the woes with a tc new englander

[corey012778]

I started out muzzleloading with an inline (sorry) last year. did not take me long to decide I wanted an sidelock. got a deal on an tc new englander. so I took my birthday money and bought it.

first range session with it was very short. 3 or 4 shots. then rain started.

barrel a pitted. so I took some jb bore paste to the bore.

first real range session with it. started having problems with it. I could did not hold a group with a darn. the following session. started to get really pissing me off. no matter what patch I used it would not group, more then half the time could not even hit the target.

finally, broke down and sent it to tc to work on it. two weeks later, I got it back. they replace a number of parts at no charge. that made my wife very happy. last week, got it back to the range for a session. I was having a decent range session with it. until I starting having hammer hitting the cap. it would take 3 hits to set off the cap. when I had 2 delays in a row. I started look at the nipple. it was flatten and could not even get a cap on it. packed the it up and started on another muzzleloader.

that is the story of that gun. I sent some nipples off for a modding. should be back at the range in a week or 2. to see if the nipple was my problem.

 

[50cal.cliff]

OK I got to ask a couple of questions here!
What are you using for powder? I origionally started with a sub and had a missfire problem as the fouling was terrible! Now I only shoot GEOX 2ffg thru my .50 only!
Also if you are not doing it you should at least wipe between shots. Residue build up will cause misfires sometime. When you wipe its best I find to run the first patch not quite all the way down pull it and turn it or change it before goin all the way to the bottom! The result is you don't push all the fouling down into the drum and block the nipple.
Also I now use Hoppes Black Powder Lube & Solvent as a lube I found using it I can shoot up to ten plus times and have shot as high as 25 one day just to see how far I cold push it without accuracy suffering too much!
Check how the hammer is striking the nipple. If it's stiking it flat or not. Alot of folks go for a different nipple than what is designed for the gun and it changes the height just enough to throw off the hammer strike.
If none of that helps I think there is a fellow by the handle of Roundball, he can offer some advice as he is TC funatic!

 

[Swede50]

Be sure to put a cap on the nipple and not dry fire the TC. If you do you will swage the nipple in a hurry and the cap will not go all the way down causing the not firing problem.

Good luck dont give up it gets better.

 

[roundball]

Agree with the others...and would add that TC's "Hot Shot" nipples are the best I've ever happened to use on my TC's...and agree that no nipple should be dry fired on...fold up an inch of old washcloth to cover the nipple first, or slip a scrap piece of leather between the hammer and nipple, etc.
(make sure the leather is thick enough so the sharp edges of the nipple don't punch a piece of leather out and then it clogs the nipple channel)

Real BP is hands down the best for sure-fire ignition...but if you have to use a BP sub right now, after dumping in a powder charge raise the rifle up by the barrel and use your other hand to bump-bump-bump the lock area to ensure some kernels shift over and settle into the fire channel underneath the nipple...a good practice with any powder but particularly so with a BP sub as they are so much harder to ignite than real BP.

 

[Blizzard of '93]

sounds as if you are meeting head-on with the intricities of learning about muzzleloaders. keep at it it takes awhile.

 

[corey012778]

I do use tc hot shots. got a deal on them. I have been shooting pyrodex rs and p out of all of my muzzleloaders. been planning on working with some real stuff. since I have a local gun shop that carries it.

 

[BrownBear]

Sounds like a new nipple is in order before taking another step, based on the symptoms you describe. The ones you own are just fine, but the one on your gun right now is shot. Just screw in a new one, and I bet your problems are solved.

 

[StewartLeach]

Corey:

JB is a great product. I've brought many barrels (ML and modern) back to life by judicious use of JB and the similar but milder product called RemClean. With your ML, you need to use a tight fitting patch of strong, tightly woven material such as pillow ticking. Be sure to use a muzzle protector on the rod so that compound on the rod doesn't damage your crown.

Another thing to try with a used barrel is a lengthy soaking with Shooters Choice Lead Remover. Sometimes it isn't so much pitting as lead or jacket alloy buildup. JB doesn't always get down in the corners of rifling. Apply Lead Remover with a nylon brush, and let the barrel sit for 24 hours. Patch out, reapply remover, let sit, etc. for 5-10 repetitions. Before firing, clean well to remove petroleum residues.

Others speak wisdom about dry firing! It will batter the nipple. With a single trigger gun, change to a used up nipple before dry firing. On a double set trigger gun, dry fire with the hammer down.

You can get some extra life out of a nipple by dressing down the outside mushroom with an automotive point file. Do this using rolling strokes of the file, with the nipple off the rifle. Go easy, check cap fit often, you're done when new cap pushes on with firm thumb pressure.

'Nother thought, about an often neglected aspect of ML rifle maintenance. Be sure to scrape accumulated crud from the inside of the hammer nose. A layer of primer and powder residue in this area can have a cushioning effect, resulting in delayed or no ignition.

Regards,

White Fox

 

[wahunterinrok]

I went through this exact same thing with my Cabela's hawken, had bought a replacement nipple, and had the same issues, bought a TC hot shot nipple, and all those problems are gone. I also switched to Goex 2F and my ignition is instantanious!

 

[renovato]

The gang has given great advice for solving your misfire issues. I've had the exact same thing happen from nipples that were pounded down. Being the cheap person that I am, I filed them back to dimension and they worked fine.

I shoot a New Englander that I bought used at an auction. It had a terribly rusted and pitted bore. I restored it similar to how you restored yours and it shoots great. I use it for hunting more than any other muzzleloader I own.

Once you get yours firing reliable, work on load development. The New Englander can be a very accurate gun with the right load, but like all muzzleloaders, it takes some tinkering to find out what that load is. For mine, it's 80 grains FFFG Goex black powder, a .530 ball and pillow ticking I bought from Walmart. I use Ballistol as lube, but Hoppe's #9 black powder lube and solvent works great too and is easier to apply.

If you can get real black powder, try it. It usually works far better than any of the substitutes. Start at about 60 grains and work your way up till you find the sweet spot. Also, keep an eye on your patches to see if they're shredding or burning. That'll throw off accuracy too. If they are, it's time to diagnose that problem.

 

[corey012778]

thanks for all advice, I will take them all, think about it. I have some more nipples coming in so it will be about a week before I get back out with it. I maybe able to pick up some goex. I have some pillow ticker.

my new englander is a 50cal so, I am planning on using conicals in it. stilling using roundballs to help with the basic site in.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Corey: Since you are new to all this, invest $15.00 in Dutch Schoultz' Black Powder Accuracy System. It will teach you how to work up an accurate load, how to read your targets, and how to read those patches.
http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

It will be the best $15.00 you have ever spent, and you will be miles ahead of where you might otherwise be working with your new gun. I consult my copy of his materials frequently, either to answer my own questions, or those of other shooters. Its is part of my firearms Reference library.

 

[corey012778]

this came from my last range session with the new englander.

I ripped the target when I folded.
25yrds 65grs of pyrodex rs .010" patch. grabbed the wrong pack

50yds same charge and patch.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Expect any new gun to take many shots to settle in.

Get rid of the PYrodex, and work with real Black Powder. When you get that new nipple, check out the contacts. The sights are okay. Without knowing which shot hit first, second, etc. I can't possibly know if the shots were walking up, or down on you.

It may take you some time to learn to discipline yourself to focus ONLY On the front sight, and HOLD THAT picture through recoil. Otherwise, you may be lifting your face off the stock, either to anticipate recoil, or to see over that cloud of smoke to see where you hit.

Ask a friend to man a spotting scope next to you and up wind, so he can tell you exactly where your shot hit. Then you can concentrate on that sight picture and your follow-through. Those Orange dots look nice a big at the range, but give you a " fuzzy " picture to aim at.

I recommend taking a business card, or the corner of any card stock, and make a diamond aiming point( Black paper for a white background; white paper for a black background), Either under the orange dot, or on top of the dot. That way you can bring the front sight up to the point, from which ever direction works for you, to give you a consistent aiming point, without having to use a rifle scope sight.

I found this helps shooters who have spent more years shooting scopes, than iron sights, and , lets say, are just a little " rusty ' shooting iron sights. :redface: :blah: :rotf: :hmm: :thumbsup: With the aiming point, they are less likely to lift their heads, and walk those hits up or down.