1842 springfield

[brubincam]

considering getting a 1842 percussion rifled musket 69 cal 42 in barrel
does anyone have any experiance useing one with patched round ball

 

[hawkeye2]

I'm sure you could make it shoot a patched round ball however they are rifled for a mini ball. The rifling is quite shallow and has a slow twist. finding a good ball/patch/powder charge combo will take some time.

 

[nkbj]

considering getting a 1842 percussion rifled musket 69 cal 42 in barrel
does anyone have any experiance useing one with patched round ball

Mine is the two band model, a repro from Armisport.
It has a .696" bore and .702" groove diameter, equal width three lands / three grooves.
I've threatened to send it off to have grooves cut in the lands. :cursing: Or to have it relined.
Those three lands are almost 3/8" wide and have smoothly rounded edges. The grooves are so shallow that as far as patched round ball is concerned, it's practically a poorly machined smooth bore. Trying to get round ball to shoot consistently can be an adventure.
Something I ran into was that the width of the lands makes for a lot of resistance to get a ball seated into the rifling. And once you do get it seated, getting it to seat concentric to the bore every time is not easy. So, loading round ball in the traditional manner may not be such a good idea. But in your barrel it may work fine.
Something I found was that a patched hardened ball with a lube soaked fiber wad can give good results. The patch / ball combination is tight enough to keep the ball centered. The fiber wad conforms to the bore and imparts rotation.

 

[varsity07840]

As stated above, you'll spend a lot of time and powder trying to come up with a round ball load. I wouldn't suggest it for hunting as they are slow to reload with the thin ramrod and quick fouling buildup due to the shallow grooves. I'd advise
determining your bore size and ordering the correct size 500 gr. mould from Moose Moulds.

Duane

 

[R.C.BINGAMAN]

Not all of them were rifled I have one it is smooth bore, at the beginning if the war many were converted from flint to rifled to fulfill the need for union arms these were mostly issued to state militia units, one such example was the 79th new York state militia. Later as the war progressed these were re-called and rifled barrels were installed to include adjustable sights.R.C.

 

[curator]

I have the Armi Sport "3 band" model and my experiences are similar to GoodCheer's. After spend a lot of powder and lead I tried a "shotgun" style load using 75 grains of FFg, a 14 gauge .125 over powder card wad, a 3/8 cushion wad followed by a .690 round ball patched with .016 pillow ticking. Accuracy improved significantly. Not exactly one-hole groups but pumpkins are no longer safe at 75 yards. The Lyman .69 minie'-ball could not be relied on to hit the target backing (24"X36") at 50 yards (most key-holed) Recoil was significant so some of the inaccuracy could have been due to induced flinching.

 

[varsity07840]

Not all of them were rifled I have one it is smooth bore, at the beginning if the war many were converted from flint to rifled to fulfill the need for union arms these were mostly issued to state militia units, one such example was the 79th new York state militia. Later as the war progressed these were re-called and rifled barrels were installed to include adjustable sights.R.C.

You're confusing the 1816 with the 1842. 1816s were flint arms, many of which were converted to percussion by various means starting in the late 1850s. Some were rifled and fit with
a variety of rear sights. Others remained smoothbore but still were fitted with rear sights. 1842s were the first percussion smoothbore production arm. Some of those that were eventually rifled did not receive the rear sight.

Duane

 

[varsity07840]

I have the Armi Sport "3 band" model and my experiences are similar to GoodCheer's. After spend a lot of powder and lead I tried a "shotgun" style load using 75 grains of FFg, a 14 gauge .125 over powder card wad, a 3/8 cushion wad followed by a .690 round ball patched with .016 pillow ticking. Accuracy improved significantly. Not exactly one-hole groups but pumpkins are no longer safe at 75 yards. The Lyman .69 minie'-ball could not be relied on to hit the target backing (24"X36") at 50 yards (most key-holed) Recoil was significant so some of the inaccuracy could have been due to induced flinching.

The reason the big Lyman didn't shoot well is that it casts around .685 and the Armi has an oversize bore as Good Cheer has noted. Original '42s had a .687 bore. A .685
Minie in a .696 bore will produce flyers and keyholes besides the nasty recoil. That's why I suggested the Moose mould that
Is around 200 gr lighter and is available in several different sizes including an oversize one @ .695.

Duane

 

[hawkeye2]

Unless you are into abusing yourself physically and mentally I would pass on the rifled 42 and opt for a .58. If you want a Civil War era rifle-musket look at a 55, 61 or 63. You would have a lot wider choice of molds and there is a lot of information out there regarding how to make them shoot. If you are looking at hunting the .58's will do anything the .69's will and be far easier on you. The same goes for punching paper too, the size of the hole doesn't matter there either. If you insist on shooting a round ball accurately stay away from the mini rifles or have Bobby Hoyt reline the barrel in a style better suited to a patched ball.

 

[Alden]

I have a defarbed one by John Zimmerman of Harper's Ferry with his custom rare long range front sight. Don't recall that helping/it being too accurate but then again I wasn't really trying... Probably shoulda taken off the bayonet?

Beautiful gun though.

 

[Wes/Tex]

The Model 1842 U.S. Percussion musket was a smooth bore, .69 caliber percussion musket made by Springfield and Harpers Ferry armories from 1844 to 1855. Both armories began converting a bit over 14,000 of them to rifled bores in 1856 to 1859...with around 10,000 having the long range sight. Additionally 3 private makers made an unknown number of copies or conversions. Copies of both types, smooth and rifled, are currently available from Italian makers.

 

[Alden]

Thank you Wes...

...and now back to our originally scheduled program.

PS: Only the rear long-range sight was common and, as mentioned, not even used on all guns...

 

[brubincam]

? QUESTION ?
if'n an 1842 smooth bore can be loaded patch and ball
why with a rifled barrel would it be harder to load
? I have an inquisative mind ? ""NOT REALLY""
was considering 1842 rifled but not to sure now

 

[Alden]

It wouldn't be...

...with a minie ball.

A patched round ball (PRB) in a rifle simply has to be so tight in its combination from the muzzle down as to engage the grooves well enough to impart spin when it comes back out (much faster one hopes). That makes muzzleloading, especially in a fowled gun, more, and increasingly, difficult and time consuming shot after shot. A smoothbore doesn't have quite the same tolerance requirements but nor does one expect as much from one insofar as accuracy is concerned. However...

...by the time Ripley was rifling US arms they had adopted minie balls, lead bullety things that can be fairly consistently and relatively continuously rammed down easily enough that have a skirted (hollowed-out) base which expands out under the initial pressure of firing to take up the rifling on the way down the barrel and start it spinning.

Here's a ubiquitous .58 US minie ball next to a honkin' .69 minie ball and .69 round ball.

 

[brubincam]

___THANK YOU____

 

[varsity07840]

? QUESTION ?
if'n an 1842 smooth bore can be loaded patch and ball
why with a rifled barrel would it be harder to load
? I have an inquisative mind ? ""NOT REALLY""
was considering 1842 rifled but not to sure now

I have found that starting a patched round ball in a rifled '42 is the same as a smoothbore all things being equal. The reason being that the rifling is very shallow. At least that's the case with my rifled '42 and my smoothbore 1816. If you have a rifled '42 you would be much better served with a properly sized
minie.

Duane

 

[Pmringer]

As others have stated, the rifling of a '42 Springfield was not designed for a PRB. Stick with the Minie. The drop right in the muzzle even after a few shots. Enjoy!