Cylinder Replacement on a 51 Navy Replica

[bang]

Hi Jake, unfortunately I do not know anyone else with an 1851, be nice if I did though. And there seems to be total of about 0.07 inches of 'slop' in the rotation of the cylinder with the hammer at full cock. This measurement is the same for all six positions. Additionally, the ratchet notches on the back of the cylinder seem to be unworn. It is hard to say about the state of the hand itself but the fact that it extends enough to engage the bolt and lock the cylinder leads me to believe that it is okay.

Does the bolt lug fit solid in the frame slot?
If markings on cylinder match frame indicating correct cylinder I wonder if the bolt has been replaced with too narrow of lug width or has been badly fitted.

 

[hawkeye2]

The only markings on the cylinder will be proof marks which won't help match a cylinder to a frame.

 

[TNGhost]

Its hard to say about the correctness of the cylinder, but some stamps on the cylinder to match ones found elsewhere on the firearm. It's also becoming clear that it might be the best option to just deal with it and pick up another one for the price of a new cylinder.

First step in finding a cylinder would be determining the manufacturer as EIG was an importer and did not make the gun. So look for a manufacturers logo on the revolver somewhere, like on the barrel under the loading lever or on the frame. Luciano Giacosa (no longer around)made guns for EIG but there were others as well.

Finding the manufacturer will help in finding a correct cylinder, or one from another maker that may fit.

Just reading some of the stuff you have written I had several thoughts, one is that it is something to do with the cylinder locking up and not necessarily the cylinder itself, like the bolt, which would be an easier cheaper fix than a new cylinder.

Second as someone else mentioned was wear on the back of the cylinder, which should be easy enough to see.

Third also what someone else said in that perhaps that cylinder is not the one that belongs on the gun.

Finally, it is a brasser so the frame being worn may be contributing to the problem, if it looks like it has been well used.

 

[AZbpBurner]

Buy an Uberti orv Pietta replacement. Time is better spent out at the range shooting instead of trying to make the junker work.

 

[jager43478]

Good afternoon,
I have a replica 1851 Navy Colt (Appears to be an EIG replica) that I have fired a few dozen times now and have noticed a major accuracy issue that seems to result from the cylinder's manufacturing. It appears as though not all of the chambers align properly with the barrel when they are in the firing position. This theory is partially confirmed by noticing that the hammer will tend to strike to the right of the cap with varying degrees on the six chambers. Note that the cylinder does lock into position but that position does not line the chamber up with the barrel. I will attach photographs which will hopefully illustrate the issue.

View attachment 40926View attachment 40927

It would seem to me that the easiest solution to this issue would be to replace the cylinder with one that is manufactured with more precision (Uberti, etc.). Does anyone know if this is an option that will work with these EIG replicas? Or if anyone has drawings or dimensions of the cylinders for more mainstream replicas I would also appreciate any links to that data as well which would let me compare the cylinders.

Thank you!

I would try to get a hold of the manufacture. You would probably be opening a can of worms in getting a different manufactures cylinder and spending more money. The cylinder is probably not indexed right.

 

[csaduck]

Brass Frame, that is your problem. Hang it up and go buy a real gun made out of steel.

 

[wobranch]

I agree with Kansas Jake. Use a rod of some sort that will just slip into the barrel with the cylinder cocked on each chamber in turn. The rod should also slide into each cylinder in turn with not catching on the mouth of the cylinder. I had that problem once with a new purchase from Dixie Gun Works. I sent it back and they graciously replaced it with another model. I don't remember the repro model, but it was a repo. Condederate revolver. If it fails the test, just buy a new revolver and use the bad one as a wall hanger.

 

[Rawhide67]

Just pondering here, but, if the bolt was wrong and allowed the cylinder to be out of time, would it not have enough slop left to manually spin the cylinder to the correct position? Especially if we are talking thousandths. Seems to me the geometry between the locking notches, the cylinders, and the ratchet notches is messed up. Either a bad day at the factory, or not the proper part for the gun.

 

[Zonie]

Hello SDS,
The bolt seems to fit into and lock the cylinder in all six positions. What's interesting is that when locked in the top position, each chamber ends up in a different position relative to the hammer and the barrel. This is to say that if cylinder 1 is offset slightly counterclockwise by 0.125 in, cylinder 4 is offset by 0.063. (note: these dimensions are hypothetical, I do not have a way to accurately measure these offsets). I hope this helps clear up what is going on with this firearm.

The fact that the cylinder stops in different places says the cylinder is defective. The cylinder stop notches were machined wrong.

As others have said, you can buy a replacement cylinder but the chances of it fitting correctly are very slim. You would be better off to use this gun as a decorator and hang it on the wall and use the $100+ dollars the replacement cylinder would cost toward buying a new pistol.
Don't forget to look at our Classified Ad's section. Every once in a while, a used cap & ball pistol is offered for sale and the prices are often much better than what you'd pay to buy a new pistol.

 

[FishDFly]

Along with following Zonie's advice on buying used from the Forum, there seems to be some shortages of new pistols.

If the 1860 Army in the classifieds was a Navy, it would not be there now.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Cap, you may be putting expensive lipstick on a pig. If that is an example of quality control it might make it a wall hanger and get a brand new Pietta 1851 Navy in .36 caliber. My experience is Pietta has better quality that Uberti. Uberti may be nicer looking but quality over looks every timee. And my gun rack shows that.
At least that is my opinion.
Bunk

I agree 100%.

Pietta does some annoying things like put lots of wording on their barrels and their color case looks pretty fake, but they are normally fitted and timed properly from the factory.

Ubertis have a nicer cleaner look for sure. Their barrel quality and treatments are also a cut above in quality. BUT, in recent years I've seen many more timing and fitment issues with Ubertis. Almost all of them have arbor problems and other internal flaws.

Bottom line, at least for newer examples of each, Pietta might not look as slick as Uberti but they know how to properly make a Colt sixgun.

Some barrel mods and chamber reaming and slicking up the action (which can be done by anyone) will usually make a fantastic and tight shooter.

I am just about through with Ubertis.

 

[mooman76]

You might just buy a used one that is in good shape or rarely fired. Probably be cheaper in the long run.

 

[sawyer04]

An interesting piece to see if it can be corrected, without hands on, near impossible.