• This community needs YOUR help today. We rely 100% on Supporting Memberships to fund our efforts. With the ever increasing fees of everything, we need help. We need more Supporting Members, today. Please invest back into this community. I will ship a few decals too in addition to all the account perks you get.



    Sign up here: https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/account/upgrades
  • Friends, our 2nd Amendment rights are always under attack and the NRA has been a constant for decades in helping fight that fight.

    We have partnered with the NRA to offer you a discount on membership and Muzzleloading Forum gets a small percentage too of each membership, so you are supporting both the NRA and us.

    Use this link to sign up please; https://membership.nra.org/recruiters/join/XR045103

snake load test fire

Muzzleloading Forum

Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

CoyoteJoe

70 Cal.
Joined
Feb 1, 2005
Messages
4,994
Reaction score
26
Blackpowder snake shot loads.
There has been an ongoing discussion of the practicality of loading a cap & ball revolver with birdshot for defense against poisonous snakes. My speculation on the subject was that the limited chamber capacity would just not afford room for an effective combination of powder, wads and shot. But why speculate, why not conduct a simple little test? I chose to use my replica 1860 Colt Army .44 caliber revolver.

I don't suggest this to be the definitive work on the subject but just to give an idea of the capabilities of a .44 cap & ball revolver loaded with #8 birdshot.
First to decide on a powder charge I arbitrarily chose 20 grains as the smallest charge I believed likely to produce enough velocity to drive a shot pellet through a snake at close range. It might be possible that a lighter charge would be adequate but that is one thing the test was intended to determine.
With 20 grains weight of Goex 3fg settled into one chamber I then seated a 1/8" thick wad atop the powder and compressed it very heavily. I then poured #8 birdshot pellets atop the wad to fill the chamber just below the mouth, leaving room for another wad to hold the shot in place. I then dumped that shot onto my powder scale and found it balanced at 110 grains. I didn't bother to count the pellets but charts show #8 shot should run 410 pellets to one ounce so 110 grains weight would represent about 103 pellets, plus or minus a few. Coincidentally I found this to be an "equal volume load", One can use Lee powder dipper #1.3CC to measure out both 20 grains of powder and 110 grains of shot.
Here are the components
snakeload.jpg


I charged three chambers with that load, 20 grains powder and 110 grains #8 shot. I seated the top wad with very heavy compression and sealed it to the cylinder with clear nail polish to secure it against being unseated by recoil. I charged two more chambers with 20 grains of powder and a .457" diameter round ball topped off with deer tallow to seal the chamber.
The loaded cylinder then looked like this, with one chamber left empty for safe carry.
snakeload2.jpg



I was curious as to the velocity of this load but know from past experience that a single stray pellet can destroy a chronograph so I thought I would chronograph the ball loads and just assume the shot loads would have a similar velocity. The balls over 20 grains of Goex 3fg clocked only 612 fps. My .410 pistol with 10" barrel shows a bit over 900 fps for 3" shotshells. That velocity difference means each pellet from the .410 carries 2 1/4 times the energy of the .44 pellets.

I also wanted to test the penetration of this load but not having any snakes to serve as targets I elected to shoot some newspaper and compare penetration of the blackpowder load to penetration of a modern .410 shotshell. The pellets from the .44 penetrated only about 1/4" of newspaper. Those from the .410 went nearly twice as deep at about 7/16".
This is the .44 snake load at 10 feet. The entire pattern of 100+ pellets clustered in a circle of about 8" diameter. Clearly the snake would be hit many times and if the penetration is adequate that would be one dead snake.
snakeload10ft.jpg


Below is the .44 snake load at 20 feet, certainly not dependable at all. I also fired a target at 30 feet and suffice to say only 23 pellets struck anywhere on the 14x18" paper.
snakeload20ft.jpg


And for comparison, below is a real snake load, the 3" .410 shotshell at 30 feet.
snake410at30ft-1.jpg


All in all the .44 cap & ball did better than I had expected and would probably be deadly at 10-12 feet if the pellets have sufficient penetration, a matter of which I am uncertain.
 
I ain't certain but I don't think that snake looked to healthy to begin with! :wink: :haha: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

Never tried it with a cap n ball BP but I got a .22 that is deadly with snake shot and I think the shot may be finer than what you are shootin there!
 
Great test and great pictures.
Thanks for taking the time to do this.
Gives me a lot of food for thought.
Mike C.
 
Thanks for the test results.
Snake killing pistol distance is just about the arm held at 45 degrees.
 
cynthialee said:
Does your wife know you are swipeing her nail polish for your shooting?
:haha:

Thanks for the report. That nail polish idea is a really good one.
Gwen doesn't use nail polish, I own all the nail polish on this homestead. I find lots of uses for the stuff and unlike paint the nail polish doesn't dry out in the bottle. I have a couple of bottles I've been using for 20 years or more.
 
Thanks for sharing. 10' would be about a maximum distance shot and a single shot sure looks like it would do the job. If one was a bit closer, say with an outstretched arm- the muzzle 6' from the snake- it would be even more effective. I really wasn't sure what type of a pattern you could get on shot fired out of a rifled pistol barrel.
 
The 10 foot pattern was a surprise to me since I just don't ever shoot anything that close. I anticipated the pattern would be worthless at 30 feet and it was, but of course as you say 10 feet would likely be a long shot in this application.
 
Good little test , I,m not an expert , but have delt with many poison snakes over the years . Mostly Tx diaimond backs . I,ve found that it dosn,t take a great deal of force to kill them .
I used to kill several a year on the ranch . Most of them were dispatched with a
walking stick to the top of the head . Useto use the skins for wallets , hat bands , watch fobs etc . For those of you that have little or no experience in killing and handling the carcus , Do use extreme care . Here is a little caution , a snake dos NOT have to coil to strike . They can strike over their body length when lying nearly stright on the floor . On a lighter note they ARE good eating. :v
 
Another rattlesnake application for anyone wanting to do a later time (say 1880's) is a rattlesnake skin neck tie. You also might use one to cover a bow or a tomahawk handle.
Some will have a back up set of fangs in the head/skull. I am a little careful when dealing with the fangs, etc and as I said I'll usually shoot the head off but if a good whack killed the snake then I might save the head- but be careful, venom still as powerful dead or alive.
 
I know that there are many folks that say the taste is like chicken . I,ve always thought more like frog legs or American eel. Go easy on the spices for the meat has a very delicate flavor.
:thumbsup:
 
In my Ruger 45 Colt i use #12 shot, it works real good, i am going to try #12 Shot in my 1858 New Army, George.
 
Back
Top