Thoughts on barrel coning

Is it just me or does taking a hammer with you to load your patch and ball into the the muzzle just seem a little...well...not quit right.

I understand the tool required to cone the barrel and process of coning the barrel, but could some one give me some experiences on the negative effects of barrel coning.

As an example I have a .54 Collerain 42 inch. What would be the negative effects of coning this barrel.

It sure would be nice to "thumb push" a patch n' ball then RR to home, swish-boom!

Root, I have'nt done it yet, but am considering it myself. I've read all the threads on here, and have'nt seen one negative comment, they have all been positive. Aside from that, even with an unconed barrel you should'nt need a hammer to seat a ball. As other threads have suggested you should try some different weight patching and ball combinations, i.e. .530/ .018 or .535/.010 you might also vary your lube also, try moose snot. Lotsa things to try before fdisk, format c:/s :haha: Bill

The negative of it would be doing it incorrectly.

IMHO, If you do not rotate the barrel per instructions & make sure it is done evenly, the coning would be all on one side & the bullet would not leave the barrel correctly, same as a bad or uneven crowning job. Also if the end of the tool is too loose in the bore you could get the same results.

Another thought, if it is not finished properly & smoothed out nicely, it could build fouling in this area as of the crosscut grooves from the emery paper. One wants to get finished with the job, but haste should be avoided as the finish is extremely important. It should be so smooth a patch on a tight jag comes past it just as slick as the rest of the barrel.

I have found that the more time & the slower you do the job, the better coning job it is upon completion. You cannot horse it & cut it fast, and trying to do so you will just make the task drag out longer as it grabs the paper & you end up continously cleaning glue off the tool & replacing the emery paper. Thus slowly & meticulously with TLC & expect to spend 1 to 1.5 hours & it will all work out fine.

:results:

Grand! First-Post, Subject which Horrifies!

"Countre-Bored". "Coning" I view; "Home-Expedient of Dubious-Virtue".

Then-Again, I Do Barrels-Manufacture, Mere-Thought of "Dremel&Hand-Drill Jockeys" at One of My-Products.....

Try searching the ancient threads on coning. You will find all of the wives tales and speculations you will ever desire to read.

After that you can get on the phone and call the Getz barrel company and ask. They will recomend the proper tool maker and explain that there is no affect on accuracy if done correctly.

Muzzle Blasts and Muzzleloader both did articles on the coning tools about a year ago. Peter Alexander (the Gunmaker of Greenville County) coned one of his guns for a before and after test that showed no harm to the accuracy level of the rifle.

From this point on 90% of the posts on this thread will begin with the words:

"you can't convince me"

"I can not believe"

"I don't see how you think"

"I don't see how anybody in their right mind could believe"

After that it gets really nasty!

:results:

Rootnuke ~ On the American Longrifles site, page 6 of the Gunbuilders forum, there is a post by Smallpatch called, "Hiney Muzzle Decoration." I know it's not what you have asked about in this post, but it is a very nice looking addtion to the muzzle. According to Don Getz, when done properly, it doesn't affect the accuracy in the least. I must say, it does look good. I'm going to try it on the rifle I am finishing up right now.
Rick

Pray-Note; "If Done-Correctly"..........

Prefer for "Tight-Projectile/Patch" Combinations, "False-Muzzle" or; "Countre-Bore" (Effectively "Integral False-Muzzle")

I think "If Done Correctly" applies to all aspects of in building a muzzleloader.


:results:

Whoa! That is certainly attractive, but this chil'e would suffer an embolism going after the inside O'his muzzle with files. :shocking: I limit myself to "gimping" the spines of knives.

I have just coned my .61 Colerain and it is fantastic to thumb press the ball/patch into the barrel and slide it smoothly home with the gun's ramrod instead of a stainless steel range rod. Heck, I think my groups are beginning to tighten up. It took me two hours to cone it and both my hands were sore from turning both the barrel and the tool at the same time. I highly recommend it to anyone. Just be sure you have a really big tap handle!

Yes, "Universal-Caveat"..."Correctly". Pity-Is So Seldom-Seen!

Have "Jaundiced-View" perhaps, Twenty+ Years of "Monkey-Wrench/Bigger-Hammer"-foulness-Seen upon Once-Fine Arms-Wrought!

My Out-Put One-Barrel Per-Week, (Rifle) Today a little-Time to "Chat" Steel-Delivery-Awaiting.

"Crowns" To Barrel Important, and "Accuracy" Nebulous-Term Bandied-About. "Minute-of-Moose" May for Individual-Function, I have not this Type of "Coning" in Controlled-Labouratory Environment-Demonstrated. (Good or Ill)

Thus We have but Anecdotal-"Evidence" to call-upon.

Should "Good-Hour-Fairy" Ever upon-Me additional-Time Gift, perhaps I shall this on Old "Douglas-Barrel"/Controlled-Conditions try.

Until-Then, Parallel-Countre-Bore HAS (In My Experience) proven efficacious! :m2c:

I cone all of my barrels and wouldn't have it any other way. Rootnuke, I have a .54 caliber tool, if you want to use it, send me a PM.

rootnuke,

I personally cone ALL my muzzles. I use th Joe Woods coning tool, and not only does it make for an easy operation, it also in no way adversely affects the accuracy of the barrel.
In fact, I think it sometimes improves the accuracy. Maybe from not having to pound them in with a mallet.

On my Getz .40's (which are awesome). They like a nice tight patch/ball combo. .400 ball with .020 patch. Not fun to load from a bag. With this combo, I can use only a short starter, and they load easily.
If you use a .395, you can thumb start, and finish with the rod only.
The key is to take your time, follow the instructions, and viola, you've got a nice loading, nice shooting barrel.
They are caliber specific, ( you need a different one for each caliber) and cost about $37 with shipping. Takes about 1 1/2 to 2hrs to do.
They are the best.
:RO: :imo: :redthumb:

Rootnuke,
You ask if there is any negetive effects. The only and I mean the only neg for me has been when using a precut patch for a .40 cal. that is just about perfect size. I've seen the patch try to turn on the ball a little and it made it hard to center perfect. That was real easy to handle with a little larger patch.

Root,
I know you asked for negative comments, but I don't have any ... I've coned three .50 cal muzzles with Joe Wood's tool with no negative effects.

And maybe someday it will help me shoot like Deadeye!


Greg


(Great avatar, by the way!)

I ordered a coning tool from Joe Woods today (thanks for the offer LSUTiger) But you know me, half the fun is buying tools.

From all I can read, it's the thing to do. I'll just set down and read the directions and take my time.

Yes, "Universal-Caveat"..."Correctly". Pity-Is So Seldom-Seen!

Have "Jaundiced-View" perhaps, Twenty+ Years of "Monkey-Wrench/Bigger-Hammer"-foulness-Seen upon Once-Fine Arms-Wrought!

My Out-Put One-Barrel Per-Week, (Rifle) Today a little-Time to "Chat" Steel-Delivery-Awaiting.

"Crowns" To Barrel Important, and "Accuracy" Nebulous-Term Bandied-About. "Minute-of-Moose" May for Individual-Function, I have not this Type of "Coning" in Controlled-Labouratory Environment-Demonstrated. (Good or Ill)

Thus We have but Anecdotal-"Evidence" to call-upon.

Should "Good-Hour-Fairy" Ever upon-Me additional-Time Gift, perhaps I shall this on Old "Douglas-Barrel"/Controlled-Conditions try.

Until-Then, Parallel-Countre-Bore HAS (In My Experience) proven efficacious! :m2c:

Click to expand...

I'm glad we agree.

Hey, rootnuke. If you have calipers would you mind measuring between the lands on your Colerain .54? My Colerain .62 is really .610 and I would like to hear from some other Colerain owners. I ask you this because Joe Wood had to make a tool to fit my bore, the .62 tool he sent first didn't fit inside my barrel

I've coned about a dozen .40, .50 and .54 barrels and have a .40 that I just started shooting that needs it, too. It makes loading so much easier if you can push that patched ball into the muzzle with your thumb. Did have one rifle that shot to a different point of impact after coning, which tells me that the crown must not have been concentric before coning, because it sure was after. I use a different technique than Joe Woods'. Same tool, paper and all, but I don't use a tap wrench. I take the barrel out of the stock and hang it from the ceiling with a wire through the lock bolt hole. The tool is mounted in a handle similar to a screwdriver. I sit so the barrel hangs plumb to my hands and when I insert the coner, it is concentric with the bore. This keeps all the sanding dust from falling into the bore. I plug the bore with a cleaning patch and pull it out afterwards and clean the bore where the tool works several times during the operation. I twist the barrel and tool in opposite directions, and frequently reverse directions. I frequently take the tool out and brush off the dust. I let go the tool frequently to adjust my hold to plumb.

One other thing you may need to buy is a large tap wrench. The shaft on Joe's coning tool is about 3/16".