Springfield m1842 musket

[XxWINxX94]

Hello everyone!
I'm new to the forum and this is my first post.

I recently took an interest to muzzleloading along side my interest for collecting guns and target shooting.

I have a real, authentic, m1842 Springfield musket in .69 caliber (I think). The lockplate is dated 1853, and the barrel has been cut-down to around 38'', rifling has been added (I think), and it has a long range sight, the barrel is also dated 1855. It is a little dark, but there is actually no pitting anywhere on the gun, execpt for the nipple area. Also the nipple has been replaced. I have shot this musket and it works just as well as my T/C muzzleloader
I paid a pretty penny for this gun, and just want to see what you folks think.

Let me know what you think!

 

[Trot]

It is a shame that it has been cut down, don't know what you paid but that really hurts the value. Looks in great shape otherwise.

 

[XxWINxX94]

Yes, but from some research I did, during the civil war, both sides often cut down they're muskets to make them more portable. And I believe it was done in 1855, like it is stamped on the barrel.

So one that isn't cut down would be worth a lot more?

 

[jeep44]

I have an almost identical one, but without the rear sight. It has been shortened to just the same length, and rather neatly, too-like yours. It has two grooves of rifling in it, a CW modification.
I bought mine as a teen-ager back in about 1970, and I remember paying a hefty $69 for it (this was a big bite for me) I found a rusty old .69 round ball mold, and used it for hunting. Those balls made an impressive hole in anything they hit, but none of those holes were ever in a deer :haha:
I still have it after all these years, and several years ago bought another, an un-cut Model 1842 Harpers Ferry. I hope you enjoy shooting yours!

 

[poordevil]

Armisport is selling an 1842 musket, rifled with a 36-ish " BBL that they call the Fremont, as in John Fremont, who took some on one of his western explorations. The NSSA considers it a real period piece, so maybe , if the story is true, that is what you have? :idunno:

 

[XxWINxX94]

Thats awesome! Wish I could have got mine for that much!

When I picked this one out, I looked through the 20 or so the place had, and This one was in the best condition overall. I seen numerous '42 Harpers Ferrys, but they just couldn't compare to the condition of this.

My next one will be a HF for sure!

 

[Zonie]

Welcome to the Forum.

Flayderman's Guide says of the U.S. Percussion Musket:
"...Model 1842 U.S. Rifled Musket; alternation by rifling barrels; c. 1856-1859; total quantity 14,182. Basically the same as the Model 1842 Musket, but features rifling, Slightly less than 10,000 were fitted with long range rear sights, the balance issued without them...
Values--Good $1,100 Fine $3,250.

This was published in 2007. It doesn't mention the values of cut down versions.

I also own a Springfield 1842 Rifled Musket but the barrel is in rather poor condition.

 

[XxWINxX94]

Cool! Thanks for the info Zonie.
I paid right around $1100 for mine, and it is in pretty good condition for being 160 years old. I will have to do some more research on how much of an effect the cut-down barrel has on the gun.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Check the wood under the muzzle cap. If this is a 20th century stock/barrel cutting, the wood will show a lack of patina that comes with age. The end grain will look at lot Lighter in color than the wood under the barrel.

If the shortening was done back in the mid 19t century, then there should be no devaluation of the gun as the result of the shorter barrel length. I can't determine from you picture how many lands and grooves are in that barrel, nor the rate of twist of the rifling. Both of these items of information are major clues as to when the barrel was either shortened, or the original barrel replaced with this shorter barrel.

Do your research. Barrels of different lengths being used in the Civil War were not uncommon, and many of these barrels were shortened when these early percussion rifles were re-formed using rifled barrels. There was a flurry of development of martial arms in the 1840s, and '50s, because the quick improvements in Percussion ignition, the acceptance of rifled barrels for soldiers use, by General officers, and the need for uniform ammunition to fight Indian wars, and the War with Mexico in 1845-46. That war proved the inadequacy of the muskets just adopted in 1842, and that lead to converting these guns to rifled barrels in the 1850s. That huge rear sight is also a product of the reform movement to upgrade existing rifles.

I think you have an interesting piece of American History, there, that originates right in the middle of the rapid development of rifles prior to the Civil War. I only hope it proves to be a good shooting rifle for you. I suspect this gun has sat in enough warehouses during its life. It needs to be taken out and shot. :wink:

 

[nkbj]

Oh wow. I was just saying today about shooting the Fremont this weekend if the rain holds off. Seeing the beauty in those pictures really makes me want to get those punkins rolling.
If you would, please tell about what you're shooting in it.
Does it have equal width grooves and lands?

 

[jeep44]

What place has twenty of these? :hmm:

 

[XxWINxX94]

Interesting, I will check that out and see if I can get a picture up sometime tomorrow. I was also thinking the same thing, if the barrel was cut in the 1800's it shouldn't devalue the gun, but if it was done by some guy a few years ago it probably would.

 

[XxWINxX94]

Dixie Gun Works in Union City, TN.

They have an entire "antique" section with lots of old muskets, revolvers and such.

 

[Trot]

Yes, but from some research I did, during the civil war, both sides often cut down they're muskets to make them more portable. And I believe it was done in 1855, like it is stamped on the barrel.

So one that isn't cut down would be worth a lot more?

Definitely not cut down in 1855, that would be the date of the barrel manufacture. While some full length muskets may have been cut down for Confederate cavalry use, the number would have been very small. On the Union side it would not have happened at all. The vast majority of cutdowns were done postwar for hunting guns. Yes a full length musket is much more valuable, cutdowns are usually no more than a few hundred dollars, full length start in the thousand dollar neighborhood on up. It really doesn't matter if it was cut down in 1865 or in 1920. It being already cut however means it can be a good shooter without worrying about devaluing it, have fun!

 

[XxWINxX94]

Well I looked at the edge of the stock. It is extremely dark, matches the inside of the 1st barrel band. I'm assuming it was not cut down recently at all.

 

[Misplaced Rebel]

I have a sneaking suspicion that this is an original Fremont...the work looks to neat- the few cut-downs I've seen don't have the distinctive nose cap anymore. This is to neat a job for postwar- it looks like a military arsenal conversion. Check out the Fall Creek Sutlery home page under muskets- the repro Fremont looks exactly like yours--right down to the smoothbore-type ramrod.

Great find, and a great gun! Have fun with it, but know that I am drooling my guts out. :hatsoff:

-Chris

 

[varsity07840]

I have a sneaking suspicion that this is an original Fremont...the work looks to neat- the few cut-downs I've seen don't have the distinctive nose cap anymore. This is to neat a job for postwar- it looks like a military arsenal conversion. Check out the Fall Creek Sutlery home page under muskets- the repro Fremont looks exactly like yours--right down to the smoothbore-type ramrod.

Great find, and a great gun! Have fun with it, but know that I am drooling my guts out. :hatsoff:

-Chris

The barrel's too long and the markings on the lockplate are incorrect for a Fremont.

Duane

 

[Misplaced Rebel]

I stand corrected, but that's certainly strange. If it's not a Fremont- and I don't think it's civilian, either- then it must be similar to certain 'Rifle Length' guns cut down during the war as arsenal conversions that were mentioned earlier, I believe.

Speculation, of course. Still a wonderful gun!

-Chris