Powder or 777 pellets

[ldykeman]

Many, I agree with you about that amount of powder kicking like a mule. I shoot a T/C Renegade with a T/C 1 in 66" rounball barrel. I shoot patched round balls exclusively in this barrel, with patches lubed with bore butter. The problem is that my rifle insists on at least 100 grains of Ffg Goex to group well. I started with 60 grains (swabbing between shots) and worked my way up until I found that it grouped best at 100 grs. The farthest I can shoot from my back deck is about 65 yards, but, even with older eyes using open sights, I can hit the bullseye of a 100 yd. NRA target as long as I do my part. When I drop down in load, I still hit in the black, but with much more open groups. But my cheek bone does take some punishment and I can't endure extended shooting sessions with it.
Larry

 

[faw3]

Im going to agree with ya on that. I use a Ithaca Hawken 50 or Sante Fe 53 useing RBs, and both dont like anything less than 90 to 110 grs 2f. Im new to RB's always shot some kind of slug out of the 1 of 30 something MLs Ive had since 1971, and it took lots of work with loads to get them to work out of 1X66 twist barrels. (never liked the hassle of loading RB's till a few yrs back, now I wouldnt use anything but RBs except for a Foster slug in a 62 Im just playing with for wild hogs out here) Each rifle has always needed a load work up yours sounds like 100 is just right for you. :grin: . Fred :hatsoff: ( oh ya your pellets may just be still burnning comeing out of the barrel and cause the pull to one side, Ive seen that before, dump them on someone that use's those ya dont need them.)

 

[ldykeman]

Forgot to mention.....My Renegade is .50 cal.
Larry

 

[Runner]

I shoot 70 grains of 2f under a 495 roundball patched with commercial pre-lubed Basspro patches. This is a very good deer load and I have killed many deer with it. I do not load newcomers the same way I load my gun and I will explain why. Most people hunt on public ground where there are other hunters around. A typical roundball deer hit thru the boiler room will make a mad dash of around 50 yards and pile up. Some a little farther, some a little less. My flinter buck went about 200 yards and was gone before the smoke cleared. Roundball is notorious for not producing blood trails for some yards from the site of the shot. On public ground, a deer that goes over 100 yards and leaves a trail that takes time to figure out may lead to another hunter either shooting or claiming the animal before you find it. It can also lead to lost game. In a newcomers gun I usually load a 385 Hornady Great Plains hollow base hollow point bullet. When they hit thru the boiler room, the deer usually drops on the spot or within sight. They are accurate in most guns. After the newcomer has killed a deer or two and has had time to spend on the range shootng roundball and learning his gun, then I tend to push them towards roundball for hunting. My flinter buck went 200 yards thru a dense tangle and I never did find a drop of blood. I found him because I am too stupid to quit and I was lucky. In a public ground situation, that could have been a disaster.
Roundball is historically accurate. It is a great deer load, even with modest powder loads. It doesn't kick bad, and is cheap to shoot. If you can track well or are hunting with someone that can on private ground, maybe it is the place for you to start. I prefer to get the person comfortable with muzzleloader hunting and then move them on to roundball.
Warning! The 385 over 100 grains of 2f will kick pretty good. If you are recoil sensitive, go straight to the 70 grain roundball loads. Just learn your gun well before season.

 

[boar]

I bought one lb of clean shot and my guns shot to left with it. I shot 80grs 2ff in my 50 and 90 in 54 using RB. If I shoot max-balls in 50 I use 100grs 2ff. Dilly

 

[NYMorey]

Thanks JR. I have a whole pile of Round balls, patches and targets. I can't wait to get back to the range and start playing!
With open sights (no scope!), I don't usually shoot more 50 yds but I always check where I am at 75 and 100 yds, just so I know the capabilties of my rifle.

As far as cleaning, I always use the wire barrel brush during cleaning after I shoot.

One more qiuck question, the flat on the ball faces up or down?

PS - No deer tonight, only saw doe and with a few already in the fridge I'm only after a buck.

 

[Zonie]

"...One more qiuck question, the flat on the ball faces up or down?..."
_____________________________________________
Although some folks swear it makes a difference, the testing done by the "Bevel Brothers" in MuzzleBlasts seems to indicate it doesn't.

IMO, the important thing to do is to be consistant and to make sure the flat is not going to be to the side where it might not compress the patch evenly.

As you've already found, the pellets do not work well in a sidelock rifle.
The main reasons for this is the distance between the pellet and the cap is very long so the caps flame cools before it gets to the pellet.
Also, when loading loose powder, some of it blows back down thru the flame channel towards the nipple where it's easily ignited.

zonie

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

In my experience, it is easier to control the sprue position if you load with the sprue up.

 

[Rat Trapper]

Half the fun of muzzleloaders is reading and asking these questions. There a a lot of really good books out there too. Every gun seems to be a law on to it's own. My TC Hawken shoots best with 120 grains of Triple Seven loose 2F, CCI mag #11 and the Hornady 390 Grain hollow base, hollow point Great Plains bullet. Muzzle vel is 1671 feet per second with this load. The worse group I have had with this load at 50 yds was 1 3/8 inches and the best was 3/4 inch. I put a TC bore button wad on top of the powder before I push the bullet down. My best groups came after I started weighting my powder charges and using the bore buttons. This load does kick a little bit, but not all that bad. It does hit deer with real authority and leaves them with their feet sticking in the air close to where impact was made. I cast Lee 300 grain REAL bullets for target/plinking and use a lighter loading. The Hornady bullet shoots best, but my home cast bullets are cheaper. I use bore butter with the REAL bullets and do not have to wipe between shots at all when using Triple Seven 2F.

 

[strongarm]

Pellets are 3x as expensive and powder. They need to be slightly crushed as you seat the sabot. They have a slight black end(black powder for ignition) that needs to go in first. They are about 20% lower in energy than powder. And this is suppose to be easier? :shake:

 

[Landngroove]

In the oldtime cartridges like the .45-70 the second number is the grains of black powder. So you can see that the 44-40 and 45-70 and 30-30 killed a lot of game with a lot less powder than you are using. The 50-120 is a real mankiller at both ends.

Just my opinion. :bull:

Many Klatch

For the record, the .30-30 was never a black powder cartridge. It was first known as the .30 Winchester Center Fire, and loaded with the new, (at that time, around 1895) smokeless powder.

 

[Slamfire]

In the oldtime cartridges like the .45-70 the second number is the grains of black powder. So you can see that the 44-40 and 45-70 and 30-30 killed a lot of game with a lot less powder than you are using. The 50-120 is a real mankiller at both ends.

Just my opinion. :bull:

Many Klatch

For the record, the .30-30 was never a black powder cartridge. It was first known as the .30 Winchester Center Fire, and loaded with the new, (at that time, around 1895) smokeless powder.

Actually the first load were with a powder called Lesmoke, not that it matters alll that much. :winking:

 

[cayugad]

The reason you're having misfires with pellets is because the rifle is not designed to shoot pellets. The rifle was made to shoot loose powder.

There are a few traditional rifles that "shoot pellets." The T/C Firestorm, Tradition's PA Pellet flintlock rifle, and some of the custom made traditional rifles shoot pellets.

I think if you loaded 70 grains of Pyrodex RS and a 370 grain Maxiball you might like the accuracy. 80 grains of Pyrodex RS or Goex in 90 grains and a .490 patched roundball will also shoot real well for you.

Also some of the 1:48 twists will shoot sabots, but that is not what they are really intended for. Although if you do shoot them be sure and clean the barrel with a bore brush from time to time to take out any plastic fowling. The New Englander rifle is a good rifle. My friend shoots one all the time and has taked deer out to 75 yards without problem. He shoots 70 grains and the maxiball.