A Quick builder's question...

[Sinner]

Hey, Is there a particular reason why lock screws are left proud (no recessed)? Curious because I'm getting ready to work on a percussion.

 

[Col. Batguano]

You're talking about those that protrude through the lock plate, behind the cock, right? I have the same question. Thank you for posting the topic.

It sort of seems "messy" and out of sorts to get everything else so tight and tidy, and leave those so obviously proud, giving it a rushed or incomplete look, rather than filing them flush and polished looking. On a rather plain gun I would sort of understand the rush, but even on finely engraved lock plates they're left that way.

The same thing goes for big bulbous nail heads on inletted metal inserts, like cheek pieces. It wouldn't be that hard to chamfer in a hole, pound everything in there to fill the chamfer, and then file the heads flush, like we do with our muzzle cap rivets.

 

[Sinner]

yup, that's it. I don't understand why they are left like that.

 

[Sidney Smith]

Probably for decorative value. Whenever I brown a lock I always leave the screws on the white. Gives the l9ck a unique look IMO.

 

[Zonie]

yup, that's it. I don't understand why they are left like that.

Most likely because whoever built the lock just put the parts together and didn't take the time to finish filing them to the right length.

All of the parts have an allowed deviation from the nominal dimension specified on the drawing and the shortest lock screws length will be long enough to accommodate a assembly with the thickest parts mounted on the thinnest lock plate.
This will always result in the screws being "too long".

With no time to "custom fit" the screws by filing them to the right length, the customer gets a lock with the screw sticking out.

If your thinking of taking the time to put a finish on the lock, take the time to file off any of the screws that are sticking out of the lock plate.

Not only will the lock look better but you will know that you made it look right.

 

[Sinner]

Thank you Zonie, but I'm talking about the head of the screw on the opposite side of the stock. I see this on factory guns and "custom" guns alike.
I misunderstood Col. Batguano's comment.

 

[Sinner]

yup, that's it. I don't understand why they are left like that.

Wait a minute, I misunderstood, not the thread end showing past the lock; the head not being recessed on the opposite side of the stock.

 

[Sidney Smith]

I misunderstood his post as well. I thought he was referring also to the threaded ends sticking out behing the cock.

I've seen a lot of guns with the lock screw heads not flush with the stock. I think it was just how the guns were built and maybe for ease of disassembly.

 

[Eric Krewson]

All the lock bolts I have bought have flat bases instead of counter sunk ones, this puts them on the surface instead of countersunk down a bit.

 

[Sidney Smith]

I countersink the side plate hole about half the thickness of the plate. It's easy to do with a squared drill bit.

 

[Sinner]

All the lock bolts I have bought have flat bases instead of counter sunk ones, this puts them on the surface instead of countersunk down a bit.

They do have flat bases, but it would still be easy to countersink them.
I'm just trying to figure out if there is some real reason for not countersinking them.

 

[Sinner]

I countersink the side plate hole about half the thickness of the plate. It's easy to do with a squared drill bit.

There are many rifles without side plates, too.
I'm really trying to figure out if there is some historical reason other than they didn't think about it...

 

[Zonie]

IMO, having a sideplate inlayed into the wood on the side opposite the lock adds a great deal of strength to the stock at its weakest point.

With the mortise for the lock removing all of the wood on one side of the stock, there isn't a whole lot of wood holding the front and rear of the stock together. Just the wood below the barrel channel and the wood where the side plate would be.

If the side plate is just sitting on the surface of its panel it adds some strength but not much. Just the faying friction between the underside of the plate being squeezed by the lock bolts.
If it is actually inlayed into the wood, its outer edge actually locks into its mortise so if the stock starts to bend up or down it has to also bend the metal plate in the direction that the plate is strongest.

 

[Sidney Smith]

Plus a gun with no side plate always l looks clunky and overly large in that area.,

 

[Keb]

I've used a few oval head countersunk tang screws as lock screws & countersunk them flush with the side plate.
I always dome the flat-topped head too.

 

[Sidney Smith]

All the lock screws I've bought come flat topped so I chuck them up into the drill press and then file them round. To me they just look better round.

 

[Zonie]

Well, I soon grew weary of the task but just for something to do I looked thru volume II of "RIFLES of COLONIAL AMERICA" to see what the shape of their lock screws were.
By the time I finished the count was 36 rifles with round head screws, 13 with flat head and 1 with a tapered cone flat head screw.

When I say "round head" I'm talking about a rounded head, usually not very high compared with its diameter. Nothing like the typical. tall, round head screw you'd see in a hardware store. Something more like the shape on the head of a carriage bolt.

The flat head screws all had the outer edge broken with either a small radius or a chamfer. None of them were sharp.

One gun had an odd countersunk flat head but it didn't have a screw driver slot in it. It looked like it had two tangs on it to engage whatever the tool was that was used to screw it in.

Almost all of the lock screws stuck out higher than the surrounding lock plate with only a few rifles that were countersunk so deeply that the edges of their heads were flush with or below the plate.

 

[Sidney Smith]

I think a lot of times the screws you buy come with excess material so they can be shaped to whatever the owner wants, or left alone, as some may like the squared look.

 

[Sinner]

Thank you Zonie. It sounds as if there is no clear method or reason as to which style was used. I can understand why a tapered countersink into the wood would be undesirable, but it seems that the flat base screws were left at least a little above the wood, from what you described (if I understood correctly). It doesn't answer my question as to "why?", but at least I know now that it was pretty much done in that fashion, for whatever reason.
I need to get a couple of books such the one you mentioned!

 

[jerrywh]

just my personal opinion but I just think they look better that way.