Storing black powder for flinter?

[Col. Batguano]

If you light 2 open piles of powder, one smokeless, and the other black, the black will burn much faster. However, the situation is reversed when the smokeless powder is contained. Because it is a PROGRESSIVE burning powder, as the pressure increases, so does the burn rate. It happens to some extent with BP, but not so dramatically as with smokeless.

Black Powder burns based upon the exposed surface area; smaller granulation = more exposed surface area. Think of it as burning down from the top of the pile and through conduction. Smokeless burns based on conduction AND radiation, so effectively, as the pressure increases, and the radiation from the heat reaches all the flakes, they all burn at once.

That's why just a couple of grains difference in a cartridge gun load can cause huge differences in pressure, but almost no difference with BP.

That said, if you're going to store the stuff in any quantity, do it in a way that will let it burn openly, (a box with a non-latched lid or a method where the gas can escape) and not have the pressure build up to the point the container will fail catastrophically. That, in effect, becomes a bomb.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Mr. Wright, not sure where you live, but...,

Here in the People's Republic of Maryland, there are some regulations on powder storage. You aren't supposed to store more than 5 lbs. of either in a townhouse, and (iirc) it's either the same for an apartment or none in an apartment. (Been a while since I was living in an apartment.)

Some of the guys here store extra pounds of BP when it exceeds the local ordinance by placing it in a Stash Below Ground. They have an O-ring to seal out moisture, and can be fully covered. This keeps a pretty stable temp if you put it, for example, in a garden bed, and cover the top with some mulch.

LD

 

[FishDFly]

I would be more worried about storing flammable liquids which emit explosive vapors which sealed BP cans do not.......

 

[Loyalist Dave]

You're right, we are actually in more danger from Harry Homeowner who stores a couple of gallons of gasoline in a shed in the back yard, than from gun powder. (Truthfully, we're in the most danger from the Meth labs, but that's a different topic altogether :shocked2: )

Actually, the few people who use the ground stash are either avid reloaders who save money by buying in bulk, or more commonly, folks in reenactment units, and they are storing unit quantities of black powder, or pre-rolled cartridges. They're not really adding to safety here..., they are avoiding problems if it becomes known they have exceeded the ordinance on powder, or worse if a fire demonstrates that they did so.

LD

 

[Danny Ross]

With the advent recently of the new plastic containers for Black Powder. If in a fire they would melt first and you will basically have loose powder burning where pressure can't build. There would be a greater chance of a pressure build if they ignited in the older metal cans for an explosion. DANNY

 

[Eddie Southgate]

With the advent recently of the new plastic containers for Black Powder. If in a fire they would melt first and you will basically have loose powder burning where pressure can't build. There would be a greater chance of a pressure build if they ignited in the older metal cans for an explosion. DANNY

That is why they went to the plastic in the first place . Mine sets on a shelf in my shop with the exception of a fair number of cans of Dupont that I keep safely tucked away in an undisclosed location . Love them oval cans ! Great post Danny you are 100% correct .

Eddie

 

[Joe Yanta]

I follow along the thought of my grandfathers way of storing powder. The access to his attic was external meaning he had to get a latter, get on the roof and go through a locked access door to get to his stash. He would keep less than a pound in his hunting gear in the house but when he need to get more up to the attic he would go.

I store mine in a locked discarded kitchen cabinet assembly hung mounted on the rafters in my garage. I need to get a latter to get to it. I feel that it totally safe from the grandkids. I keep a baking thermometer mounted through it where I can check the temperature with just a glance and the temp has never been over 90 degrees. Being it stored under the roof if there ever was a fire the powder would just go foof upwards through a more than likely damaged or weakened roof.

JY

 

[kansas_volunteer]

Keeping bang-ables and boom-ables ouside in the ground is probably a very good idea. Homeowners insurance may not cover fire damage to your place if fire fighters back away and let it burn because of powder exploding or cartridges going off. Getting the stuff out of the house might save you thousands of dollars if you have a fire.

 

[nhmoose]

When FF back off from cartridges going off the insurance company will subjugate the loss against the town and fire district due to lack of training.

 

[rdstrain49]

When FF back off from cartridges going off the insurance company will subjugate the loss against the town and fire district due to lack of training.

I would be very interested in any case law pertaining to that statement.

 

[coloradoclyde]

With the advent recently of the new plastic containers for Black Powder. If in a fire they would melt first and you will basically have loose powder burning where pressure can't build. There would be a greater chance of a pressure build if they ignited in the older metal cans for an explosion. DANNY

Doubtful, but the lids would probably pop off easier Due to softening of the plastic...most plastic meting points are above the ignition temp of Black powder.

Metal cans had a seam and that is where they ruptured...
A metal can will not explode when exposed to fire...it will simple rupture with a large fireball and cloud of smoke as if the powder were burnt in the open.
The containers that BP comes in are designed to fail at low pressures....about a 100psi.....Explosions are on the magnitude of 1000's of psi.

 

[coloradoclyde]

When FF back off from cartridges going off the insurance company will subjugate the loss against the town and fire district due to lack of training.

I helped rescue a man from a house fire where 1000's of rounds of ammunition where going off...
It didn't deter the fire fighters one bit.
Frankly!...aerosol cans are more frightening...and dangerous...

Another fire I saw involved a small 2 story shed...after the fire was out the fireman removed items from the upper loft...when they found scuba tanks, they were scared....

 

[meanmike8665]

No, I said I stored my powder under my wife's side of the bed.
It has been a running joke for years.
Michael

 

[Ray-Vigo]

Well said. Many jurisdictions govern storage of black powder under fire codes.

You want a container that will blow its lid upward before it explodes outward in all directions. Many powder mills were built in exactly this way - the structure blows its roof to let out the pressure upward rather than containing it to the point everything blows outward in all directions.

As for longevity - a cool, dry place works well. Black powder can be stored for a very long time and still work perfectly well when stored in such a place.

 

[coloradoclyde]

Some towns have special or additional restrictions....Towns with no special restrictions usually (if not all) have still adopted the NFPA as their minimum standard.

 

[Billnpatti]

John, if it were me, I'd just find or make a wooden, or even a cardboard, box big enough to hold the powder cans. I have found that one of the military ammo cans makes a good storage container for the powder cans. Then, I would just store them on a shelf in the garage. In any case, just keep the powder dry and it will be just fine. Like one of the other posters said, I keep about that amount in my range box. I also don't muddy the water by asking the city about storage limits. I just store it in my range box and keep my mouth shut. I actually don't know what the city, county or state storage limits for black powder are. But, that is just me and I don't recommend that anyone else do what I do.