What I'm mostly wondering is if this is a good rifle to start with. I have patience and time and a willingness to learn, but if it seems too hard in your experience than I'll go to the drawing board and calm my expectations.

 

[Grenadier1758]

The 15 rifles that Lewis brought from Harper's Ferry have long been a debatable topic. The 1792 rifles in storage were often reported as being unserviceable after 12 years of hard use. Also the 49 caliber was considered too small for the needs on the western prairies and mountains. Some speculate that the 1792 contract rifles were refurbished with the interchangeable parts of the 1803 lock and the barrel bored out to 54 caliber. This is the rifle that Don Stith believes to be the rifle carried on the expedition.

The kit offered by Track of the Wolf will be an assemblage of parts much like kits offered by many suppliers. There will be a lot of work that will be very different from the masonry experience. A kit like the TotW kit will be a challenge for a first time builder. If you have mentor to work with, a successful construction can be done.

 

[JeffG]

I wouldn't touch that kit, until I read this book, cover-to-cover.

 

[Tx635]

The 15 rifles that Lewis brought from Harper's Ferry have long been a debatable topic. The 1792 rifles in storage were often reported as being unserviceable after 12 years of hard use. Also the 49 caliber was considered too small for the needs on the western prairies and mountains. Some speculate that the 1792 contract rifles were refurbished with the interchangeable parts of the 1803 lock and the barrel bored out to 54 caliber. This is the rifle that Don Stith believes to be the rifle carried on the expedition.

The kit offered by Track of the Wolf will be an assemblage of parts much like kits offered by many suppliers. There will be a lot of work that will be very different from the masonry experience. A kit like the TotW kit will be a challenge for a first time builder. If you have mentor to work with, a successful construction can be done.

I don't have a mentor. I'll mostly be working off YouTube videos and books for the vast majority.

 

[tenngun]

You tube has some good videos by Bill Raby, Dualist 54 and Kibler on gun building.
Track sells some good building books
I built my first gun in ‘78, and learned more from watching Bill Raby then from books I’ve read
But
Don’t pass up the books.
Track offers a kit for the 1792 and 98 contract rifle that was thought to be the rifles L and C carried .

 

[Tx635]

I wouldn't touch that kit, until I read this book, cover-to-cover.

View attachment 79473

This is the book every video I've seen mention. I'm looking to get a copy of it.

 

[Grenadier1758]

You'll need that book recommended by @Jeff Gleason.

 

[Tx635]

You tube has some good videos by Bill Raby, Dualist 54 and Kibler on gun building.
Track sells some good building books
I built my first gun in ‘78, and learned more from watching Bill Raby then from books I’ve read
But
Don’t pass up the books.
Track offers a kit for the 1792 and 98 contract rifle that was thought to be the rifles L and C carried .

Absolutely. Definitely won't pass up anything to help me learn in this endeavor.

 

[Mule333]

Hi Tx, and welcome. I’m new to building also. Just started a new build myself.

To get to the point. Read books on the subject and watch YouTube videos on building long rifles. Watch Bill Raby’s YouTube videos.

The 2 books I’ve been reading are:


There are many great people here that will help in the details. One of the major things I’ve learned so far is the attention to detail. It’s the little things us “noobs” miss that cause problems later.

Hope this helps. And good luck.

 

[Tx635]

Hi Tx, and welcome. I’m new to building also. Just started a new build myself.

To get to the point. Read books on the subject and watch YouTube videos on building long rifles. Watch Bill Raby’s YouTube videos.

The 2 books I’ve been reading are:
View attachment 79471View attachment 79472

There are many great people here that will help in the details. One of the major things I’ve learned so far is the attention to detail. It’s the little things us “noobs” miss that cause problems later.

Hope this helps. And good luck.

Absolutely I have been watching a lot of those build videos on various types of kits and other builds. I do have a fairly good attention to detail I think will help a lot.

 

[Hatchet-Jack]

In addition to the already mentioned book these are the other books that are recommended:

 

[Tx635]

In addition to the already mentioned book these are the other books that are recommended:

View attachment 79475

Those ones are also highly recommend in those videos as well. I'm glad to see theirs consensus on literature. It'll definitely make things easier to understand and ask questions if I need to

 

[steg49]

I started build as Peter Alexander had a monthly article in Muzzle Blast. Each Month I would take another step forward. I used almost exclusive hand tools (non-powered) except for a hand drill for holes that went all the way through the stock and for drilling metal parts. That series (now The gunsmith of Grenville County) showed me the way. One thing I didn't learn right away is that you get the best piece of wood you can. Your going to spend a lot of time making that rifle it might as well look great. I would spend hours at the work bench and not even know how long I had been there. A great feeling when your done and you have a nice rifle that you made. Have fun. steg49

 

[Zutt-man]

I love seeing questions like this. I’m in the same situation, but it also means more are falling into the helpless addiction

 

[Tx635]

I started build as Peter Alexander had a monthly article in Muzzle Blast. Each Month I would take another step forward. I used almost exclusive hand tools (non-powered) except for a hand drill for holes that went all the way through the stock and for drilling metal parts. That series (now The gunsmith of Grenville County) showed me the way. One thing I didn't learn right away is that you get the best piece of wood you can. Your going to spend a lot of time making that rifle it might as well look great. I would spend hours at the work bench and not even know how long I had been there. A great feeling when your done and you have a nice rifle that you made. Have fun. steg49

That sounds amazing. I've done quite a few things that I have worked on like that. I'll definitely put that book on the list.

 

[dave_person]

Hi TX635,
Welcome and good luck with your project. The contract rifle kit from TOW looks like it will make a very unbalanced and barrel heavy gun. However, that is historically correct because most contract rifles were heavy, clumsy, and many were poorly made. What rifles L&C carried is unknown and the papers arguing for contract rifles and those for a Harper's Ferry prototype short rifles are based on weak circumstantial evidence. There is an original short rifle styled like the Harper's Ferry model 1803 rifle with number 15 that is purported to be one of those carried by L&C. The Rifle Shoppe even sells a parts set for it. Still there is no widely accepted "smoking gun". Regardless, if you want a nice handling and historically consistent rifle for the late 18th and early 19th centuries, there are better choices. Kits by Jim Kibler would be the easiest to build, particularly if you have limited work space in an apartment. They are hands down the best produced kits you can buy and as close to "snap together" as you will find. The end results are fine guns, shaped correctly, and very shootable. However, if you want to do more hands on work to acquire skills, kits by Jim Chambers are a good option. They offer a wider variety of guns that are historically consistent and include excellent quality components. TOW kits can be pretty good but I would urge you to get one that fits a swamped barrel not a straight one. The best book, IMO, for step by step instruction is Dixon's "The Art of Building the Pennsylvania Rifle" . Peter Alexander's book is more comprehensive but it was produced from a collection of articles he published individually so it is disjointed as a step by step guide. Be very careful using videos on You Tube. Jim Kibler's and Bill Raby's videos are good but there are many that are absolutely terrible by folks who don't know what they are doing. As with every thing on the internet, you have to glean kernels from a lot of chaff. One of the biggest problems for new builders is most really don't know what a traditional flintlock long rifle looks like. They miss how the wrist and lock panels were shaped, the slimness of the fore stock, and many other details despite looking at photos. The advantage of Kibler's kits is when you are done, you will have an excellent model for what a real long rifle looks like designed by a master builder. The trade off is that 99% of the work is done by Jim's CNC assisted machinery and you cannot change much to suit your tastes and you won't learn many inletting and shaping skills. Less finished kits like Chambers will require you learn more skills and allows more individuality but the trade off is you can also have greater risk of mistakes and getting the styling and details wrong.

Visit this link to see a Kibler kit assembled by a master builder and you can see what a superb design it is.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/kibler-colonial-kit-assembled.132856/page-2Keep in mind that Dave's version has engraving and carving superior to what is found on original long rifles.


dave

 

[Tx635]

Hi TX635,
Welcome and good luck with your project. The contract rifle kit from TOW looks like it will make a very unbalanced and barrel heavy gun. However, that is historically correct because most contract rifles were heavy, clumsy, and many were poorly made. What rifles L&C carried is unknown and the papers arguing for contract rifles and those for a Harper's Ferry prototype short rifles are based on weak circumstantial evidence. There is an original short rifle styled like the Harper's Ferry model 1803 rifle with number 15 that is purported to be one of those carried by L&C. The Rifle Shoppe even sells a parts set for it. Still there is no widely accepted "smoking gun". Regardless, if you want a nice handling and historically consistent rifle for the late 18th and early 19th centuries, there are better choices. Kits by Jim Kibler would be the easiest to build, particularly if you have limited work space in an apartment. They are hands down the best produced kits you can buy and as close to "snap together" as you will find. The end results are fine guns, shaped correctly, and very shootable. However, if you want to do more hands on work to acquire skills, kits by Jim Chambers are a good option. They offer a wider variety of guns that are historically consistent and include excellent quality components. TOW kits can be pretty good but I would urge you to get one that fits a swamped barrel not a straight one. The best book, IMO, for step by step instruction is Dixon's "The Art of Building the Pennsylvania Rifle" . Peter Alexander's book is more comprehensive but it was produced from a collection of articles he published individually so it is disjointed as a step by step guide. Be very careful using videos on You Tube. Jim Kibler's and Bill Raby's videos are good but there are many that are absolutely terrible by folks who don't know what they are doing. As with every thing on the internet, you have to glean kernels from a lot of chaff. One of the biggest problems for new builders is most really don't know what a traditional flintlock long rifle looks like. They miss how the wrist and lock panels were shaped, the slimness of the fore stock, and many other details despite looking at photos. The advantage of Kibler's kits is when you are done, you will have an excellent model for what a real long rifle looks like designed by a master builder. The trade off is that 99% of the work is done by Jim's CNC assisted machinery and you cannot change much to suit your tastes and you won't learn many inletting and shaping skills. Less finished kits like Chambers will require you learn more skills and allows more individuality but the trade off is you can also have greater risk of mistakes and getting the styling and details wrong.

Visit this link to see a Kibler kit assembled by a master builder and you can see what a superb design it is.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/kibler-colonial-kit-assembled.132856/page-2Keep in mind that Dave's version has engraving and carving superior to what is found on original long rifles.


dave

I do have access to a farm Owned by my cousin and a work space in his pole barn. So space won't be too big a problem for building it. I've seen the arguments from multiple sides on these rifles. It seems like their isn't much consensus on it, but this rifle seems like a good starting point to me to get close to what may have been carried.
I may do a few of the upgrades that where proposed to may have been done, namely having the barrel in .54 cal vs .50cal wich also is offered by track of the wolf but also adding the sling swivels would be great if I do take it into the woods.
As for it's balance, I'm not too worried about that. I don't shoot much these days but it's generally nothing too intensive or strenuous. I'm mostly looking to gain the skills and have something that I could shoot and hunt with on occasion if I want to. I do also love the very plain look of this rifle too, nothing fancy or flashy, just a nice modest looking rifle that will get the job done.

 

[Vaino]

Some thoughts on a first MLer......Kibler's offerings assemble into quality LRs, but are lacking as far as learning to build LRs.....although the finished product if done properly will show one how a LR should look.

The pasts sets { these are not simple kits} on the market will much better teach one how to build a LR or other choice of MLer. .....Fred

 

[Tx635]

Some thoughts on a first MLer......Kibler's offerings assemble into quality LRs, but are lacking as far as learning to build LRs.....although the finished product if done properly will show one how a LR should look.

The pasts sets { these are not simple kits} on the market will much better teach one how to build a LR or other choice of MLer. .....Fred

What is a pasts sets? Is it something like that kit or totally different?

 

[Versanaut]

Tx635,

Lots of good advice here. I can tell you, I did EXACTLY what you are considering doing. I am handy with my hands, mostly an aircraft technician though. I followed mostly YT videos. I had basic tools and bought a couple files and a couple inletting chisels. I bought a full length unfinished kit from sitting fox. Had the barrel channel cut, the ramrod hole bored out, and the lock 80% inlet. I built the rifle on a small foldable table with a couple trips to the garage for the metal work. It won't win any ribbons for historical accuracy, but it looks great and shoots very well.

Good luck!