T/C Breech Plugs

[ramblin man]

Hi, I know this has been covered to some extent, but I have a more specific question. I have several T/C barrels Hawken, Renegade and one New Englander that I need to remove the breech plugs prior to reboring. A couple of these have a hole in the breech that either has a pin head showing or perhaps it's a cap covering a hole? Do some T/Cs have a pinned breech plug? If so how do you remove it? Also what size threads do T/C breech plugs have? Do they vary by model and caliber? Thanks for any help, seems I've got my work cut out for[url] me....Ramblin[/url]

 

[44-henry]

I don't envy you that chore. There was a discussion on another board awhile back on this and the general inclination was to use a bit of heat (check to make sure the barrel isn't loaded first of course) and a proper fitting wrench and extension will go a long way. I don't believe they are pinned but I could be wrong.

I can tell you that I just ended my mission to get a plug out of a Green Mountain replacement barrel for the TC. I used the heat and a propper fitting wrench to no avail. I eventually ended up cutting the barrel off forward of the breech plug, bored it out in the lathe and re-threaded it. Hope you have better luck than I.

 

[roundball]

TCs are not pinned...I believe the circle spot you're showing in your photo is the plug in the spot where they drilled across to the other side to make the fire channel under the nipple.

It's not present on flint plugs at all, only cap plugs...and it's not present on the early style cap plugs which had the cleanout screw on the right side of the snail which is where they drilled the fire channel from at that time.

But when they discontinued the cleanout screw design snail, that spot in your photo appears on cap plugs...has to be where they drilled the fire channel from, and then they plugged the left side permanently.

 

[ramblin man]

Thanks to both of you for your response. Mr. Alexander now that I know they are not pinned, I'm really looking forward to experiencing what you have described. I guess if I get any of them off I will find what size the threads are. Roundball, as usual I defer to age and wisdom. You are no doubt right about the plugged hole being where the fire channel was drilled. Now I have no more excuses, I'll have to get the plugs off and get these up to Lowell for choking. Thanks[url] again.......Ramblin[/url]

 

[roundball]

Thanks to both of you for your response. Mr. Alexander now that I know they are not pinned, I'm really looking forward to experiencing what you have described. I guess if I get any of them off I will find what size the threads are. Roundball, as usual I defer to age and wisdom. You are no doubt right about the plugged hole being where the fire channel was drilled. Now I have no more excuses, I'll have to get the plugs off and get these up to Lowell for choking. Thanks[url] again.......Ramblin[/url]

Did you talk to Lowell about having him remove them? If he's all set up with a machine shop and does work for people on MLs, he may have everything he needs to remove them properly.

For example, when I sent a new .62cal GM smoothbore to Ed Rayl so he could add rifling, he had to remove the breechplug, and except for 2 tiny re-alignment marks he intentionally made before starting, you'd never know the plug had been removed.

 

[boar]

Do you know they made a wrench part that went over the breachplug so you didn't mar it. the wrench was adjusted to the part. I used one in 80s to take my buddys .54s plug off. There were made I believe by the bore sizes or by models? They were a block of steel that fitted over the plug to put the wrench on. Dilly

 

[Nor Cal Mikie]

I was told by TOTW that the TC plug pitch was 11/16 by 20.(FWIW)

 

[44-henry]

There is no doubt that a special fitting wrench would make things a world easier, I have some wrenches that I have made for other barrels that do a nice job. The problem with the TC is they seem to have socked them home with a 6' cheater bar handled by a 600 pound gorilla. In the end the bandsaw made a quick job of it and the metal lathe took care of the rest. I believe TOW sells breech plugs for the TC barrels, one with the original, somewhat odd, thread pitch.

 

[roundball]

There is no doubt that a special fitting wrench would make things a world easier

You probably already know that T/C withdrew their breech plug wrench from sales to the public soon after making them available...they had so many botched up, marred up, barrel/breech warranty returns that they had to shut it off.

And to tell you the truth their wrench seemed too skinny to me anyways...always struck me as just a simple, small, piece of a Rector Set...just knew it would mar a finish if it was used...

 

[John Taylor]

I have 3 sizes of breach plug wrenches from T/C. Bought them about 30 years back. They don't fit as close as I would like but they do work, need a big crescent wrench to use them.

 

[44-henry]

I don't know anything about the wrenches that TC supplied, I do think if I would have taken the time to build a wrench I could have got that plug out of my barrel, I just figured the bandsaw was the quicker option.

 

[davy]

Last and only time I saw a TC plug removed it took not only a big action vice, but also a large wrench, penetrating oil, heat, and a thump with a big ol hammer to get it loose! :shocked2: :grin:

Davy

 

[longcruise]

My experience is the same. Back in about '75 I watched an ML smith remove a breech plug from a TC .50 Hawkin. He used the special TC wrench. It's not really a wrench, it's a fitted device that goes over and completely around the breech plug. Then the Big crescent goes on the tc fitting. The guy I watched used a crescent wrench with a three foot handle and he had to literally bounce all his weight on the handle about six times to get it loose. :shocked2:

 

[xxgrampa]

greetings,

back in the days of the tc wrenchs, the plugs were removable. they came off pretty easy. but then tc pulled the wrench and made the plugs non-removable.

howsomever, they 'FORGOT' to mention the plugs no longer came off.

got a .45 couger. popped the plug off, put a dab of never sieze on it and was good to go.. a little later got a couger in .50. put the tool and wrench on it. and after two days of trying, i really messed up the finish on that gun.. never got it off..

called tc and was told they now 'FIX' the plugs to the barrel. don't know what or how they do it..

"ROUNDBALL' maybe you could call your buddy at tc and learn how they are 'fixed'. i would be interested. got about 20 tc's that i would like to 'pop' off.

..ttfn..grampa..

 

[jaguarxk120]

The FIX maybe Loctite, there are industrial grades that will setup just like a rock. Years ago where I worked we used a green grade of loctite to assemble parts that never came apart. We used it in the shop for the same reason. After it setup, was just as it was welded together. The only way it would come apart was to heat the joint hot enough to break the bond. TF

 

[roundball]

"...got about 20 tc's..."

I think that's shameful...and it seems like you're stressing about it...just ship a few Hawkens here to me so I can "help you"...only interested in early style 70's design stocks with the well pronounced comb and 14+5/8" LOP, above average grain & figure...Flintlocks would be a plus.


:grin:

 

[xxgrampa]

thanks roundball,

thats very generous of you.. started to pack them up. got them ready to ship. just couldn't wait to send them to you so i could get rid of the stress..

but then the lite bulb went off... the early 70's are the tc's WITH the removable plugs. so,,, unpacked them and put them away.. thanks for worrying about my stress.. could i just send you some money instead??? please advise..

thanks and ..ttfn..grampa..