accident

[chuck-ia]

I read in the paper a couple weeks ago, a guy was hunting late season shotgun, was carrying a 44 cap and ball revolver, got back to his vehicle and was evidently putting the revolver in the car when it went off hitting him in the chest and killing him on the spot. I don't know the facts, but am guessing he was carrying it with 6 loaded chambers. It was cold that day and he was probably in a hurry to get in the car allso. Really doesn't make much difference that is was a cap and ball revolver, got to be careful. flinch

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Tragic! Sorry to hear of this! Can you provide any details such as a link to the story??

Dave

 

[Dphar]

This is horribly sad. Its a disaster for his family. I can only hope they recover from this and are able to lead fairly normal lives in years to come.

Many of the better repros have pins and notches to hold the hammer between cylinders. This is deceptive. Perhaps frightening is a better word.

I found, in using perc revolvers exclusively as carry guns for a few years, that these "safety devices" will not hold and far too often the hammer will be on the cap after being carried for awhile unless the cylinder is held pretty securely by a holster. But, even though I was well versed in the "only carry 5 loaded" rule, I tried the pins and found them a dangerous feature.
The only revolver I found that was safe with 6 loaded was the full fluted Colt 60 Army which was secure with all six loaded.

There are other concerns with percussion firearms.
If the percussion cap is properly made this is not as much of a problem.
BUT. As a further caution to percussion arm users.
Percussion caps once pressed on the nipple can leave traces of detonating compound on the nipple. This can and has caused ADs in the past.
Traces of compound on the nipple can fire the gun if the hammer is simply rubbed on the nipple by the gun being moved. Accidents of this type are sometimes attributed to static. But static will not ignite BP. The most recent I heard of was of a man beind shot in the arm by a rifle musket he had been hunting with but had uncapped when he placed it in the vehicle. Later as he pulled the uncapped rifle from the car by the muzzle it discharged and struck him in the arm. As a result I never bother removing a cap, which if they fit tight is a hazard in its own right.


Dan

 

[CaptainKirk]

Truly sad. Was this a Remington-style with notches, or a Colt type without? Six in the can, or five? And the most intriguing...if he was hunting late season shotgun what was he doing carrying a loaded C&B? (Illegal in my state, anyway)
I truly hate to hear of this sort of thing happening. It must be very hard for family and friends this time of year...
And Dan, thank you for the insight on the residue left on the nipples...I've never heard that mentioned before. Point taken.

 

[chuck-ia]

Pretty sure it is legal here in Iowa to carry a handgun in shotgun season. Not sure which paper had the article in it, either the Fort Dodge or Des Moines paper about 2 weeks ago, maybe less than 2 weeks. It happened around Sheldon Ia. The article I read was short and to the point. The man was 60 years old I believe. Probably not real familar with the gun. flinch

 

[CoyoteJoe]

Most accidents happen when getting into or out of a vehicle whether with BP or modern firearms.
My dad very nearly shot me as he was pulling his capped 12 gauge out of the back seat of the car while I was reaching for my own gun from the other side. Now in hindsight I really couldn't blame him if he had shot me on purpose, it sure would have saved him a lot of bother. :haha:

 

[CaptainKirk]

:rotf:

 

[slumlord44]

Putting a capped gun in a car is an accident looking for a place to happen and illegal. When people get killed doing something like that I call it death by stupidity.

 

[David Teague]

I've had one AD in the field while hunting.

The muzzle was pointed in a safe direction but it still shocked the cr@p out of me. I had stopped to take a bathroom break, leaned my 1853 Enfield against a smaller tree that had a nice U shape to secure my firearm while I took care of "nature's call" and when I grabbed the forestock and lifted straight up the weapon went Boom! :shocked2: :surrender: That's when I notice the small stub of a broken branch that hooked my hammer and let it go before the half cock notch caught it.

I've always uncapped when climbing over fences, getting in or out of cars or trucks but it wasn't til then that I added bathroom breaks to the list. :idunno:

Safe hunting my friends.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

I had a strange one many years ago that I still haven't figured out. I'd been duck hunting with an old Belgian double 12 cap gun. It had been a very warm day so my jacket was unzipped. When the sun set the temp dropped sharply, as is normal for Colorado, so I held my gun in the crook of my left arm as I zipped my jacket and suddenly BLAM.
Both hammers were still at half-cock and that gun never blew the hammer back to half-cock when fired so I can only conclude the hammer never fell. :idunno:

 

[mingo]

As much as we all love the old cappers, it was a design that lasted a relatively short time.
I own several, but am very wary of handling them.
I am nervous every time I cap a revolver.

Big mistake the guy made was putting himself in front of the piece while handling it.

RIP

 

[Blizzard of '93]

was the cap 'busted' ie 'fired'?? strange occurence for sure.
the ops thread may be due to a dropped revolver. or one that was slung into an obstruction of the hammer that smacked it onto the cap if the hammer was resting on the cap. not uncommon.
no safety measures are extravagant when it comes to firearms specially bp guns.

 

[token tory]

I'm missing something here :youcrazy: I love my 2 cappers as they are 1,000% safer than most other ways of firmly seating a cap IMHO.
I don't know how I'd use one except from behind the muzzle. :idunno:

 

[1911nutjob]

Putting a capped gun in a car is an accident looking for a place to happen and illegal. When people get killed doing something like that I call it death by stupidity.

Accident waiting to happen? Possibly, depends on the handler. Illegal? Only in IL or WI around these parts, and soon to be only IL.

 

[David Teague]

I'm missing something here :youcrazy: I love my 2 cappers as they are 1,000% safer than most other ways of firmly seating a cap IMHO.
I don't know how I'd use one except from behind the muzzle. :idunno:

Yes, when Forager called his percussion firearms "cappers" it confused the issue. He was taking about how unsafe a capped, hammer down on the capped nipple, percussion firearm can be compared to other types of firearms... if I understood his post the way he meant it to be read.:hmm:

Cheers,

David

 

[trent/OH]

Tragic! Sorry to hear of this! Can you provide any details such as a link to the story??

Dave

I searched for the victim's name, but information is pretty limited. In a nutshell, Jeffrey Marienau, age 60, of Sheldon Iowa was hit in the chest when his 44 caliber black powder revolver discharged as he was putting it away (presumably in a vehicle) about 10 A.M. on December 13th. He was dead at the scene.
No other information regarding the weapon or how it was loaded or carried was given.

 

[F_Thomas]

My thoughts and prayers go out to Mr. Marienau's family. Certainly a tragic accident.

I'm relatively new to BP and C&B revolvers and I know from what little experience I have that one has to be extremely careful. I would never carry a pistol on a loaded chamber, but with that said how can one make sure that the cylinder does not rotate, say on a Uberti Walker, thus negating one's attempt at being extra safe? All firearms must be treated as if always loaded.

 

[Zonie]

If only 5 chambers are loaded the hammer can rest on the unloaded chambers uncapped nipple and the cylinder cannot turn.

The better reproduction Colts also have a small pin located on the rear of the cylinder between each nipple.

These pins are safety devices meant to have the hammer face lowered down on one of them.
The pin fits into the slot on the face of the hammer and prevents the cylinder from rotating.

Of course, if the hammer is raised slightly it will disengage from the pin allowing the cylinder to rotate.

Remington cut big notches into the rear of their cylinder for the nose of the hammer.
With the hammer nose in one of these notches the cylinder cannot rotate.

As with the Colt, if the hammer is raised, disengaging the nose from the cylinder notch the cylinder can rotate.

The safest way is to just load 5 chambers and rest the hammer on the unloaded chambers uncapped nipple.
My reading indicates this was fairly common with civilian revolver owners back in the day.

 

[rawhide]

also illegal in WA. OR. and I think ID.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

was the cap 'busted' ie 'fired'?? strange occurence for sure.
the ops thread may be due to a dropped revolver. or one that was slung into an obstruction of the hammer that smacked it onto the cap if the hammer was resting on the cap. not uncommon.
no safety measures are extravagant when it comes to firearms specially bp guns.

The cap was just "gone" so no clues there.