Full length bedding

[HighUintas]

With all of the work that goes into making a nice stock, why in the world wouldn’t you use glass bedding? Makes the stock multiples stronger and I think also, more accurate. I like Pro Bed 2000 as it’s the easiest for me to use and seems to be pretty strong, it’s a bit higher priced but again, compared to the cost of all else, it is minimal.

I use that for my bolt guns. With how thick that stuff is, do you leaves extra large gaps so all the excess can be squished out? Is the compound noticeable at the stock line if you have a minimal gap?

 

[oldwood]

To bed anything on a m/l gun , dollar epoxie , with brown epoxie dye mixed in , works perfect. The dye makes epoxie invisible when the gun is stained. If you examine original guns , no bedding , loose fit , still accurate.

 

[Hatman/2nd line]

Dave Person is right especially about using varnish, it's amazing how much strength is given the wood using it.

 

[RobertE]

If one is just looking for a thin epoxy to strengthen the barrel channel, I wonder if something like this would work? A lot cheaper than acraglas. Z-poxy finishing resin, 12 oz.
Bob

 

[DuncNZ]

Lee's Alox bullet lube is a great release agent , spread on thinly or used to fill gaps where bedding is not needed .

 

[DuncNZ]

I've talked about this before. If I have to bed a cracked forearm , bed a forearm cap , or whatever , I use common super market grocery bags for release agents. When release agents came on the market , from Brownells , I used them with some success on restocking ctg. rifles. Soon as muzzleloaders came my way , I experimented with Brownell's products , and found them unnecessarily expensive. Free bags , and cheap epoxie , good enough for muzzleloader wood repairs. Why spend $40+ for a kit , plus shipping? Directions.......Cut a grocery bag in strips big enough to wrap a gun barrel snugly , and tape the top seam w/scotch tape. Make sure the coated barrel slips into the barrel channel. Pour the mixed epoxie into the barrel channel , and squeeze the barrel into position. Don't clamp tightly , you might bend the barrel. Soon after the epoxie hardens ,remove the barrel , and strip out the release plastic. Have used this method for 30+ years with excellent results.........oldwood

Non reusable thin plastic Supermarket bags are illegal in this country , I suppose plastic food wrap would work

 

[oldwood]

Plastic film is Plastic film. Doesn't matter.

 

[DuncNZ]

I use 1/16 wire pins ,and once the hole is made for the pin in the lug, I just take the drill and elongate the hole in the lug . So simple but so necessary , especially if using thinner barrels like 7/8" and 13/16/ '. oct. Also , tiny pins are not as visible in the stock, so perfection in drilling is not as critical. I won't tell if you don't. My current source for good springy wire pin stock , is those little marker flags used on construction sites , and in farm fields. They are .070 thick ,and 1/16" wire pins are about .064 thick. The flag wire is a touch larger than 1/16th , so the correct drill size helps. ........ Back 1973, a friend was teaching a class in a local High school shop , to build m/l rifles. He copied a John Bivin's Bicentennial long rifle using a home made precarver. He used 6 or 7 , Getz ,44" .50 cal. "C" WT. barrels , all things identical. After the guns were finished , the ones pinned tightly , woudn't shoot accurately , until the pinning slots were elongated. I built one of the copies that had elongated pin slots , and my .50 was very accurate. Shot competition w/it for many years.........oldwood

Hey Oldwood , I have just pulled the barrels off 4 custom made firearms I haven't had the barrels off for 25 + years ,and the only one without slots is my .40 Narragansett arms J P Beck rifle ,( not the best built rifle I own ) it has round holes and pins made of wire which have just been cur off with side cutters , I will replace them with larger pins and drill the holes oval . Thanks again for your advise
PS I had beeswax coated the barrels 25 years or so ago and then squeezed them closed , none showed any sign of rust or wood deterioration , no water or cleaner of any kind had gotten in ..

 

[oldwood]

Cutfinger. ...........I have only one musket from 1971 to use as a standard as far as seeing wood deterioration under the gun barrel. The gun was a Navy arms B.Bess Kit. I had been Re finishing some modern WW1 era military rifles for a guy ,and noticed many of them had copious amounts of boiled linseed oil, or some kind of varnish in the barrel channel , so , that prompted me to do the same with the m/l guns I built. That 1971 era Bess Musket has no corrosion under the barrel at all.
Also , as far as barrel pins, To modify what I said in the previous post , I've built only a few m/l rifles from total wood blank scratch. They shot well with the sloppy barrel inletting I employed , and incorrect pinning as well. However ,when my friend Fred began using his modern stock duplicator , the barrel channels were with in .020 of perfect. Wood swells , and shrinks , causing barrel fit to be tight. That's when the pin slotting on barrel lugs becomes critical. I've disassembled several original Long rifles to look at the barrel inletting. Some are an abomination employing round chisels , and scrapers, for octagon channels ,just to hog wood out for saving time. They still shot well , there is no mention in history that they didn't. I still marvel at how much time is saved using a modern stock duplicator. We got the brilliant idea to get a few original rifles , that had difficult to reproduce stock architecture , and that fit a normal size human , like the Roman nose Lehigh Valley stocks , and Upper Susquehanna school stocks. Fred knew a local KRA..Kentucky Rifle Assn. collector of original rifles. He graciously loaned us 12 fine original rifles to copy. That caused a rush of orders for Fred to fill. We could at last , easily reproduce many , hard to make stocks . ............Sorry , I went off into the weeds of history.........Oldwood

 

[DuncNZ]

Wood moving probably as important as barrel moving as it heats up when you live in a fairly stable environment , different if there is a lot of changes in humidity . Stock duplicating pantographs are great for making new stocks when one is broken , as the barrel can be bedded with car body putty and got perfect as can other things which need changing , then the stock can be put in the pantograph and perfectly copied .

 

[oldwood]

That's exactly how my buddie does it.

 

[The Appalachian]

Just some random thoughts after reading this whole thread......

~~ Two coats of Partall mold release wax and epoxy of any type will NOT stick to metal. I build synthetic stocks for bolt action rifles and use it in the mold, one can will last me a lifetime.

~~ Mechanical locks are a real hazzard when glass bedding. Using clay to fill holes and other "locks" has already been mentioned. What hasn't been mentioned is tapering your metal. The vertical flats on an octagon barrel can be tapered as little as .001" or .002" on the bottom side of the flat and it will never mechanically lock or be difficult to remove from the stock. Tapering a flat on a long ML barrel sounds intimidating, but in reality it's just dragging a draw file down each side of the barrel a few times, or even a sanding block. Color the top of the flat with a black sharpie so you can avoid removing any metal there. As long as the bottom of the vertical flats are a tiny bit narrower than the top it will not mechanically lock. You can gulde yourself along with a dial caliper measuring what you've removed. The other flats on the barrel can't in any way contribute to a problem, no need to do anything with them.

~~ heat will soften epoxy. Using heat to remove a stuck barrel risks compromising your bedding job. Freezing is a better option but know a stuck barrel is a job not done correctly from the start.

~~ Regular Acraglass can be made to any consistency you require by adding phenolic micro beads. Usually 4 parts of micro beads + 4 parts of glass + 1 part of hardener will produce the same consistency as Acraglass Gel but will cure quicker and harder than the Gel could ever hope to.

 

[Chris In SE PA]

Just some random thoughts after reading this whole thread......

~~ Two coats of Partall mold release wax and epoxy of any type will NOT stick to metal. I build synthetic stocks for bolt action rifles and use it in the mold, one can will last me a lifetime.

~~ Mechanical locks are a real hazzard when glass bedding. Using clay to fill holes and other "locks" has already been mentioned. What hasn't been mentioned is tapering your metal. The vertical flats on an octagon barrel can be tapered as little as .001" or .002" on the bottom side of the flat and it will never mechanically lock or be difficult to remove from the stock. Tapering a flat on a long ML barrel sounds intimidating, but in reality it's just dragging a draw file down each side of the barrel a few times, or even a sanding block. Color the top of the flat with a black sharpie so you can avoid removing any metal there. As long as the bottom of the vertical flats are a tiny bit narrower than the top it will not mechanically lock. You can gulde yourself along with a dial caliper measuring what you've removed. The other flats on the barrel can't in any way contribute to a problem, no need to do anything with them.

~~ heat will soften epoxy. Using heat to remove a stuck barrel risks compromising your bedding job. Freezing is a better option but know a stuck barrel is a job not done correctly from the start.

~~ Regular Acraglass can be made to any consistency you require by adding phenolic micro beads. Usually 4 parts of micro beads + 4 parts of glass + 1 part of hardener will produce the same consistency as Acraglass Gel but will cure quicker and harder than the Gel could ever hope to.

By volume or by weight on the microbeads?

 

[The Appalachian]

By volume or by weight on the microbeads?

By volume. The micro beads weigh about as much as air. Lol.

 

[tallPercshooter]

I put a 15/16 barrel in a Thompson Center 1 inch barrel channel. That leaves 1/32 on each side of barrel. Didn't want to spend the bucks for Acraglas so I bought a $7 JB Weld and used that. Thin black line on each side, I doubt most people would ever notice it. Worked perfectly, greased all metal well first. Tang and hammer lined up perfectly.