Do you prefer Real Black Powder or a BP substitute?.........Why?

[SDSmlf]

I'd just as soon be shooting rocks and gravel down the bore as to use one of the so-called 'Subs'!!

Never tried rocks and gravel. How do you ignite it?

 

[Carbon 6]

Let's see, what are the advantages and disadvantages of both?

The advantages of "subs" are;
availability,
performance
reduced or soft fouling.

Disadvantages are;
Harder to ignite.
Won't work in flintlocks,
More corrosive/harder to clean.
Lack of choice in grain sizes.
Hygroscopic or degrades easily.

One thing to keep in mind is that not all subs are created equal.
I much prefer real black powder, It is authentic, and smells like it should when burned, it works in all guns and cleans the easiest. it is also the least corrosive IMO. Black powder has the widest range of applications.

If I were to choose a substitute to use, My first choice would be Pyrodex P. My second choice would be 777
After that I would probably give up and go back to cartridge rifles or take up bowhunting.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

I would guess 90% of BP guys can’t find it locally. I sure can’t. I get mine from the Friendship shoots in the spring and fall or on powderinc.com. Easy.

True that, Bob. Back east in Illinois I knew of just one local gun shop that stocked it and that was 10 years ago and the feller that sold be that Goex told me he likely wouldn’t keep stocking it for very long. Laws and ordinances for explosives (which is what real BP is classified as) largely prohibits most small shops from stocking it due to the hassle and associated licensing fees.

Most Bass Pros sold (or used to) Goex but it was almost treated “hush hush” and you had to specifically ask the store manager to get it from the back. And it cost close to $30 a pound if I remember, totally not practical. But at least they had some.

Graf’s and Powder Inc. among a few others specialize in mail order real black powder, and I’ve had great luck with Graf’s. I even stopped at their storefront in Mexico, Missouri some years back and they were super friendly and cool. You need to usually make a bulk order of 25 lbs or more to make it worth the hazmat fees but it comes out to about $18 a can for basic grades and is well worth it. Thank God there are still some out there selling powder that way.

 

[mooman76]

What store and where? I could maybe check and see some time.

 

[TFoley]

I'm sure if it was readily available to Everyone, almost all would prefer to use the real stuff.

THAT's the best answer so far.

 

[Larry (Omaha)]

Never tried rocks and gravel. How do you ignite it?

Silly question: a volcano
Flintlocklar

 

[QuinnTheEskimo]

I prefer black powder in my .32’s, no real preference in larger caliber sidelocks but I usually use Pyrodex.

 

[Sidney Smith]

When I started into muzzle loaders, I started with a percussion. Not knowing much about the sport, I went that route because it seemed easier. I purchased Pyrodex because at the time I did not know where to find real black powder. Pyrodex was on the shelf. It worked fine. When I decided to give flintlocks a try, I located black powder and tried it. Since I liked flintlocks immediately, I gave up on the percussion and also on Pyrodex.

I still own a percussion rifle and still have some Pyrodex RS on hand, but both collect dust.

 

[Carbon 6]

Everyone used real black powder before the 1970's.

 

[Greg Blackburn]

A friend suggested I try Pyrodex and I shot it for many years. Now that I have flintlocks, I will be back into black powder.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

Here we go again.....put on your Helmets!

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

Let's see, what are the advantages and disadvantages of both?

The advantages of "subs" are;
availability,
performance
reduced or soft fouling.

Disadvantages are;
Harder to ignite.
Won't work in flintlocks,
More corrosive/harder to clean.
Lack of choice in grain sizes.
Hygroscopic or degrades easily.

One thing to keep in mind is that not all subs are created equal.
I much prefer real black powder, It is authentic, and smells like it should when burned, it works in all guns and cleans the easiest. it is also the least corrosive IMO. Black powder has the widest range of applications.

If I were to choose a substitute to use, My first choice would be Pyrodex P. My second choice would be 777
After that I would probably give up and go back to cartridge rifles or take up bowhunting.

I bow hunt right up to Muzzleloader Season then back to bow. I however do not use Pyrodex Arrows......LOL

 

[AZbpBurner]

I use both BP and Pyrodex. I got a cheap deal on some Pyrodex several years ago & use it most often in my Cap & Ball revolvers, and sometimes in my percussion rifles, conserving the harder-to-get BP for use in my flinters. I've never had any particular bias against Pyrodex, so never had any problems with cleaning or performance.

 

[Josephg]

Real black powder. I tried substitute once many years ago but it turned into a clump in the white plastic container.

 

[1853enfield]

I picked up 8 lbs of Aliant black mz for $9.99 a pound and really like it.. as per usual if i like something it is soon discontinued. in my flintlock it works great with 4f in the pan. i have a revolver i shot with it and have hung it on a peg over my loading bench been there close to a year and no sigh of rust. Pyrodex just never worked well for me didnt seem to shoot as accurately. Where i live i know of no one who carries real black powder, so i found a couple other shooters and we split up 25lbs from buffalo arms. they were just a little more expensive than Graff but the people at buffalo are so nice i like to give them my business. i live in central Washington state and we get less than 7 inches of precp per year so i really have never had any problems with rust. it is so dry here that the snakes do not put in venom they suck blood.

 

[Rudyard]

A friend lives in Mattawa Wash . He declares it gets so dry they have to stick postage stamps on with paper clips. But then Old Elmer does tend to Stretch the elastic in the truth department some times . He is my mentor his gift of imagination in the gun making inspired me to think outside the box these 50 odd years .
Rudyard

 

[Half-Cocked]

First of all: in my 50 + years of shooting muzzleloaders I have never used a black powder substitute.
I see numerous posts on this forum about BP substitutes and would like to ask why one would use a BP substitute? I am asking for reasons other than real BP is not available. I am not criticizing anyone who choose to use a sub, just trying to collect thoughts on why? Real black powder always fascinated me with its' characteristics and historical significance, so I never tried a sub.
Flintlocklar

I love and prefer BP and that is all I will use in my Pietta. It’s a bit of a drive but I got it.

I also use 777 in a rifle that uses a much larger minimum charge of 50 grain by volume. Because I am cheap I figure the 777 is lighter by mass so I get a little more for my money. Also that 50 grain of 777 kicks pretty good so it is a little better than using 50 grain of bp which is denser by mass and less powerful in equal volume.

That being said I love my brass 1851 at 12 grains of bp it does great target work. I also prefer the smell of it. My rifle may get 4 or 5 rounds put through it at the range. The brasser gets shot over and over until my bore butter melts!

 

[theoldredneck]

When I got back into muzzleloader guns several years ago there was no where to buy blackpowder. I would hear of places, but none had it in stock. Spent couple years shooting the subs in muzzleloaders and loading blackpowder shotgun shells etc with subs. Finally got hooked up with a group buy for real blackpowder and have not used subs since. The subs worked but not with the flint guns. I was thankful for it because it was all I could find. To me subs are just that, a sub until I can find the real blackpowder. Would rather shoot blackpowder for reasons others have given. Like it better than the subs. The only advantage to subs I can see is availability.

 

[Art Caputo]

I have predominantly shot flintlocks for the past 40+ years. When I shot percussion before then, black powder was readily available, and the substitute(s), questionable.

 

[MaterielGeneral]

I have only used pyrodex for the simple reason of availability. Nobody sells real black powder anywhere near me. and I am not going to mail order real black powder and spend $30 on a hazmat fee.