Lead or Leather to Secure Your Flint?

[Freedom]

Just wanted some opinions on what you guys use in the jaws to hold your flint.

I've heard lead trashes your lock by adding too much weight.
Ive heard leather is a shock absorber causing poor ignition.

Opinions???/Wisdom :hatsoff:

 

[Tom Carr]

I was wondering about that myself. I have read period texts that mention both being used, but Im still new to this myself and have to defer to more experienced shooters. The 50cal Pedersoli Frontier I have, came with a thin sheet of lead around its flint. Works fine for me and I dont think the minimal extra weight would make much of a difference.

 

[Semisane]

I'm no expert - can only report my personal experience.

I've used lead with my Great Plains flintlock since I got it last Christmas (my first and only FL). It works for me - grips the flint firmly, stays put, good sparks. I do have to re-tighten the cock screw after the first two three strikes after I put in a new flint. I have no need or desire to try leather. To date, I have about 500 shots through the gun.

 

[Johnny Tremain]

Tho I use lead in my Chambers lock.

They say not to. It does not give the hammer and jaw cushion when it hits the end of its run, and can bend the jaw screw, and or crack the hammer.

The lead holds my wee flints better than the leather ever did.

 

[Mountainman56]

Just wanted some opinions on what you guys use in the jaws to hold your flint.

I've heard lead trashes your lock by adding too much weight.
Ive heard leather is a shock absorber causing poor ignition.

Opinions???/Wisdom :hatsoff:

Seems to me the onliest way to know for sure is to try both and settle on the one YOU like the best.

:2

 

[kevthebassman]

I've tried both, I've found that my flints last longer using leather. I can't tell a difference in reliability or speed.

 

[Larry Pletcher]

Just wanted some opinions on what you guys use in the jaws to hold your flint.

I've heard lead trashes your lock by adding too much weight.
Ive heard leather is a shock absorber causing poor ignition.

Opinions???/Wisdom :hatsoff:

Good Morning,
This ia a topic that is often discussed. The link below takes you to a group of photos that may (or may not) help your decision.

Link

Regards,
Pletch

 

[jtmattison]

I use very thin leather. I don't think it's absorbing any shock. IMO it holds much better than thicker leather.
I never tried lead but if I did I would pound it out very thin so I doubt weight would be an issue. Matter of fact I have a bunch of dental X-ray lead in neat little paper thin wafers. Maybe I'll try one.

HD

 

[Tom Compton]

Leather. Shot for years w/ some of the best flint shooters from IL, MO, AR, TX, OK, LA, TN, MS and AL - the consensus was leather. Who am I to contradict them?
TC

 

[gjkershul]

I use sheet lead for my big military flintlocks and leather for my smaller civilian rifle and pistol locks.

 

[paulvallandigham]

If you use either thin Raw Hide, or lead to wrap the flint, the flint doesn't rebound off the frizzen when it hits. You will know what is happening when you see "chatter marks " on the face of the frizzen begin to appear. I saw one of Larry Pletcher's high speed photos printed and tacked up to one of the rails outside Gunmaker's Hall at Friendship when he was testing flintlocks, and you could clearly see the flint rebounding( or bouncing) off the frizzen when it was wrapped in thicker, Tanned leather.

I discuss this problem at length in my article on Shooting and Tuning Flintlocks, and give a simple test you can do with your own gun to compare lead to leather. See Member Resources on the Index page, then scroll down to " articles, charts, and links." Click on articles, and the second article down is the one I wrote on Shooting and Tuning Flintlocks. I learned this from a late friend, who died 17 years ago today from Multiple Sclerosis, when I was the " Doubting Thomas " about using lead to wrap flints.

 

[brubincam]

-----onliest ?-----

 

[roundball]

Leather works perfectly...always has...if a lock needs lead to work better, then there's something else going on that its compensating for

 

[temple]

i have some left over elk hide from when i made my moccassins and it works great. its thick enough the it pads the steel from direct contact but its soft enough that is smushes down nice and tight on the flint. for example i tried adjust the angle on the flint while it was in the jaws and i couldn't even wiggle it. as far as i'm concerned lead goes down the barrel.

 

[Freedom]

WOW these are some great pics!! :hatsoff:

I'm pretty sure none of my lock work like this NO matter what I wrap the flints in.

I use a lot of both and found lead seems to leave a smoother strike mark on the frizzen

Thanks for all the info guys

.

Just wanted some opinions on what you guys use in the jaws to hold your flint.

I've heard lead trashes your lock by adding too much weight.
Ive heard leather is a shock absorber causing poor ignition.

Opinions???/Wisdom :hatsoff:

Good Morning,
This ia a topic that is often discussed. The link below takes you to a group of photos that may (or may not) help your decision.

Link

Regards,
Pletch

 

[Freedom]

Thanks for this....I read this quite a while ago when someone posted a link in another forum...Good Stuff... You should have seen the arguments that came up when it was mentioned a flinter lock can actualy outrun a capgun :grin:

If you use either thin Raw Hide, or lead to wrap the flint, the flint doesn't rebound off the frizzen when it hits. You will know what is happening when you see "chatter marks " on the face of the frizzen begin to appear. I saw one of Larry Pletcher's high speed photos printed and tacked up to one of the rails outside Gunmaker's Hall at Friendship when he was testing flintlocks, and you could clearly see the flint rebounding( or bouncing) off the frizzen when it was wrapped in thicker, Tanned leather.

I discuss this problem at length in my article on Shooting and Tuning Flintlocks, and give a simple test you can do with your own gun to compare lead to leather. See Member Resources on the Index page, then scroll down to " articles, charts, and links." Click on articles, and the second article down is the one I wrote on Shooting and Tuning Flintlocks. I learned this from a late friend, who died 17 years ago today from Multiple Sclerosis, when I was the " Doubting Thomas " about using lead to wrap flints.

 

[roundball]

"...should have seen the arguments that came up when it was mentioned a flinter lock can actualy outrun a capgun..."
:grin:

Most "arguements" are base on loosly used terminology...different people are arguing from differents points of view, and consequently can never get on the same page.

For example, in your own post just now you used the phrase "A flintlock can outrun a capgun".....and I have no earthly idea what "outrun" means...I'm sure you know what you meant but there's no way for me / us to know.

For example, sparks may "begin" igniting prime in a Flintlock before flame is coming out of a caps fire channel.

However, the only test comparing caplock to Flintlock speed that is a level playing field and of any significant value.....is "the amount of time from the sear breaking until the ball exits the muzzle".

Assuming proper working equipment and powder for the test of course, caplocks will win that test every time.

 

[renovato]

We've had the leather vs. lead threads a few times in the past. There's never a concensus. I suggest trying both and seeing which works best for your lock. I have yet to see anything that would convince me that one has an advantage over another, but it actually might in your lock. Personally, I use lead because I wanted to fire my flintlock when it came in, so I flattened a ball and used it to mount the flint, and went shooting. It works great for me. I never tried leather.

 

[Larry Pletcher]

(snipped)

However, the only test comparing caplock to Flintlock speed that is a level playing field and of any significant value.....is "the amount of time from the sear breaking until the ball exits the muzzle".

Assuming proper working equipment and powder for the test of course, caplocks will win that test every time.

Hi Roundball,
I think you heard this before , but your suggestion is in my plans for this winter. The test gun is a Chambers kit. It will be tried with a small Siler flint, a small Siler percussion, and (we hope) a mule ear built on a small Siler plate. The locks will be tripped with a plunger striking the sear from below, actually through the trigger plate. The computer time will start with the plunger. A photo cell will be positioned to "look" across the muzzle. A small charge of barrel powder will be used. The cell will be tripped by material exiting the muzzle. We'll do a number of trials and find an average. The mule ear will have the advantage of a straight line into the barrel. Next will be the percussion through a drum and nipple. The last to be measured will be the flint with a Chambers liner. (The flint being last is simply because I don't want to drill out a perfectly good liner to do a different test phase.)

Regarding testing, I am increasingly skeptical of any results based on human senses. After thousands of individual timing trials with flints, I don't trust my own eyes - for that matter no one elses either. I think opinion has its place, but trust numbers instead of my eyes.

Regards,
Pletch

 

[arquebus]

As with most things, each gun is an individual & will require different things, be it load development, bedding, etc., to work optimally. I use a lead wrap for the flint in my .54 rifle with a Siler lock, but a leather one in my Pedersoli Manton pistol. Then again the .54 prefers English flints while the Manton prefers French Amber. What works with my guns probably won't with yours, but you need to try different things to see what works best in what you have.