C.T Little 10ga shotgun

Discussion in 'Smoothbore' started by Frontier's, Dec 11, 2019.

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  1. Dec 11, 2019 #1

    Frontier's

    Frontier's

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    Just got this bad boy in. I tore it apart, cleaned it and pulled out a huge oil soaked rag from the breech that was hard and crusty from sitting around for so long. Bore is about as perfect as you could ask for! 1850-60's easily. Lock works beautifully and again, super super clean, strong main spring. Stock has some very old repairs around the tang and lock plate but it looks great and everything is solid. Nipple came right out, cleaned it, greased it reinstalled it. If I had shot or ball, I'd go shoot it! Ramrod appears to be original as well. One side is a loading jag and then it tapers down greatly to around 30 cal and has a loop jag for a cleaning patch. gorgeous walnut stock too. I removed the barrel and tang, wiped everything clean and then wiped on a thick layer of linseed oil and let that soak up before wiping up the excess.
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  2. Dec 11, 2019 #2

    ppg1949

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    I'm green with envy. What a find. Beautiful weapon. Keep us posted on your shooting results. Have fun.
     
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  3. Dec 11, 2019 #3

    Britsmoothy

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  4. Dec 11, 2019 #4

    Feltwad

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    Not a bad find not has old has you think built from parts some original but looks a shooter using shot only for wing game. Enjoy using it and keep your powder dry
    Feltwad
     
  5. Dec 11, 2019 #5

    Frontier's

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    Yes its old. The outside has had a light restoration but the inside shows it age ( in a good way ).

    She'll be getting a patched ball once I measure the bore diameter.

    I did a search and I think the builders name is Charlie Little. Back from Ohio. Sadly that's the only info I can find. Would love to find the years this builder was active.

    Breech end is massive! 1 1/2" across the flats.
     
  6. Dec 11, 2019 #6

    Feltwad

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    The warranted lock would have been made in Birmingham UK or a surrounding town they were shipped to the colonies of which America too k a large amount where the gunsmiths fitted them with new barrels and old . The brown Bess barrel was a favourite I have enclosed a image of one with a Bess barrel which explains better what I mean
    Feltwad
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    Last edited: Dec 11, 2019
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  7. Dec 11, 2019 #7

    Frontier's

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  8. Dec 11, 2019 #8

    Britsmoothy

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    That is a fair lump you got there!
     
  9. Dec 11, 2019 #9

    Frontier's

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    well this is neat! Got some info back from TOW

    British appearance fowler, circa 1820. Trigger guard they said looks like Philadelphia style and that I should do some research on the name around the PA area via tax records. Lock is also 1820 era and has been converted over to percussion.

    Wonder what it would take to convert it back to flintlock.
     
  10. Dec 12, 2019 #10

    Grenadier1758

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    Far too often it is assumed that because a gun has a drum and nipple, the gun was converted from flint. Not necessarily true. I see no indications that there ever was a pan on that lock plate. There is no indication of the holes needed to mount a frizzen spring. There should be two holes along the lower edge of the lock plate. One for the mounting of the spring and one for the tip to provide a location for the frizzen spring tension.

    You have a very nice mid 19th century smoothbore percussion fowling piece. I would leave it as it is.
     
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  11. Dec 12, 2019 #11

    Frontier's

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    You dont see the 2 filled in holes up front?
     
  12. Dec 12, 2019 #12

    Frontier's

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  13. Dec 12, 2019 #13

    Grenadier1758

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    Yup, that's the holes to locate the mainspring. P3091757.JPG

    This is an L&R Manton flint lock converted to percussion. You see three plugged holes. The top one is for the frizzen axle. You can see where the pan was ground off. The bottom two plugged holes are for the screw for the frizzen spring and the other is for the tip on the spring. Between them is the tip for the mainspring.

    The lock you show was created by a craftsman. While he could have removed the pan and plugged the holes, there would still be some visible marks.
     
  14. Dec 12, 2019 #14

    Frontier's

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    Those 2 holes i just showed, are plugged. They have nothing to do with the main spring, unless you meant tge frizzen spring.
     
  15. Dec 12, 2019 #15

    Pukka Bundook

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    Frontiers,
    I don't see the usual rebate in the stock where the flint cock would stop its forward travel.
    Of course, if flint, it May have had a French cock.
    I also think that the Warranted lock is most likely Birmingham, supplied by the boat-load more or less to the US and colonies. Very often these were old locks, re-worked.
    I do not see anything that says 1820, more mid century to my eye, but am not up in US made guns the same as English and European.
    Are you going to brown the barrel to bring out the twist? It should show nicely with the right solution.
    Should make a good sporting gun. Not really designed for a ball.

    Best,
    Richard.
     
  16. Dec 12, 2019 #16

    Frontier's

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    Barrel does not appear to be Damascus. I can wipe some solution on a test spot to see though.
     
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  17. Dec 12, 2019 #17

    Grenadier1758

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    Yes, there are two holes that are plugged in your lock. The plugs are very well done and blend almost invisibly with the lock plate.

    Still the shotgun's architecture seems more 1850 than 1820. Single lock bolt, half stock, and scroll trigger guard are later. The stock is not cut for a stop for a flint lock nor Is there an insert to replace wood where the flint stop plate would be.

    We are entitled to differences of opinion and I am humbly presenting my opinion.
     
  18. Dec 12, 2019 #18

    Frontier's

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    who knows, the lock could have been shaved down quite a bit. Look at those screws how they are almost invisible. I didn't even notice them until track of the wolf pointed that out. They said that lock and fowler design alone is easily 1820s.
     
  19. Dec 12, 2019 #19

    Grenadier1758

    Grenadier1758

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    I did look up J. Tarratt, the lock maker. There are limited references to him and his location is unknown. There are guns that have been found with J. Tarratt and J. Tarratt and Sons locks. There is at least one J. Tarratt marked lock on a flintlock shotgun. No date was associated with that gun. I think it was sold in 2002. The auction picture was quite poor and lock details are blurry. There are a number of percussion pistols with J. Tarratt and Sons or J. Tarratt on the lock. There are also several percussion half stock shotguns dating to 1840 with J. Tarratt engraved locks.

    I will admit that I am doing quite a bit of speculation here. I hesitate to second guess the folks at Track of the Wolf. The lock with its modifications is quite in line with locks made in 1820 and later. More percussion firearms are associated with the J. Tarrattt locks than there are flint locks.

    It is quite likely that your lock was originally a flint lock plate. The pan ground off and expertly finished with nice engraving. The frizzen spring hole was filled and expertly blended into the lock plate. Then the lock was ready to be used as a percussion lock. The finished percussion lock was installed on your smoothbore.
     
  20. Dec 13, 2019 #20

    Grenadier1758

    Grenadier1758

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    Here is a link to a J. Tarratt marked flintlock that is up for auction. There is no date associated with this rifle. https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/50419495_a-relief-carved-lehigh-county-flintlock-rifle
    There are a lot of similarities between the lock on Frontier's shotgun and some interesting differences. The same floral engraving is present on the percussion and the flint hammer. Similar engraving is present on the tail of the lock. It would appear that the tail of the lock was rounded. Note the engraving around the drum on the shotgun . The engraving is all around the drum and centered on the drum. The engraving around the pan on the flintlock is partially around the pan. The front plug is very likely to plug the forward lock bolt. There is one lock bolt on Frontier's shotgun.

    It's interesting to look at the existing examples of guns built with the Tarratt locks. The percussion guns are often drum and nipple. The percussion locks have a squared off tail and are of later in the 19th century fashion.

    Frontier's, you have a fine smoothbore fowling gun. Enjoy it.
     

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