need help for stock finish/ color

[horsetrader]

I am trying to have a very light colored stock ( maple with good figure). So far I experiemented with a lot of stains/ mixes and colors. Nothing really I like so far.... Almost want a "blonde" stock but showing the figure with deeper/darker accents). I have read on this forum about the lye treatment to bring out the figure - would the lye treatment also "slightly" colour the wood? Has anybody tried to use the lye only ( no stain). It is hard to find lye around here... so before driving an hour both directions to pick some up , I was hoping somebody can help or have an other idea....

 

[Stophel]

OK. Lye reacts with tannic acid in the wood. Maple has varying degrees of tannic acid...usually not much. I have tested lye on several pieces of sugar maple I have. Some color a magnificent light golden brown (the color I have yearned for for years), some do absolutely nothing. Depends upon the particular piece of wood.

Now, theoretically, you can add tannic acid, to control the darkness of the color. Boil up some acorns, and you should have a suitable tannic acid solution. I intend to try this, but haven't gotten around to it yet.

Here's one nice piece of sugar maple. This one is MINE, and is going to be for "The Ultimate Rifle".

The next one is a piece of SOFT maple (which I ended up ditching...it's pretty, but soft as spruce). Sitting next to an unstained cherry blank.

Here it is on a plain piece of sugar maple, wet, and dry.

Now, I cannot say if this was actually done in the 18th century. I THINK that PERHAPS it was. It certainly was not an unknown concept at the time. There are a few maple stocked guns that are lightly colored, and obviously never stained with Aqua Fortis...they COULD have been done this way, or they could have just darkened a little from the oil over time.

 

[jmforge]

have you tried any of the lighter colored Fiebings spirit based leather dyes like yellow or British tan?

 

[rich pierce]

Laurel Mountain Forge's Honey Maple should work fine. I've always used aquafortis and it can be diluted to give a light color. The Marshall rifle is quite light in color and appears to be "original color".

A lot of old/antique birdseye maple furniture is quite light in color. I wonder if they stained it at all. In contrast, older curly maple chairs and furniture including colonial pieces (highboys for example) tend to have the orangish color and are seldom reddish. I think we can expect that most old pieces have darkened with age and were lighter originally.

This is one piece of curly maple with different concentrations and # of applications of aquafortis, with and without a potassium permanganate wash afterwards.

"A" is nitric acid alone.
"B" is dilute aquafortis with iron dissolved in it. This is a great color.

"C" is a great color and is stronger AQF with lots of iron.

"D" and "F" have the potassium permanganate wash added.

"E" is also a terrific color and i think received 3 or 4 applications of what I used on "C".

 

[kansas_volunteer]

Lye is sodium hydroxide, and the principal ingredient in drain cleaners. If you can find Red Devil drain cleaner, a dry crystalized form of lye, you should be able to mix small batches for stock stain purposes. Lye will cause chemical burns if it gets on your skin. Vinegar is the antidote. Wash the lye burn with it and you'll be fine, just keep it handy. Protect your eyes.

 

[Stophel]

You can see my bottle of Red Devil Lye in the top photo. Yes, it will eat your fingerprints off. Do as I say, and not as I do, and wear rubber gloves. When done, wash the wood off with water.

You can really go 18th century, and leach your lye from wood ashes, but the substance you get at the end is the same.

I have no idea what the proportions of your solution should be. I just take a jar with water in it, and sprinkle in some lye...oh, 'bout yay much. Slop it on the wood.

It is a simpler process than using Aqua Fortis (no heat required), and I neutralize A.F. with lye anyway.

Lye is the traditional method of coloring Cherry deep red (cherry is loaded with tannic acid...much more than maple).

 

[horsetrader]

Beautifull wood - and a colour I like!!!

 

[horsetrader]

Rich,
I guess there is just one answer to my quest... built more guns in diffrent colours!

 

[bioprof]

One observation about using aquafortis. I have noticed that the color is much darker on the stock than on a flat test piece of wood. On a stock, there is end grain that absorbs more of the aquafortis, hence a darker color. I have found again and again that my flat test piece is the perfect color, but after putting it on the stock it comes out too dark, even if I tested it on wood from the same stock.

I have come to the conclusion that the harder the wood, the better when it comes to using aquafortis. Soft wood seems to soak up the reagent and turn very dark.

In general, is sugar maple better than red maple when it comes to using aquafortis?

 

[kansas_volunteer]

Here's a fairly long discussion on coloring maple that gets in to muzzleloaders a bit:
http://forums.dfoggknives.com/lofiversion/index.php/t8480.html

 

[widget350]

Do you happen to know about what degree of dilution (in alcohol?) you used on B? I'm just looking for a starting point.

 

[dodgecummins01]

If you have a plain gun (no carving) then you can use black liquid close die. Let dry for 24 hours. This serves two purposes, it will raise the grain so you can fuzz it off and leave the softer curl dark. The whole stock will look like a piece of charcoal. Now the work begins, using 0000 steel wool remove all the fuzz down to where the stock is white again. This leaves the soft curl of the stock a nice black color. After this is done apply LMF dark walnut (one even coat) and let dry for 24 hours. Finish with Original Oil Finish from TOW per directions. If you have a scrap piece from the stock you can experiment with this application. I don't seem to have the pictures of the stock after doing the steel wooling. This may not be the correct way but I like it over using an acid finish. On one final note if your stock does not have much curl I would use an alchol base stain. OK now you can flame me.

 

[bioprof]

Looks good to me. There is more than one way to skin a cat. :thumbsup:

 

[Stophel]

One observation about using aquafortis. I have noticed that the color is much darker on the stock than on a flat test piece of wood. On a stock, there is end grain that absorbs more of the aquafortis, hence a darker color. I have found again and again that my flat test piece is the perfect color, but after putting it on the stock it comes out too dark, even if I tested it on wood from the same stock.

I have come to the conclusion that the harder the wood, the better when it comes to using aquafortis. Soft wood seems to soak up the reagent and turn very dark.

In general, is sugar maple better than red maple when it comes to using aquafortis?

As a general rule, with Aqua Fortis, sugar maple tends to color more orange-red, and red maple tends to color darker brown. Neutralizing with lye will turn the color more orange-red.

The beauty of using chemical colorants like this, rather than stains/dyes/pigments, is that you are actually changing the color of the wood, not stuffing the grain with pigment...which may or may not actually stay in place. With chemical colorants, the grain stays clear and bright, and maintains depth, unlike with aniline dyes, which tend to muddy the grain, and conceal the depth of the wood.

 

[Zonie]

Welcome to the Forum!
Interesting method Normie and nice looking guns.

Oh, by the way, we may disagree with others but we don't "flame" people on this forum. It's against the rules. :thumbsup:

 

[dodgecummins01]

That's good to know! Thanks Zonie.

 

[ricklandes]

Nice color!
I've used the black with a bit of brown in it for horn coloring, but not for wood... :hmm: