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Same way a chicken with it's head cut off runs around for a while, unless you are young and don't know what to expect the first time you are holding the legs when it's head is cut off. Then instead of running around, it flops all over you covering you with chicken blood. Been there, done that. :grin:
 
For any reader who is really new to shotguns, # 4 shot is not the same thing as #4 Buckshot. Buckshot is much larger in diameter and weight.


#4 shot: = .13 inches in diameter

#4 Buck: -= .24 inches in diameter.
 
my experience is with hunting waterfoul with 16 guage smoothbore flintlock.. .. ive shot ducks setting in the water with number 4 bismuth at 25 yards to have them simply fly off.. i dont have a second shot..black powder guns dont have the volocity that modern guns do. so pennetration is less.. body shots are GREEAT with flying birds where you can retrive them when down..a breast mussle shot when flying will bring a bird down.. this is what i call a typical body shot.. the breast is a very large part of the bird and with three hits to the bird one of them will hit a vital, breast or wing on the average.. but rarely kill it.. especially with black powder.. my favorite place to hunt ducks is an open field with a stream meandering thru it,, if i knock one down with body shot i can retrieve it without a dog.. in the brush, no second shot, small gun(less than 12 guage), big bird, wings down, i personally would go for the head shot.. the head shot is recomended by waterfoul experts for downed bird, 6's at 25 yards just plain clobbers them dead almost every time(six shot bismuth) that ive used. i dont get alot of second shots tho, sometimes there trapped in a creek, swimming ususally down stream.... in many years ive never brought down a goose with a body shot using a single shot smoothbore 16 gauge pass shooting. im sure a killed several but i never was able to retrive them, they never even slowed down in my line of sight.. i broke the hip in one that i jumped and it didnt stop flying until the sececond shot hit the wing.. that was years ago with a side by side pedersoli 10 gauge with big black powder loads and bismuth..(quite expensive to hunt with by the way..) .. if youve been haveing good luck with turkeys with body shots i appologise to anyone that has, . i personally dont think the odds are with it tho with a bird on the ground.... dave
 
Dave: Switch to the newer Heavyshot. It is actually slightly heavier than lead, patterns about the same in the old, original choked guns, and can be used in old guns. It is non-toxic, and meets federal migratory waterfowl standards, too. Every one who has complained about Bismuth shot, and they are the majority, like the new Heavyshot. It might just put you back in the duck hunting game.
 
paulvallandigham said:
Dave: Switch to the newer Heavyshot. It is actually slightly heavier than lead, patterns about the same in the old, original choked guns, and can be used in old guns.
Paul, I thought I read somewhere that HeavyShot was only to be used with "special" shot cups and that it wasn't good for barrels because it was so hard. You're saying that's not true?... can it be used without shot cups in a modern smoothbore muzzleloader barrel?
Thanks.
 
at this point in time bismuth is the best option for muzzeloaders in my opinion.. in cold weather shot cups ive used have blow by with hard fouling and are hard to lube.. ive heard of guys in warmer climate putting lube in the cushion air holes in the bottom of the cup and haveing good luck. it will be up to you to test for yourself, but i prefer traditional loading in flintlock..shot cups wont go by full chockes in some cases, and i dont know if they will work in a jug choke.. but if patterned, and tested for pennetration bismuth has worked well for me for over 15 years or abouts... it is hard to get out of the bore, but ive found that kleen bore lead removeal cloth works pretty fair after a good steel wooling, but i wouldnt advise doing this but once a year after water fouling season.. dave.
 
Heavy shot will shread the inside of you barrel if you don't have it in the specially made shot cup. It is a lot harder than barrel steel.
 
Russianblood said:
Heavy shot will shread the inside of you barrel if you don't have it in the specially made shot cup. It is a lot harder than barrel steel.
Thank you for confirming that, Russianblood... :hatsoff: - I thought that's what I had heard. I was all set to make what could be considered an "investment" in Bismuth shot to use in my smoothbore for geese.
 
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