300 FPS Difference............

[ETipp]

Ran across this video today. The only thing that changed was the brand of powder.

80 grains of powder (weighed).

.530 Round Ball.

Same ML......54 caliber Renegade.

Schuetzen..............1300 FPS (1353)

Swiss........................1600 FPS (1624)

GOEX.......................1400 FPS (1461)

All three of the first numbers was initially rounded.

So right at 300 FPS difference between Swiss and Schuetzen.

 

[2 shots]

wondering how many shots were fired. interesting.

 

[ETipp]

wondering how many shots were fired. interesting.

3 shots each. Accuracy was also tested. Between Schuetzen and Swiss the groups were close. Interesting considering a 300 FPS difference.

Distance was 50 yards.

A near 300 FPS difference is substantial for a round ball.

 

[IanH]

Now, do it again, but this time by equal weight instead of equal volume.

 

[Scota@4570]

He did.

 

[leadhoarder]

Now, do it again, but this time by equal weight instead of equal volume.

I have always heard that Swiss is denser which is the main reason it is more energetic by volume.

 

[SDSmlf]

80 grains of powder (weighed).

Round Ball.

Same ML.

Schuetzen..............1300 FPS +

Swiss........................1600 FPS +

GOEX.......................1400 FPS +

Seems about right for the Swiss and Goex difference. Have found in the neighborhood of a 15% velocity delta by weight or volume. It becomes apparent as distance increases that powder charge will have to change to keep the same POI.

Now, do it again, but this time by equal weight instead of equal volume.

Did you read the entire OP?

80 grains of powder (weighed).

 

[tenngun]

So,
I’ve never had Swiss. Do folks that use or have used both think it’s worth the 33% difference in price
I understand, and have not tested this my self, that in large bores the increase becomes very minimal

 

[smokepolehall]

Honestly i have never found the Goex to be faster than Schuetzen. Swiss has been the tops in velocity. Is it worth the extra $'s. I think it is if you can afford it. Lets face it there be many that pay large sums of samolians for that stuff they call BH209.

 

[SDSmlf]

So,
I’ve never had Swiss. Do folks that use or have used both think it’s worth the 33% difference in price
I understand, and have not tested this my self, that in large bores the increase becomes very minimal

The last few orders of powder (25 lbs each) I made were mostly Swiss, with maybe 5 lbs of Goex, just because. Personally I prefer the Swiss (guess that will cause some to call me a snob), particularly the 3F. It always seems to perform at least as well as any other powder or better in everything I own and shoot. I have found consistency from can to can (guess I should say plastic bottle…) that other powders don’t always have. One brand, one granulation, makes it simpler for me. I have other manufactures’ powders and granulations for ‘medicinal’ so I can always compare.

Reality, nothing wrong with Goex, Schuetzen or others. Just comes down to what works for you. Years ago didn’t care for 777 for a number of reasons, however, subsequent limited testing has shown the 3F version works very well. You just have to make sure it will light up when you want it to. Seems it would be great in a gun set up with musket caps….. I shoot flint quite a bit. Duplex loads with it can work, but I find that straight 3f Swiss works in everything to date with no monkeying around. Consistent ignition and accuracy in most everything i shoot. I still burn Goex (until my supply runs out), and other offerings from different manufacturers just to make sure I’m not missing anything.

Long winded way of saying if it works for you, go for it. Burn what you like and have.

 

[TDM]

Good test and info @ETipp.

 

[IanH]

I did read it but got my brain backwards. Swiss tends to be light by volume as well as more powerful. If the charges were compared by VOLUME, there would be less variance. 50 grains volume of Swiss 3F and GOEX circa 1994 3F weigh 41 grains and 51 grains, respectively from one of my measures, yet the Swiss edges out GOEX by 80-100 fps. I don't use much Schuetzen because it consistently hangfires on ALL of my flint locks.

 

[SDSmlf]

Swiss tends to be light by volume as well as more powerful.

Honestly haven’t found that to be true, but not something I check on regular basis. Once I find some that works I tend to stop experimenting and go with what works. Keep finkling around after finding success and you may lose confidence in your successes.

 

[Nav]

I’ve also heard the Swiss burns cleaner with less residue and more shots before cleaning.

 

[ETipp]

Now, do it again, but this time by equal weight instead of equal volume.

It was equal weight. As is stated in my first post.............."80 grains weighed."

 

[ETipp]

I did read it but got my brain backwards. Swiss tends to be light by volume as well as more powerful. If the charges were compared by VOLUME, there would be less variance. 50 grains volume of Swiss 3F and GOEX circa 1994 3F weigh 41 grains and 51 grains, respectively from one of my measures, yet the Swiss edges out GOEX by 80-100 fps. I don't use much Schuetzen because it consistently hangfires on ALL of my flint locks.

The man that did the testing was using 2F powders.

There was right at a 200 FPS difference between Swiss and GOEX. Swiss at 1624 FPS and GOEX at 1461 FPS.

Also, measuring by volume introduces variables. Variables in how much and how one rounds off and/or taps on a powder measure.

When one weighs out and pours the exact same amount in premeasured tubes it's going to be exact. In short, it eliminates variables.

For the most part, that test was done looking for speed differences. I have my doubts that it would make considerable differences in accuracy, as proven between Schuetzen and Swiss. Even though there was nearly a 300 FPS difference, the groups were close with Swiss being a little bit smaller.

 

[ETipp]

So,
I’ve never had Swiss. Do folks that use or have used both think it’s worth the 33% difference in price
I understand, and have not tested this my self, that in large bores the increase becomes very minimal

Tenn, I haven't the answer for you. To the best of my memory, all I have ever burned is GOEX.

The test was done with a .54 cal, .530 RB. I'll see if I can find that video again.

It think this was a follow up to a previous video.

 

[ETipp]

Good test and info @ETipp.

Thank you TDM. However, this was not my test. The man doing the testing and posted the video goes by the name of Idaho Lewis.

 

[ETipp]

I’ve also heard the Swiss burns cleaner with less residue and more shots before cleaning.

You are spot on. In his video (Idaho Lewis) he stated he always spreads out towels across the hood of his truck. One of the last interesting facts he brought forward was looking at those towels after he had shot. There was the usual black pepper like crud on the towels from when he shot GOEX and Schuetzen. He contends he has not seen that with Swiss. He brings up another good and easy way to check for those that shoots in snow country. He states that snow will reveal the same.

My guess is that it was possibly a result of the Swiss burning hotter and more complete.

 

[kyron4]

Was point of impact the same or did the swiss hit higher ?