Will a flintlock stop a bear?

[Zoar]

Judging by the dates.... I'd say we're due....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_bear_attacks_in_North_America#Brown_Bear


One other thing I noted. A lot more human deaths by black bear than I expected to see on this list.

Lewis & Clark carried Blunderbuss too. I wonder if their rationale was to use them to protect from dangerous game, too?

 

[Ray-Vigo]

I've read about the Blunderbuss a bit and would still take the Brown Bess with the bayonet.

 

[poordevil]

You could even throw in some Chillie Peppers too and add a CHEM. weapon cloud as well!

 

[Zoar]

poor---Hey, it works on skunks too, why not? Crushed up Chilli peppers too. That is one of the other beauties of the mighty Blunderbuss: you can put anything in there. Metal dust!

Here is a video that shows a real brown bear charge. If you can just get past the first few modern minutes...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMbnmLLnsfw&feature=related

Lewis & Clark & Blunderbuss

 

[poordevil]

Cool video!

At the risk of getting off topic, I watched a hunting show , while in Africa a lion attacked the hunters......The hunter had a heavy double BBL rifle and shot the lion 2 times. The lion landed dead against the hunter, knocking him off ballance. They showed it over and over in slow motion, but in real time it was a blink of an eye. Very fast.

P

 

[Zoar]

Wow, we are going to get this thread to over 200 posts! Yea.

I'd like to see that cat charge video. The only one I've seen like that the guy has a foolish lower powered BOLT gun. By the recoil he takes, the gun appears to be something like a 270! for cripe sake.

I wonder if I can buck and ball my Blunderbuss? Can you imagine a quarter pound round ball with a big load of pellets (and the essence of Chilli Pepper) shot to face of any animal? I'd say lights out.... If it didn't penetrate to the brain it would give him a CONCUSSION! :thumbsup:

 

[Zoar]

I just ordered the book:

"HELP! A Bear is Eating Me!" - Mykle Hansen... I heard it was absolutely hilarious. In the vein of Tom Robbins' books.

Takes place in Alaska.

Where else?

My Girlfriend's sister has some land way up in BC near Alaska. I have not visited yet but my GF and her sis tell me that they canNOT take a walk on the land without seeing bear. They are very plentiful. I think I'll ship my Blunderbuss ahead of me before i book my flight up. (That and my .500 cal double rifle "nitro".)

 

[redwing]

Zoar are you for real or are you just being funny? If you are for real concern yourself with where they will ship your remains.
The remains will not take up much space, Tenny Runners arn't that big.

 

[larry wv]

If I was Grizzly Bear hunting and my rifle grouped conicals thats what it would be loaded with. Wonder if many hunters that normaly use prb switch to a maxi type boolit when there is a chance of a Gbear charge. A .50 is enough for thin skin grass eaters with a prb with the conditions right. But if a bear charged a maxi in a .50 would have a better chance of getting to the brain. Guess I would load with a maxi and carry some extra under wear. :shocked2: Larry

 

[Dphar]

If I was Grizzly Bear hunting and my rifle grouped conicals thats what it would be loaded with. Wonder if many hunters that normaly use prb switch to a maxi type boolit when there is a chance of a Gbear charge. A .50 is enough for thin skin grass eaters with a prb with the conditions right. But if a bear charged a maxi in a .50 would have a better chance of getting to the brain. Guess I would load with a maxi and carry some extra under wear. :shocked2: Larry

I'll take the 16 bore with a RB. Or even the 50 Rb. Which I have hunted with in GBear country for weeks on end.
Conicals like maxis and minies have a long history of not tracking as aimed when striking flesh. Been written up since the Crimean War. This causes real problems when shooting game.

Dan

 

[Dphar]

Nose, EYE, mouth...

If a bear is coming at me and/or literally in my face I have to aim some where even if it is more "pointing" somewhere.

Pick one from above and that is where I am pointing/aiming. And I still think---even in a split second---if at all possible, it would be the EYE I go for.

I can't fathom how you can get a chest shot on a G-bear coming right at you and at close range. The head is most of the available target.

If it is NOT coming right at you, why shoot it in defense?

If you have time you do as some experienced hunter reported doing when charged by a lion dropping to one knee to get to the proper level, Shooting under the chin will give a much bigger target than trying to shoot the bear running at you while standing. BUT you have to have the time.
It is all situational. It depends on the situation and the decision has to be made in that context. I would prefer the lower angle shot IF the situation allows. Otherwise you take what you can get. Running around in the hills where there are Gbears gives one time to consider what one would do and I have spent time doing just that. its not something I suddenly thought up while arm chair hunting with the keyboard as I now.

Dan

 

[Dphar]

Sometimes you just gotta feed the wildlife. Of course only a hit to the brain or spinal cord will guarantee a stop. But sometimes one shot elsewhere will do it. If you get ambushed by a grizzly, a machine gun would be no better than a squirrel rifle.

ok i gotta comment here, someone all ready mentioned that most hunter do not know the anatomy of the animals they are hunting,,,,, i can seriously agree with this. and hanshi old friend, you dont know how to hunt bear. when i was 16, back in the mid 1970's (damn that made me feel old) i read an article in the NRA's magazine about hand gun hunting. one part of this article was about a fool that shot a brown bear 6 times in the head with a 357mag, gave the bear a ripping headache and really ****** the bear off. the point i guess im making here is, i do like to bear hunt, ive learned the anatomy of this animal, and i know there are 2 places you do not shoot a bear, 1 never ever in the head. 2 do not shoot them in the sternum. true this does make it a little harder, but not impossible. im perfectly comfortable hunting bear with my 50cal hawkens or one of my 50 cal flinters, no big deal. and if you know your weapon, and your quick, 2 shots at 50 yards is no big deal. and no i dont carry a side arm. some times i'll have a friend in tow, and they also will be carrying a front stuffer. it all boils down to knowing your prey so you arent on there food chain.

Red--I appreciate the round count but what I'd really like to know is WHERE did the rounds hit the bears? What part of the anatomies and as precise as possible. I am big believer that body shots on a bear while they may end up being fatal they take far too long to take effect in a bear charge scenario. Nervous system (head shot/spine) and/or blinding them.

DO NOT SHOOT BEARS IN THE HEAD! BONES TO THICK AND HARD THE BULLETS DONT GO THROUGH, YOU JUST PISS OFF THE BEAR

This has been proven false many times. As in all things its impact angles and targets.
A guy my dad knows killed a charging AK grizzly with a 45-70 Marlin, bullet struck beside the eye. Did not bounce off.
Bear had a kill in the middle of the trail and he and his wife walked into a problem before they knew it.

Dan

 

[Dphar]

Tunnel Vision, Auditory Exclusion, and slow motion recall, cotton mouth, etc., are just some of the symptoms that compose Tachy-Psych Syndrome. Practice putting yourself into a situation that causes you to fear for your life, or others, is the way to learn how to deal with that. You can learn to overcome fear and move amazingly fast. When I studied Self Defenses tactics with John Farnam, back in 1982, we practiced these stressful situations and learned to overcome them. You might find a copy of his book, Stressfire, on the net, and read it. I am sure you will find several ideas for exercises to teach you to function under those kinds of stress. Courage can be taught, and it can be learned.

I am one of those guys who runs towards the fire, explosions, gunfire, etc. rather than away from it. I always have. I believe I am afraid to live with myself if I don't try to stop the harm, and aid the injured. I have been doing these kinds of things all my life, and long before I took John's class.

At the time I was thinking of I did not have practice life threatening situations. They just cropped up now and then on their own.

In the one case I was thinking of a 155 short round that landed in the middle of the platoon while they were shelling a tree line we had just gotten back out of. Heard it for a split second, brain went !!!!! Body had no time to move before the detonation and I had pretty good "duck" reflexes at the time being young and having had a lot of recent practice.
No time for tunnel vision or any of that stuff.

The other was a black column of dirt from an anti-tank mine going past the side of the vehicle I was on about 4 ft away. I saw it, knew what it was but was out before I could do much but see a thing or two. This was not "slow motion recall" it was while it as happening. The dirt when up pretty fast then things just slowed down till it went black, was out before I landed.

Bears and people are not that fast.
Nor have I ever "froze" and been unable to function. This is "Darwin award" stuff.

Dan

 

[rabjr]

Has this been answered yet? :haha:

Just a general statement, not aimed at you Dan.

I would think any heavy modern gun shot at the head straight on at close range would at the very least cause a bear to pause, someone hit me in the head with a sledge hammer, I'm not so sure I'd continue to do what I set out to do, even if it did bounce off. Seems to me with the big bears, it's a manure shoot and if it were me, I would want more than one shot.

 

[ebiggs1]

I’ve kinda got hooked on the TV show “I Shouldn’t Be Alive.” Several of the episodes deal with bear attacks in the woods. Some of the people are hunters with high powdered rifles some are unarmed, The ones with high powdered rifles didn’t fair any better than the unarmed people.
That begs a question. Do you think a flintlock would stop a griz or brown bear with one shot? You are a deer hunter. I know there are extenuating circumstances involved but say you are surprised at close range and you have a .54 cal, or so, flintlock in your hands, are you lunch?

Remember this is the scenario.
None of the people on the show, hence the name “I Shouldn’t Be Alive” were killed by the bears. In one episode there were a father and son ”˜traditional muzzleloader’ deer hunters.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Altho I was never over in the jungles being shot at, our experiences are not all that different. I have been hit, accidentally,( I HOPE) while hunting, on multiple times. The first time, the shooter was on the other side of a hill, and I never even heard the gun fire. Later, I had incidents at State run " Dove Fields", where some idiot was shooting at low flying birds, and spraying those of us stationed at the other end of the field.

I did nave some moron shooting at me, and other deer hunters, from about 1/2 mile away with a .223 caliber Semi-auto, as we drove some woods on the Illinois Bank of the Mississippi River. The shooter was on the Missouri Shore. We first heard the bullets zipping through the tree branches overhead, and had small branches cut by the bullets falling down on our heads and shoulders. The report of the rifle was very faint, so it took us awhile to understand that someone was actually shooting at us. He only stopped shooting at us when I fired 3 shotgun slugs towards his location, and he ran away. Cowards and creeps don't like being shot at, either.

I took Farnam's course after these incidents, in part to learn how to react and respond.

In the incidents you describe, the only thing you can do is to "survive", which you did. That's a success. How you did it is not as important.

Unless you have spent years reading tracks and sign, and more years practicing setting up traps, and explosive devices to catch your enemies( and locating and removing those your enemies have set for you), the average GI is simply not trained to spot ambushes, and traps.

And I have no idea how you could possibly be trained to react any faster than you already did when incoming artillery fire visits your "comfort zone"! Again, if you survived, you won! I lost a friend from High school over there to a Mortar round that hit him as he tried to go out and pull a wounded buddy to safety.

My point in writing that post was to assure people that you can learn to deal with Tachy-Psych Syndrome, and there are schools you can go to, and books you can read to help you understand that.

No one expects to have a confrontation with a Wild Animal intent on eating him for lunch. But, if you are trained to react to the unexpected, and, if you use all your senses, and "read" all the "sign" including the Presence and Absence of animals-Yes, negative evidence, ie. something that is NOT there that should be there, is often the most important "sign" you will find-- as well as odors, and hearing the alarm calls of other species of animals, you can be prepared to react to the " unexpected".

Its no different than learning to anticipate the wrong behavior of other drivers at intersections, so you avoid a collision. When you learn to " read" other drivers, at defensive Driving Schools, its simply amazing how many accidents you can- and will- avoid. :hmm: :thumbsup:

 

[larry wv]

Dan just how far is it through the skin and skull into the brain? No way in h--- is a maxi going to turn and miss the brain. I have nothing against big round balls but a 50 isn't big. I have had conicals turn (one time) a slow twist unstable maxi not a 1-48 . If it shoots a good group it prob is spinning good enough not to turn and I said if it holds a group. Larry

 

[nkbj]

Yep, it's all a matter of spin.

 

[KHickam]

Yes, a flintlock will stop a bear. It depends on caliber and shot placement of course.

But, if I was out hunting elk or deer or antelope in Montana, had my .50 caliber rifle or my .62 smoothbore. And was charged, I would shoot and hope to hell I made a good shot. I sure as hell wouldn't turn tail and run - and it seems to me in that situation those may be your only two options :idunno:

 

[rabjr]

Well....everybody start carrying a big knife... :wink: