Cap And Ball Revolvers For Personal Protection?

:sorry: ff:

But I still abided by what I stated earlier on. Those who would choose C&B revolvers are going to be better instinctive shooters than those with more modern firearms. Simply due to the nature of the beasts. They must be regularly fired and cleaned, therefore the owners will be better practiced than those with cartridge guns.

Just :m2c:

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

:sorry: ff:

But I still abided by what I stated earlier on. Those who would choose C&B revolvers are going to be better instinctive shooters than those with more modern firearms. Simply due to the nature of the beasts. They must be regularly fired and cleaned, therefore the owners will be better practiced than those with cartridge guns.

Just :m2c:

I don't think you're as "off topic" as you think you are. The winner in a gun battle is usually the one who can think quickly, move instinctively, and shoot faster--like it was second-nature. The procedures involved with the C&B revolvers require the owner/shooter to feel like their gun(s) are "an extension" of themselves.

Mostly, the sights just get in the way during a gun battle. The gun that points the best is usually the better choice for survival. Not necessarily the biggest gun or the loudest blast, or the biggest flash, or the most smoke. Still, you do need a big enough gun to do the job of stopping the bad guy, if he happens to get "subtracted from the population" in the process, it is his own fault for choosing the wrong place and time and the wrong person (and gun) to mess with.

This whole scenario is hypothetical, but yet we have examples from members who use and depend on the C&B guns for self-defense purposes. Would anyone in their right mind care to go up against one of these persons in a friendly shooting match on targets at 25ft? Better think about it before you automatically assume that the person with the more modern, self-loading auto pistol finds out just how fast (and well) a C&B gun can be used.

ALWAYS use a BIG enough gun, or use TWO smaller ones if you can't find a big one!.

Remember to Shoot Safely!
WV_Hillbilly

 

[Zonie]

In my lifetime, I have personally only known of two cases where
a firearm was used to stop/prevent a crime.
In both cases, the gun was not fired, and just the knowledge of it's presence stopped the aggression.

Although only a Colt .22 Woodsman was used, I'm sure a .36 or .44 caliber Cap & Ball revolver would have done as nicely. Come to think about it, it would have done More than nicely. ::

 

[Old40Rod]

It's your life, so I'm not slamming you........but if you feel the need for personal protection then why on earth would you do away with your centerfire handguns? If my family needs defending I'm not going to chance it with an inferior weapon.

Amen to that. Too many things have to happen correctly for a BP firearm to go "bang" that may not when you need it. Ask anyone who had hunted BP. Powder or caps take on moisture from humidity, caps fall off, etc. At least get a old military musket and stick a bayonet on the end, that might be useful.

::

 

[CrackStock]

<<<Would anyone in their right mind care to go up against one of these persons in a friendly shooting match on targets at 25ft?>>>

Yup. Believe it or not, some people also shoot these modern contraptions in spite of having a greater interest in their traditionally styled guns. I make my living with one to spend it enjoying the other. Wanna guess which is which?

As to firing a shot in time of need. I learned some things:

1. There are times when bluff is irrelevant and you need the shot to take out the opposition or you will be injured.

2. I have seen a lot of bad guys carrying small caliber lead and only one with .45 ACP in him. Bigger is better.

3. More bullets are better -- even if you do not need them at the moment.

4. My cartridge guns go bang when needed, while my cap and ball is not reliable enough for me to risk my life on. (Also, if there was something so compelling that I risked my life for it, I would want it to be accomplished.)

5. Bluff with a revolver? I can see into your cylinder (as is true with all revolvers) which gives me a pretty good idea whether or not you are bluffing.

6. Which type is faster? You can make steel ring in under a second with a revolver or auto with no sights at all. It just happens when you will it to be so but only if you have developed the ability to do it. This ability is not dependent upon the frame of the gun. It is developed by the mind and body through training and practice. Frank DiNuzzo was the best instinct instructor that I learned from.

I think that we are just locking into a controversial battle of wills over this though. I also see that I am almost off topic here and arguing against the guns that I enjoy.

Kind of souring for me.

CS

 

When you have to point a gun at an intruder, bluffing has no place in the situation. If there's an incident that I have to point my gun at another living being, you can rest assured that that person is not long for this plane of existence.

Just :m2c:

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

<<<Would anyone in their right mind care to go up against one of these persons in a friendly shooting match on targets at 25ft?>>>

-----------------------------------------------------------
5. Bluff with a revolver? I can see into your cylinder (as is true with all revolvers) which gives me a pretty good idea whether or not you are bluffing.

-----------------------------------------------------------
6. Which type is faster?

-----------------------------------------------------------

While I agree that bigger is better and quantity and quality are both considerations... I would like to make a comment about the "bluffing"

IF, God forbid, I should ever (and I hope I NEVER have to), have to pull/draw down on someone, the lead will be flying much too fast from my "shooter", for someone to try and take a peak into the face of my cylinder (or muzzle).

I don't know how the rest of you were taught, or maybe you didn't have to take classes, or you get your CCW or whatever a different way... to pull a gun and just hold it on someone is assault with a deadly weapon--and YOU can be the one arrested for that. There is no Marquis of Queesberry rules or etiquette involved here, you don't "shoot to kill", you "shoot to live" (to save your life, NOT the attacker's).

I always understood that if I pull a gun, I better use it ASAP, and if I use it, I'm not going to be bluffing or just holding it on someone hopeing that they'll chicken out.

It is most definitely NOT "a game of chicken" with firearms. There are no TV shows, video games, or "live fire IDPA-? pistol games" that are going to give you what you need, IF you have to use a gun for self-defense.

I think we've probably about used up our host's graciousness on this subject. I had gotten the impression that the whole topic was just a hypothetical question anyway. Even if it was meant to garner actual situational responses or comments, this is a VERY serious subject.

I don't make my living with firearms, and I don't want anyone else to "make my dying" with their firearms. I do enjoy target shooting (even with those "toy" foam dart and softair guns--just about anything that shoots is intersting to me), and (as my health permits) I find hunting to be a very nice recreational pastime also. Beyond that, "most" of what any of us have to say is subjective and possibly conjecture. Y'all take care of yourselves, ya hear?

WV_Hillbilly

 

[Pork Chop]

Claypipe,

Right on. One of the things that I learned is that you do NOT pull a gun on anyone or anything you don't intend to shoot. When you shoot, you do NOT shoot to wound. Even if the target goes down, it may not be rendered inert.

If I get put in a position to pull a gun on an intruder, you can rest assured that I will do everything that I can to make sure that they get a very bad case (hopefully terminal) of high speed lead poisoning. For home defense, I also agree with the belief that bigger is better. .45 ACP is a good size. If it can stop doped up Morro warriors, then surely it can put down a thug looking to cause mayhem in my home. I believe that the 7 rounds should be sufficient, but a spare clip is also available for the using should I need to sharpen my marksmanship skills on the fly.

 

[gordy]

I know the subject has played itself out,but wether it's a Glock or a Colt C&B revolver,It is of no use unless You "Know" that Your willing to use it when, and if, the time ever comes.As was said,every year several crimes are stopped just because the home/bussiness owner demonstrated to the intruder that they had the means to take the intruder out.(ie;the presentation of the bussiness end of a deadly weapon to the intruder).Anyone who may have to defend person or property with a deadly weapon, should become profieceint with it wether it be modern, or antique. :imo: :front:

 

[Yagee]

Hi MB
I like all types of firearms, both old and new. If I had to defend my family or myself from harm, I would be using a 12 ga. pump backed up with a 1911 .45 acp.
If I had to get my family or myself to a hospital I would be calling an ambulance or using a car. I certainly would not be hitching up the old horse and wagon.
:m2c:

Yagee

 

[rmark]

I suspect there is a temptation to 'overgun'. I prefer double action .38 special/.380 auto calibers for less recoil and smaller size for more convenient carry. My likely danger is a burglar mistakenly trying to enter the house while I'm at home, not an intentional home invasion as such. Any confrontation would be at very close range, making even a short barrelled shotgun or rifle impractical. A 'gunfight' as such is unlikely. A .36 Cap&Ball is about as powerful as the old .38 S&W (not Special) and is about as low as I would go. A .44 might equal an old .44 S&W loading. If I was a blackpowder only shooter, I would opt for a high quality .44 1860 Colt or 1858 Remington copy. The walkers and dragoons add too much weight.

 

[rmark]

I do know of one case where a Cap & Ball was used - A friend was in a back bedroom when his wife ran back telling him a man had walked into the house. Having the cap & ball handy, he ran to the front room where this unknown fella had sat down and was drinking a soda that was on the coffee table. My friend pointed the gun at the intruders head, cocked it, and watched as the soda ran down the front of the intruders shirt. Turns out he was drunk and had walked into the wrong home, earning a free trip to jail.

 

[m-g willy]

Cap and ball revolver for home defence?

Why heck yeah!!!
The best weapon for home defence is two 1860 colt 44's
Just make sure you keep it dry
And the best position to fire a 1860 from is -----------------
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from the back of a chargeing horse!!!!
Stay away from the Walkers .
They have the habit of dropping the loading lever upon firing locking the gun up!


Best bet is a N frame S&W
They point as well as the 1860 anyway.
(Just my opinion)--Willy

 

[Mulebrain]

from the back of a chargeing horse

Dont know about horses in the house ::

I have read all the responses, and I beleive a pair of 1860 .44's will do nicely!!

 

If I get put in a position to pull a gun on an intruder, you can rest assured that I will do everything that I can to make sure that they get a very bad case (hopefully terminal) of high speed lead poisoning. For home defense, I also agree with the belief that bigger is better. .45 ACP is a good size. If it can stop doped up Morro warriors, then surely it can put down a thug looking to cause mayhem in my home. I believe that the 7 rounds should be sufficient, but a spare clip is also available for the using should I need to sharpen my marksmanship skills on the fly.

There's an old shootist saying that comes to mind, "They ain't dead till there's one in the head." Cold hearted I know, but you don't have to look over your shoulder the rest of your life.

As for Morro warriors, it was actually the .45 Long Colt, not the .45 ACP, that was pressed into service to deal with the Morro warriors. But, before the .45 LC made it to the troops, many armed themselves with Starr C&B revolvers from Bannerman's and other such arms merchants. And these C&B revolvers were used with much success in a hot humid environment, as opposed to the issued .38 Long Colt.

And why were these warriors impervious to the .38 LC? Because they were hopped up on homebrewed opium based drugs. Today we have to deal with addicts hopped up on crack and angeldust, whom are often uneffected by 9mm parabellum, hence the adaption by many police departments to .40 semi-automatics.

One period medical report I read described the wounds of a captured Morro warrior. He received six shots within the FBI kill zone, and would have decapitate the officer had it not been for soldiers that rifle butted the warrior to the ground. Even with such greivious wounds and a cracked skull to boot, the warrior survived another 24 hours before subcumming to his wounds and died.

Scary Ain't it?!

 

from the back of a chargeing horse

Dont know about horses in the house ::

It better be house broken!

Just :m2c:

 

[jim gray]

When you have to point a gun at an intruder, bluffing has no place in the situation. If there's an incident that I have to point my gun at another living being, you can rest assured that that person is not long for this plane of existence.

:agree:

Once your are face to face with an intruder you have to assume that he is armed and willing to kill you.

But I believe that the sound of a pump shotgun chambering a round has caused more than one intruder to reassess his options and make a hasty withdrawal from the premises. If you can convince a criminal to back down without a confrontation so much the better.

I really hate to beat a dead horse here, but there are a lot of security options that can be used to augment the home-defence firearm, and if you can prevent the intrusion in the first place with stronger locks, an alarm, or a myriad of other common sense precautions then the situation were you'll need that gun will not likely occur. In my opinion that is the best case scenario.

 

[Pork Chop]

I realized after I posted that it was not the ACP that was pressed into service against the Morros. Still, it is a good weapon of choice.

I have read reports of civilians getting into trouble after the autopsy was performed. One case comes to mind in that the homeowner had a 6 shot revolver, yet the intruder had 7 entrance wounds. The homeowner almost got into deep Kim Che due to the reloading. Another was a case of a woman that shot an intruder that turned out to be a serial rapist. He was shot in the knee and his knee cap was shattered. That SOB sued for his injuries and WON! She should have emptied the gun on him.

My personal opinion is that once a criminal sets into motion their criminal intent, they are making a conscious decision to waive their civil rights. Unfortunately, the American Justice system does not see it that way. Criminals get more "justice" than victims do.

 

[benvenuto]

I agree...
I remembered wyatt earps comments just then, that the most important aspect of a successful "shootist" is cold, carefull deliberation.

And to add to what someone said earlier, if you aren't carrying that pistol, lock it the hell up. most burglars will go straight for the nightstand or under the bed on entry looking for cash, jewellery, or that valuable gun. if the gun isn't in the safe or in your holster odds are you will be looking down the barrel of your own weapon sooner or later.

 

But I believe that the sound of a pump shotgun chambering a round has caused more than one intruder to reassess his options and make a hasty withdrawal from the premises. If you can convince a criminal to back down without a confrontation so much the better.

The problem with using a shotgun is that many houses built today are what I label 10 year houses. They are built with materials that won't last longer than 10 years. In such a house I would use bird shot, not buckshot or plated shot (BB). The latter would easily penetrate an interior wall and harm a loved one.

I really hate to beat a dead horse here, but there are a lot of security options that can be used to augment the home-defence firearm, and if you can prevent the intrusion in the first place with stronger locks, an alarm, or a myriad of other common sense precautions then the situation were you'll need that gun will not likely occur. In my opinion that is the best case scenario.

Stupid things happen, people make mistakes, and criminals play on this. My 9th grade science teacher was also a locksmith. He taught me how to open any padlock in less than 5 seconds using an electric drill. Locks, like gun laws, keep honest people honest, criminals could care less. If a criminal wants to enter your home, and he has half a brain, he will. There was a pilot cable tv show, I saw a while back, where two guys would break into people's homes to show just how vunerable they were. There are such things as professional/career thieves who make a science out of burgulary.

Just :m2c: