Springfield '63

[Kaleb]

Folks-
Regarding Civil War service rifles . . .

Which was the most widely used? Popular? Accurate? Durable? Etc.

Which modern replica would you recommend for general shooting and hunting? Why?

Thanks for your feedback!

 

[Trot]

The Model 1861 Springfield rifle musket was the most common Union rifled weapon, the P53 Enfield was the most common Confederate. Early in the war smoothbore model 1842's and 1816's outnumbered rifles. There are many debates over which of the modern replicas are best, but all of the major manufacturers make a good serviceable firearm.

 

[ian45662]

There were LOTS of diffrent types of arms back then but I believe the most common was the 1861 springfield, in at a close second though was the 1853 enfield. I am a fan of the Springfields I have a 1855 from armisport but I have had a witacre barrle put on it. The accuracy from the Armi spot is reasonable from my experince with the guns that they have made, however getting a new barrle will definatly help, but with just shooting and 58 cal rifled springfield will be fine. I used to hunt with a 61 from springfield but I ended up selling it to get a 55 no reason just because. Euroarms also makes them and they are probably about on par with armi sport. My brother has a 53 enfield from euroarms and he likes it alot. The 53 enfields and the 55 springfields both have ladder sights as apposed to the leaf sights that you will find on your 61s and 63s. There are muskets that were made that look a little like enfields but I think they were more accurate. Whitworth rifle I believe is one of them but I cannot speak for the quality of those type of repo guns however because I have never shot one. Hope this helps and sorry if I have put you to sleep.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Guns were being introduced all through that war, Kaleb. It would be hard to claim one was the " most popular." And it depends on which side of the conflict you are looking. Northern units were issued with a series of rifles made in theSpringfield Armory, and by contract elsewhere. Enfields were popular in the South at the beginning of the war because they were imported. But the South was also equipped with Springfield. As the War progressed, other guns, particular repeaters, with cartridges, came into being, and were bought by individual soliders as " private arms ". That would certainly be an indication of popularity, no? Include the Spencer.52 cal. and the Winchester .44 rimfire at the end of the war in those two categories. Lots of handguns were purchased privately, too. Cartridges had come into popularity with the .22 RF in 1857, followed by .32, and .38 rimfire cartridges in small revolvers. Smith and Wesson could not keep up with the orders. These small caliber guns were used as backup by cavalry troops when their heavy revolvers were shot out, and they were at saber length with the enemy.

As for duability, the Springfield certainly has to be considered as one of the better guns, but the Enfields were no slouch, either. Nor were there many complaints about the Spencer rifles or carbines. The Winchester came into the War at the end, and did not see enough use to get a very good read on durability. However, any dent in the thin magazine tube under the barrel could stop the gun being used as a repeaters, and the model 1866 was made with both a steel receiver, a wooden forearm, and a thicker tube, whereas the earlier " Henry" was made with a brass receiver, and had no wooden grip to protect that thin tube. In revolvers, the Remington .44 was considered the stronger one of all the guns made and used, because it employed a topstrap on the frame. It was preferred to the Colt .44 revolvers. Colt heard the music, and in 1873, introduced the Peacemaker in .45 Colt cartridge, with sturdy stop strap, a beefy cylinder, and a better balance. Later that same year, The Peacemaker was chambered for the .44-40. They remain the 2 longest made centerfire cartridges in the world. Part of that is due to the guns chambered to use the cartridges.

The American Civil War was a huge labratory for developing firearms. There was a drive to use the new manufacturing capabilities to produce repeating rifles of all kinds. Lincoln actually test fired a Spencer carbine on the White House grounds, when the inventor could not get a fair hearing with the old Generals in charge of ordinance. They were screaming because of all the different caliber guns they had to provide ammunition for, and the logistics of doing that when their were no good roads, and only a few railroads, even in the North. You can't blame tham for not wanting another size cartridge to have to produce and supply troops. But, Lincoln was so impressed with both the simplicity and accuracy of the Spencer, that he sent a note to the War Department directing them to give the company an order for several thousands of them. While a few Western regiments armed themselves privately with the Winchester " Henry " rifles, in 1865, the Spencer is the only repeater ordered by the government during the war. BTW, Dr. Gatling invented his Gatling gun, but by the time some of them made it to the front lines, they were not well used, and were not critical to the winning of any battle at the end of the war. Part of the reason is that officers had been trained to use Cannon, and had no clue how to use the Gatlings effectively. The guns were often set up behind the lines with the cannons, negating their sheet of fire advantages when used in the front lines, much as a machine gun would be used today. The gatlings were finally mastered and the field tactics to use them after our CW ended, in battles in Europe, Asia, and Africa. The Gatlings were used in the Spanish American Civil War in taking the Heights over Santiago, Cuba, in 1898. But they were soon replaced with Colt's machine guns, and other John Browning designs. In fact, a few machine guns were also used in Cuba.

I am sorry this wandered a bit away from the American Civil War, but before you can decide why some guns were like, others not, and really, how to even judge "durability", you have to understand that what happened in firearms manufacturing and invention during the War is part of a long history of firearm development. What was being used in the war of 1846-48 in the battle with Mexico only spurred developments before the ACW. During the War, with all the profits being earned by the companies, new tooling was purchased, or made, and new guns were being invented and perfected to solve chronic problems of open powder, and paper cartridges, which rarely functioned very well in the rain. The advent of the closed cartridge, made first of copper, and later of brass solved many of these problems as well as allowed easier and safer transportation from factory to battle front. Copper casings were the main drawback of the repeaters used in the Civil War, because the copper swells when hot, and with any dirt in the chamber, will freeze in the chamber, and not eject. Its was this fact that was instrumental in the Fetterman Massacre in 1866 in what is now Wyoming, along with his disobeying a direct order not to go out of sight of the fort. Not wanting to blame an dead officer, the ordinance department decided to blame the copper casings, and ordered new ammo with brass casings. That lead to the death of the then " new " .50-70 cartridge to the .45-70 cartridge introduced also in 1973.

When you understand the problems that ML guns faced in battle field conditions, and then understand what industry was capable of doing at the beginning of the war, and what it achieved during the war, you can better understand why there were so many guns used in the War, and why you can start a huge argument trying to answer all your " superlative " questions. For the average soldier, the"best"gun was the one that he used to save his life. In that end, that is what all Wars come down to- survival.

 

[Kaleb]

Thanks . . . and I hope to hear more from anyone with an opinion. (Go ahead and argue, makes good reading and forwards the debate!)

I can narrow my question a little.

How about . . . cap & ball rifles, only, used by Americans. And, please offer good reading resources that you know of.

 

[rice1817]

You may want to define "Americans" a little better if you want to narrow it down. The Confederate forces were as American as you and I.

Assuming you meant "Union" vs "American", then it is well documented that the Springfield 1855 thru 1864 models were most used by both Union and Confederate forces. Enfields were imported in greater numbers to the North than the South due to the blockade, and became the substitute standard.

Confederate forces who took the the field early in the war carried whatever personal weapons they had, including flintlocks, or whatever the state militias issued them. Large quantities of Yankee castoffs were captured then used by the Rebs to replace their obsolete models.

After Jackson captured the Harpers Ferry Arsenal, the arms making machinery was sent to Richmond and the Confederancy began turning out their version of the 1855, but without the Maynard primer system. Production never kept up with demand, though.

 

[paulvallandigham]

I agree. Because much of the war was fought before 1864, the Springfield 1863 model rifle was not available to troups in the North. They used many of the earlier model guns. Some of the Southern militia were armed with 1842 model rifles, and the 1861 model was the initial arm for the North. Both sides used what they had. And both sides bought private arms which added to the supply problems. It was even difficult to supply an entire regiment with guns of all the same year and caliber, towards the end of the war. Remember that many units were raised in the individual states by private persons, who became " Colonels", whether they had any military experience or not, simply because they were good enough politicians, and rich enough to pay men to enlist in their service. Companies were often clothed in uniforms at private expense, and at the beginning of the war, there was a huge hodgepodge of clothing. Some of the Confederate troops were dressed in blue uniforms because they were U.S troops who sided with the South. Only later did the majority of Southern Forces don Grey uniforms. p

But do remember this most of all: Every one of the men and women who fought in that war was an American. That is what made it so tragic a conflict, and resulted in more casualties than any other war fought before or since. And most of the deaths were from disease, not battlefield wounds. MY Great Grandfather served in the War, and contracted Tuberculosis while in the service. He lived until 1880 before dying of the disease, but was a weakened man after his discharge. He worked as a telegraph operator after the war for one of the railroads outside Chicago. His letters home to his wife, Mary, left a startling account of what life was like for soldiers in camp as well as in battle in the western campaigns. His unit fought at Vicksburg, and later in the Red River campaigns, which were considered a loss for the North.

 

[Kaleb]

LaLC-
In my response to Paul V, I used the term 'American', purposely. To me, the War was an American issue. I am interested in the rifles used by the Americans that participated, from both the South and the North.

I am confused, since I mentioned neither 'side' of the conflict . . . how did you reach your assumption?

 

[Colt 4pounder]

Allow me to add to the confusion. During the “war between the states”, all of the long guns used fall into four categories. They are Muskets, Rifles, Rifled muskets, Rifle-muskets and carbines. You can read about these differences in Robert M. Reilly’s book United States Military small arms 1816-1865. But seeing that you asked about a “rifle”, may I suggest a model 1841 rifle, aka the Mississippi rifle, or the 1855 two band rifle. Both are excellent shooters, but the 1855 tape primer type lock makes it a little harder to put the caps on, but its no big deal. Hope this helps.

Tom

 

[Teleoceras]

Paul:

However, any dent in the thin magazine tube under the barrel could stop the gun being used as a repeaters, and the model 1866 was made with both a steel receiver, a wooden forearm, and a thicker tube, whereas the earlier " Henry" was made with a brass receiver, and had no wooden grip to protect that thin tube.

I have to correct you there. The Model 1866 Winchester had a brass receiver which was why it got the nickname "Yellow Boy". Some of the first Henry's did have a steel receiver though.

I own one of the later generation 1853 P-H Enfields and she is a damn good shooter!

Slowmatch Forever!
Teleoceras

 

[paulvallandigham]

I didn't know the Henry's were ever made with steel or iron receivers. Thanks for the information. As to the Yellowboy, I know that some of the 1866 were also had in brass receivers, but it was my understanding that Winchester began producing the iron receivers in later production, and that the term " Yellow Boy " was applied to both the Henry, and the early Winchester rifles. Thanks again for this information.

 

[Teleoceras]

I didn't know the Henry's were ever made with steel or iron receivers. Thanks for the information. As to the Yellowboy, I know that some of the 1866 were also had in brass receivers, but it was my understanding that Winchester began producing the iron receivers in later production, and that the term " Yellow Boy " was applied to both the Henry, and the early Winchester rifles. Thanks again for this information.

Looking it up, the first Henry's actually had an iron frame not steel. My bad.

Both the Henry and the 1866 used the .44 rimfire cartridge which was a copper cased round with a 216gr bullet over 25grns B.P.

The later model 1873 Winchester did have a steel receiver and was designed to fire the more powerful .44-40 centerfire round.

Slowmatch Forever!
Teleoceras

 

[rice1817]

"How about . . . cap & ball rifles, only, used by Americans. And, please offer good reading resources that you know of."

If I misinterpreted your question, then I apolgize. However, to me the phrase "used by Americans" when taken with the knowledge that no other nations were actively involved in the conflict led me to that conclusion.