Colt Walker failure

[wdz]

I need some help and assistance on my Walker. I have a “Colt” 2nd generation Walker that I bought several years back and never fired.

The first thing I noticed was the nipples were too big for a standard #11 cap. I polished the nipples and fixed this issue and the caps now fit the nipples fine.

Today I went out to shoot and the caps were not firing reliably (1out of 6 fired). I did a visual inspection and noticed there was what I felt was too large a gap between the hammer at rest and the nipple. I backed the nipples out a turn or two and this solved the problem. Gun fired reliably for the next five full cylinders (30 shots). I did not do an accuracy check just a function firing.

Tonight after a thorough cleaning I reassembled and feel that the cylinder seems to have too much fore and aft movement. I know it needs some. I measured the cylinder gap with the barrel using a set of automotive feeler gauges. I can slide a .014 (.356mm) feeler gauge in the gap.

Does anyone know what this gap should be? How do I adjust this for a permanent fix? I considered adding thin washers under the nipples but if the gap is too big this isn’t the best solution.

Does anyone know of a very competent gunsmith for these revolvers? I briefly considered trying to contact Colt but figured that would be a waste of time and effort.

Thanks,

Dave Z

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

Backing the the nipples out to get ignition is a real bad idea. The culprit is that loose cylinder. Assuming no burrs and no junk in the bore for the cylinder arbor, the cylinder gap can be adjusted by tapping the wedge in or out a little bit at a time. You should also check the groove that the hammer rests in for burrs and other build up. The point where the barrel bolster and the lower front point of the frame meet should also be absolutely tight and both pins should be present. The problem with the caps may be caused by someone dry firing the gun with no caps on the nipples, thus peening them over. There are a lot of idiots out there.

 

[Blizzard of '93]

carefully press the caps down with the hammer while pointing down-range. this will help with ignition. I don't have one of those but I have to do that procedure with my ROA and '58 Rem.
good luck, Blizzard.

 

[Robert an saa fan]

Russ T. Frizzen and Blizzard of 93 gave very good advice.

As Russ T. mentioned the lower front of frame/barrel connection has to be tight. Have owned lots of 2nd Generation Colt cap & ball revolvers... many of them are hard to get the final few thousands of closure between lower front frame/barrel due to tolerances that are very tight.

Also, as Russ T. mentioned; cap fragments in the hammer slot can prevent full hammer fall... these fragments can sometimes be hard to see.

The hammer nose can be dented in by use and dry firing... could be part of the problem.

Your barrel/cylinder gap should be less than .014 in a perfect world. Too tight and black powder fouling will tie up the cylinder too soon.

Be sure to have the nipples tight, loosened nipples could be very dangerous. Do not use spacer washers on nipples.

Hope this helps. Let us know if you get things working or have other questions.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

I know that this sounds crazy, but here goes: There may be a slight chance that the wrong nipples for your gun were installed at the factory from the get-go! This would explain you having to back them out to get reliable ignition in the first place, before any spent caps got a chance to come into contact with the underside of the hammer and get stuck there.

Perhaps replacing the nipples would solve most of your problem. It's certainly worth a try before paying the money for a 'smith to look into it!

Good luck with that thing!

Dave

 

[mykeal]

I have a Uberti 2nd Model Dragoon that had a similar problem when new. I put a wood block on the muzzle and used a hammer to tap the barrel assembly onto the base pin until the frame/bolster intersection was tight. The cylinder end play and hammer/cap gap issues were solved. This was necessary for several assembly/disassembly cycles, but it gradually got better. It still takes a pretty good shove to get the barrel assembly into place but I no longer need the hammer.

 

[W T]

What Mykeal said. :bow:

The Colt open-top architecture depends on the proper positioning of the barrel assembly to the frame. Holding the two halves of the pistol in proper alignment is key.

The red flag is your cylinder gap and end-play. There are a variety of factors that can cause it to be out of whack.

I had a 60 Army with all of the following flaws:

- the arbor was not bottoming securely in its hole - the fix was to shim the end of the arbor. This is a problem with a lot of Italian reproduction pistols. It sounds like Mykeal's just needed a bit of tapping to move the end of the arbor to the bottom of the hole;

- the slot in the arbor that receives the wedge had been cut slightly out of the proper position (too far forward), and needed to be welded a bit and re-cut for the wedge to do its job;

- the wedge itself was hammered and deformed.

As another reply suggest, yours may just need the wedge to be tapped-in a bit to cure the gap. Gap problem being fixed, the cylinder end-play may be fixed.

A revolver that breaks down into two major pieces will have alignment problems (or develop them over time), and that can cause excessive end-play and inconsistent ignition because the hammer can't quite reach the cap and nipple. Often a new wedge will tighten things up. In my case, the whole platform was out of spec from the factory.

That said, the C&B OTs are a lot of fun, but do need a little tightening from time-to-time. Enjoy!

 

[TFoley]

I need some help and assistance on my Walker. I have a “Colt” 2nd generation Walker that I bought several years back and never fired.

The first thing I noticed was the nipples were too big for a standard #11 cap.

Dear Mr Z - the second generation Colt Walkers did not come with #11 nipples, but the larger and longer #26, to take the Joyce caps.

Having a source of this older, larger design cap, that has a mighty flame compared with a modern #11, I shoot nothing else on my Walker, #1816.

Mine also bent the wedge on the third cylinder load, necessitating some very careful work with a Dremel to release it without damaging the frame.

Needless to say, Colt in Brooklyn never bothered to respond to my TWELVE written requests and endless e-mails for a replacement wedge, even though I made it clear from the very beginning that I would pay for it. BTW, the wedges are serial numbered to match the gun...

Thankfully, both Hege, here in Europe, and Dixie Gun Works in TN responded in a couple of days, and since then it has been faultless with 45gr of 3Fg and a round ball.

Good luck with yours!

tac in yUK

 

[Bubba45]

Years ago a friend of mine had a similar problem on his Walker repro and to reduce endshake he had a machinest buddy turn a shim washer of stainless steel to place in front of cylinder on base pin.Cured the problem and he uses this as his Only hand gun.

 

[mykeal]

Years ago a friend of mine had a similar problem on his Walker repro and to reduce endshake he had a machinest buddy turn a shim washer of stainless steel to place in front of cylinder on base pin.Cured the problem and he uses this as his Only hand gun.

If I understand correctly he must have ended up with a significant cylinder to forcing cone gap. Adding a bushing in front of the cylinder will certainly take up the end play, but at the expense of losing a significant amount of pressure and thus muzzle velocity. It seems like that's treating the symptom instead of the disease. Again, if I understand correctly what he did.

 

[wdz]

Thanks for all the suggestions.

I had never heard of the Joyce caps and after looking can't find a source so I ordered a replacement set of nipples fron Dixie, we'll see how they work out.