Patch Issue

[yonderin]

Good day to you all. I’ve been lurking on here for a while, it’s been quite educational and entertaining. I’ve only been muzzleloading for a couple years, getting into it more serious this year. Got a match coming up shortly and something odd happened this morning at the range that I’m not sure I’ve got time to sort out on my own so hoping you folks with more experience can help me troubleshoot it. FWIW I'm shooting a .50 TC Hawken perc with pure lead .490 RB.

Followed my usual routine and pretty much all the patches I was able to recover were burnt through and a bit further out from the muzzle than I recall normally finding them. They were BURNT, a black doughnut was the most intact of most I found.

I’ve been using patches from TOTW, both .018 ticking and .020 cotton. They’ve always held together fine so I don’t suspect it’s the patches themselves. The last couple of times I’ve tried Bore Butter, Mink Oil from TOTW and Hoppes BP solvent trying to find the best combo. I prepp’ed my patches about 3 weeks ago, melting the BB and Mink Oil to dip the patches into. Used the same batch today, keeping the patches in a plastic bag in the ”˜tween time. Only difference from last time is charge, 50 vs 55 gr GOEx FFFg.

I’m WAG’ing that it might be patch lube has interacted with the material(not that I really buy it), knowing that linseed oil and cotton are bad mojo is the basis for my guess. No issues 3 weeks ago but now they self-destruct with obvious results down range. The couple of BB lubed ones I found had cuts but not destroyed like the others. That may be a clue?

Until I get back out with some fresh lubed patches; any answers or suggestions?

Thanks.

 

[Zonie]

Welcome to the forum.

I know that some of the "pre-lubed" patches I have bought blew apart when they were shot but these were old patches.

When I say "old" I'm talking of being a year or more old and they were pre-lubed by the factory.

I've also heard of water soluble oil used for lubricating cutting tools can break down cotton fibers but here again, it takes a long time for this to happen.
Years ago, people were making their patch lube using just water soluble oil plus water. Some added a bit of Murphy's Oil Soap.
They called it "Moose Milk" and it would ruin patches after a long period of time.

If you have any untreated patch material you might try using it and lubing it just before it's loaded.

 

[Wes/Tex]

One quick trick is to ram a patch down on the powder charge before loading the patched ball! Yeah I know, but it is a quick, dirty way around the problem! :wink: :haha: :thumbsup:

 

[pa woods roamer]

I use 35 MM film canisters when using the Mink Oil patches. They are pretty well airtight and waterproof. I used to melt the Mink Oil and soak the Patches too, but have found out that a little rubbed on both sides work just as well. Also,not as messy !!

 

[AZbpBurner]

Most of my PRB shooting has been using a beeswax & tallow blend for patch lube. It was what an old gent showed me while shooting some of his many original flintlocks & he said what his father and grandfather always used. The recipe always worked for me, but as I kept reading about Dutch Schoulz's "Dry Patch" recommendation that I tried my own recipe. I now use a mix of 5 parts Denatured Alcohol to 1 part Castor Oil, and it is now my standard patch for all my rifles & I also treat fiber wads with it for the Fusils.

Fouling build-up is greatly reduced & I don't need to swab as often.

 

[Dr5x]

If whatever system or recipe works for you, gives you tight enough groups and doesn't harm the rifle is the way to go.
My System is what worked excellently for me and for quite a few others who not discovered their own solution to accuracy problems on their own.

I found great enjoyment in taking a rifle with wretched groups , studying what it might want and turning it into a prize winner.

I am all for anyone who can by whatever means solve the problem rifle on his own.. It takes a while in some cases but as you see the improvement slowly creeping into your loading process its a good feeling.

I think taming a wild animal through patience would give you the same feeling.

Dutch

 

[Dr5x]

Wunderin,
Burnt patches have always indicated to me that the patching material is a bit too thin. The fiery blast from the burning powder is bypassing the patching.

I doubt very much that the patch lube is causing the burning unless its some sort of highly flammable oil.

Try shimming your current patches with a sheet of thin paper between patch and ball and see if that makes difference.

Dutch Schoultz

 

[MountainRanger]

It can be a common problem finding the right patch/lube combination for a particular rifle. My old flintlock loved patches from an old flannel shirt. When I got my Lyman GPR, that patch material and almost any kind of lube burned through, so I played with different thicknesses and finally found a workable solution. My SW Virginia .45 cal with a rice barrel likes a thick flannel best. I get a nice pattern with either olive oil or Ballistol as a lube.

You might just have to experiment with the lubes suggested by others and different patch thicknesses. Just remember to Never use polyester material.

Good luck

 

[yonderin]

Back to the range this morning and lubed patches as I loaded (only used BB and Mink Oil). Everything went fine, found 1 cut patch and the rest were all as should be.

Groups tightened back up, 2-3 inches @ 50 yds which was where I was before. Good enough for matches here so I don't have to tweak any more but looking for any little extra just for the challenge of it.

Ran a brush down the barrel between shots, BB got progressively harder to ram so thinking MO might be the way ahead.

Lots of things for tinkering with.

 

[yonderin]

This is making me lose my mind. Back to range this morning, thinking I'd learned something yesterday. Used MO applied at loading.

Started off with swabbing after loading, patches were destroyed again, shredded and burnt, even smoldering on the ground. Terrible groups. Don't really understand how it works to swab after loading but it did ok with my flintlock.
Switched to running a brush down the bore before loading, patches were normal but groups still weren't anything to get excited about.
Decided to just load and fire to see how long until fouling became a problem. No problem after 10 rounds and ended up with a couple of 1 hole groups at 25 yards.

:idunno:

 

[FrontierMuzzleloading]

MO?

 

[Black Hand]

Go to the fabric store and buy a yard of pillow ticking. Wash on hot and dry. Rip into strips and cut into squares, Place into a container made of foil, apply Mink Oil or Bore Butter, place in a toaster oven at ~180-200F to melt the lube and saturate the patch material.

 

[yonderin]

Mink Oil.

 

[ohio ramrod]

I have found that a leather, or felt, over powder wad will prevent blowby and patch burning.To test just wad up a patch or two to make an over powder wad and give it a try.I got this idea from watching a man fold over his swabbing patch and use it as an over powder wad. It worked for him so I tried it. Now I use a leather over powder wad all of the time. :idunno:

 

[MountainRanger]

Maybe your barrel just likes to be a bit dirty. My rice barrel shoots better after a coupke of shots

 

[nhmoose]

BB?

 

[Black Hand]

Bore Butter (I presume).

 

[mooman76]

I have sometimes found patches burned through using BB that otherwise didn't. It still shot good though as the outer part of the patch didn't burn.