Cannon in Reenactments

[firefoot]

Greetings

I.m trying to put a "Rules of Engagement" together. This is a list of safety rules for reenactors in battle situations. Rules like what is the minimum distance you can safely be at when firing, Bayonet charges, etc.

What I would like to know is what is the minimum distance that an infantry group can approach a cannon that is firing. Also what signals do artillery groups use to warn away infantry from loaded gun and what signal means safe to approach?

Thanks jim c.

 

[BigDeutscher]

for years we always placed the ram on the muzzle to let appoaching men know it was hot
funny to watch a guy with a video camera get out in front, but off to the side and on one knee when we fired... most of the time, they just fall over and grab their ears. Not a good idea to be anywhere out in front, within... say...20 yards?
Deutsch

 

Well the first thing you need to do is start familiarizing yourself with Massachusetts Public Safety codes concerning mortars and cannons.

Unofficial Copy of Mass. Regs.:
http://www.mass.gov/Eeops/docs/dfs/osfm/cmr/cmr_secured/527022.pdf

In order for a cannon to be discharged in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, there must be at least one member of the crew certified as a cannoneer / mortar man. To get that certification, one must submit an application signed by an individual who has already held such certification five years or more.

Application for certification:
http://www.mass.gov/Eeops/docs/dfs/osfm/forms/fp82.pdf

Then you are allowed to take the test to obtain said certification. Once you have certification in hand, your tube is either xrayed or magnafluxed, you must then submit an application, 15 days in advance, to discharge it.

Form for discharging mortar or cannon:
http://www.mass.gov/Eeops/docs/dfs/osfm/forms/fp27c.pdf

I would also suggest looking for the National Parks System regs and those of the North-South Skirmism Association.

 

for years we always placed the ram on the muzzle to let appoaching men know it was hot
funny to watch a guy with a video camera get out in front, but off to the side and on one knee when we fired... most of the time, they just fall over and grab their ears. Not a good idea to be anywhere out in front, within... say...20 yards?
Deutsch

NO ONE SHOULD BE IN A 180 DEGREEs TO THE FRONT OF THE MUZZLE!

L, a building is not even suppose to be with in a hundred feet of the muzzle!

If they want such a film shot, invest in a tripod and weight down the legs.

The tube crews should be watching for this foolishness and discourage it! This is the sort of thing that will get our hobby regulated out the whazoo.

Some fool will get blinded and/or lose their hearing, crying "I didn't know" in some courtroom charging some member of our hobby with criminal negligence.

Bad enough we have to deal with idjits calling water pipes "homemade cannons."

 

[bangfxr]

I've been reenacting infantry sence 1985 and we have charged firing guns up to 50 yards with ear plugs in. The gun crews will have the rammers crossed against the tube. This lets us know that the gun is hot. Another thing we have done is use chalk powder for a safety line. if the gun's cold the rammers will be under the gun. The differant units I've been with will coragraph the charge in the morning during Co, and Bn, drills several times on how far we go when the guns hot and when we take the gun its cold. We go by the 4 S's Safety, Safety, Safety, Safety.

 

[Reb_Cav2]

Jim,
I am not a long term re-enactor by any means but I was a gun crew "Chief of Piece" the guy that was in charge of the safety of the gun and its crew, and I still help with the cannons I just wanted to run around so I joined a dismounted Cavalry squad. So I had to know the rules fairly well and here is what we do in my club in Oregon.

"At no time will any object be fired from a cannon if that object of material will pass over the 75-foot safety boundary, and thus endanger the participants and/or spectators during any NCWC event."

" Cannon will not fire when troops are in front on the blast cone and are closer than 75 feet."

Then to indicate a loaded cannon we hold the implements on the wheel for Howitzers and on the Hub for larger cannon so they are high in the air and visible to the troops.

Hope this helps and if you want more specifics please "PT" me and I will get you a copy of the entire rules as pertains to cannon where I live.

Respectfully
Reb_Cav

 

I've been reenacting infantry sence 1985 and we have charged firing guns up to 50 yards with ear plugs in. The gun crews will have the rammers crossed against the tube. This lets us know that the gun is hot. Another thing we have done is use chalk powder for a safety line. if the gun's cold the rammers will be under the gun. The differant units I've been with will coragraph the charge in the morning during Co, and Bn, drills several times on how far we go when the guns hot and when we take the gun its cold. We go by the 4 S's Safety, Safety, Safety, Safety.

Ear plugs are fine for small arms discharges. But, if an individual is too close to a field piece when it is being discharged, they may find themselves in need of forceps to remove those ear plugs. Ear plugs are fine for the suppression of high decibel sound waves. They are ill suited for the shock waves from the concussion of artillery fire.

And if those units have your safety in mind, the muzzles of those tubes will be elevated so that you are not directly in front of them at the time of firing. All it takes is one unsupervised child throwing peebles in a loaded tube for a deadly disaster to occur. Hence, why muzzles should be plugged with a tampion when empty and guarded when loaded.

CP

 

[Pigman]

It doesn’t have to be kids.

Back in 94 I was at a CW reenactment on land next to Fort Knox. The event had Officer cadets as referees and the Army brought out lots of spectators.

I was posted about 50 feet from a battery of mountain howitzers when an artillery instructor brought a group of students out to see the event. He was lecturing the students on 19th century artillery. He had his students move in front of the battery to get an idea of what an artillery emplacement looked like. The artillery crew tried to stop him because the guns were loaded but he was very loud that he was an instructor in the artillery and knew what he was doing. It was at that time he pulled a lanyard with his students about 20 feet in front of the piece. If I recall right 4 of the students were taken away in ambulances. I can still clearly see him saying “it was only a blank” while they loaded one young man into an ambulance.

Foster From Flint

 

[Vairochana]

Just on that note,
I did medieval reenactment a long time ago.
In Australia we are generally unfamiliar with cannon being used for reenactment, as a result a smallish medieval piece was being fired in an arena event.
I was a good few hundred meters away in an encampment, having noting to do with this and not aware it was pointed in my direction.
I heard something fly between the guy I was talking to, bounce off a display in front of us and drop on my gear chest.
It turned out to be part of a bolt head, warm and rusting as I held it.
It must have got into the blank load they were using.
Luckily no member of the public was closer.
Unfortunately the arrogant idiots didn't understand why I was so angry at them. :cursing:

 

Just on that note,
I did medieval reenactment a long time ago.
In Australia we are generally unfamiliar with cannon being used for reenactment, as a result a smallish medieval piece was being fired in an arena event.
I was a good few hundred meters away in an encampment, having noting to do with this and not aware it was pointed in my direction.
I heard something fly between the guy I was talking to, bounce off a display in front of us and drop on my gear chest.
It turned out to be part of a bolt head, warm and rusting as I held it.
It must have got into the blank load they were using.
Luckily no member of the public was closer.
Unfortunately the arrogant idiots didn't understand why I was so angry at them. :cursing:

That's a disturbing thing to hear. But, exactly what may happen if a tube is left unattended. All it takes is a moment of inattention for things such as that to occur. The crew were probably dumbfounded, as it was just such a moment when either a small child or a large ignorant oaf probably slip the projectile into the bore.

One other way for a projectile to enter the tube, is the ill advised practice of topping off a blank load with grass pulled from the ground. Who knows what debris this practice may introduce to the charge. The roots of the grass may ensnare all sorts of possible projectiles.

Almost every cannon I have inspected in state or national parks or on town commons have had their bores polluted with trash. Empty beverage cans, chip bags, candy wrappers, sticks and stones reside in these silent warriors.

And don't under estimate the power of "a smallish medieval piece." I think it was back in 2005, we were doing demos at a small renfaire in New Hampshire. Our largest piece, the Beast, was a handgonne with an inch and three quarter chambered bore and an overall tube length of 18 inches including the socket. When it roared, it set off the vendors car alarms, about a quarter of a mile down from us. The vendors hated us, as they had to collect their car keys and send a lad down to silence all the alarms. A resident from off a hill, a good mile from us, came down to ask us to point the muzzle elsewhere, as the report was rattling his windows and upsetting his pregnant wife. The boom of the gonne would echo back and forth in the valley where we were. Sounding much like rolling thunder, I loved the acoustics of that site.

Imagine what could happen if safety was not first and foremost in our minds.
CP

 

[KABAR2]

Greetings

I.m trying to put a "Rules of Engagement" together. This is a list of safety rules for reenactors in battle situations. Rules like what is the minimum distance you can safely be at when firing, Bayonet charges, etc.


Thanks jim c.

You will find most organizations do not allow fixed bayonets during a tactcal demonstration,this is for both safety and insurance reasons,