new shooter needs help

[cheffy]

I inherited an Italian made .44 C&B revolver. Granted I'm sure it's not the best quality but I'd like to have some fun with it. I took it out last weekend and out of 20 rounds I hit the "target" 6. How can I increase the accuracy?
I used 30 grain Pyrodex pellets and a .451 Hornaday ball, CCI #10 cap.

 

[Rikeman]

Pellets?! :hmm: I would also suggest using a .454 ball to make sure you are getting a tight fit.

Please tell us more about the gun. What model. What condition, who made it. Will give us some things to go on about your situation. Photos also tell a lot.

I have never used pellets, and have heard little about them on this forum, but you are sure to get plenty of suggestions to try loose powder!

 

[Bob Riegl]

:hmm: Lot's of info missing here. It may not be the gun's problem but yours. If you have never shot a pistol before and you try to shoot a C&B lewoliwer offhand---well it jest ain't gonna work well IMHO.Tell us more about the gun and how you shot it---I know you pulled the Trigger and it went bang. Seriously my friend did you bench shoot it or what. Tell us more there are many here with plenty of knowledge and experience to help you towards success. :thumbsup:

 

[Musketeer]

I've never used Pyro pellets, but I've heard from others that there can be a noticeable delay between cap ignition and powder ignition on a C&B revolver with them. I don't know if you've experienced this, but that would really hamper accurate shooting. Get a can of loose Pyro P (the regular powder form) or order some FFFg black powder online and try that out. I second the suggestion to move up to .454 balls, also.

 

[TFoley]

I've never used Pyro pellets, but I've heard from others that there can be a noticeable delay between cap ignition and powder ignition on a C&B revolver with them. I don't know if you've experienced this, but that would really hamper accurate shooting. Get a can of loose Pyro P (the regular powder form) or order some FFFg black powder online and try that out. I second the suggestion to move up to .454 balls, also.

Pyrodex pellets?

B...........................................ang.

Nuff said.

tac

 

[mykeal]

Not enough information.

For instance, what distance were you shooting? 6 shots out of 20 on the paper shooting duelist at 100 yards would get me a steak dinner just about anywhere.

I'll second the concerns about shooting pellets in a revolver. That's rarely done, and always results in decreased accuracy compared to loose powder. The first suggestion to improve accuracy is an easy one: get a powder measure and some loose powder, preferably real black if possible.

 

[Zonie]

cheffy
Welcome to the Forum.

As you didn't say anything about having problems with mis-fires, go ahead and use up the remaining pellets.
The others are right though. The granulated powder will work better so when you buy the next supply get the Pyrodex P. The P stands for Pistol.
While your at the gun store buying your powder be sure to ask them if they carry REAL black powder.
They can't keep it on a shelf like the substitute powders so you have to ask for it.
If they do carry real black powder then forget about the Pyrodex and buy the real stuff. It will work much better in your gun.

I don't know if you've read about loading your revolver but it is highly recommended that after you have loaded the powder and ball into each chamber you should cover the mouth of the chamber and the ball with a lube.
Although there are factory lubes like Wonderlube 1000 and several others plain old Crisco (a white vegetable shortning used for cooking) will work just as well.
This lube not only lubricates the ball as it passes thru the barrel but it also seals off the mouth of the chambers to prevent any possibility of a "Chain fire".
Chain fireing is the term we use when the loaded chambers not in line with the barrel fire from the flash of the chamber that is being shot.
Also, make sure that all loaded chambers have a primer on them.
Many people feel that chain fires are often caused by a uncapped or loosly capped loaded chamber.

I know that with practice your accuracy will get better. One thing that may help you shoot your revolver better is knowing that all of the Civil War style revolvers were made to shoot high.
Knowing this and aiming low will probably get you hitting the target 9 out of 10 shots or better.

 

[mazo kid]

Yup, what Zonie said!! Emery

 

[cheffy]

Thanks for all the info so far. I really appreciate it. a little more on the gun. It's an "armsport model 5139. 1860 Army with steel frame.
I was shooting at 25 yrds.
The first few shots I did do off hand just to get a feel for it. the rest were benched.
Yes, I think I did experience some hang time with the pellets.
So next time I'll try the bigger balls and loose powder.

next question How much "P" pyrodex and should I use a wad over the powder?
I've also read that some people use a "filler" below the ball to get it closer to the chamber end. Is this an advanced technique that I shouldn't worry about?
I'd settle for 10-12" groups.
Thanks again for all the help.

 

[Musketeer]

A method many people use is to start with a smaller-than-max charge (15 grains or so) with filler to take up the space between powder and ball (so the ball sits just beneath the chamber mouth, as with a full charge of powder). Then, they move up to 20 grains, 25 grains, and so on up to the maximum charge, testing each load for accuracy. Often, lighter-than-max loads are more accurate. The old Lyman handbook has max loads for 1860 style guns as 37 grains, but I've never gone above 30 in mine (just because that's the size spout that came on my powder flask and seems to fill up the chambers pretty well). Lubed wads serve the same purpose as grease over the chamber mouths, to keep fouling soft and seal the chambers, but they're way less messy. I suppose you could also use 2 or 3 (or so) wads in place of filler on light loads (though I've never tried it). If you plan to do a good bit of shooting, you'll probably want to look into making your own wads (search around here in the pistol section for more info) to save some money. :thumbsup:

 

[Mike 56]

The load my 51 Colt likes is a 38sp case full of Pyrodex P and a 9mm case full of grits. With a little Crisco over the seated balls.

Mike

 

[cheffy]

mike, do you put a wad between the powder and the grits? I've also heard of using cornmeal or cream O' wheat.

 

[renovato]

My .44 revolvers seem to be their most accurate with charges in the 22-27 grain range. I shoot only black powder, so I don't know how Pyrodex would perform in them.

You want the ball to shave a ring of lead as you seat it. This seals the chambers against hot gasses igniting the powder in adjacent chambers and it creates a driving band on the ball so that it grips the rifling well. If your .451s shave a good ring, then they're the right size. If they shave a tiny ring, then moving up to .454 will give better performance.

There's nothing advanced about using filler or wads. I switch back and forth between wads and cornmeal/grits a lot. They both work really well. Basically, you need to figure out how much to use to get the balls to seat near the mouth of the chamber. Takes a little tinkering, but once you have it down, it's simple. Wads or filler also helps scrub fouling out of the bore.

Let us know how it works out for you.

 

[Mike 56]

I use a wad or filler. I tried cream of wheat and corn meal my self i like grits. Try all three and see which one you like. Experiment try different combinations of powders, fillers, and wads to see what you and your gun like.

Mike

 

[pondoro]

John Taffin has a great article Cowboy Shooting Cap n Ball Style at Sixguns.com. And Elmer Keith has a great chapter in his book Sixguns if you want to read more about these guns. Or peruse the forum here for numerous threads about cap and ball guns.