Starting all over from scratch

[madc0w2000]

I am new to the traditon BP world, getting away from the inlines. I have a new Cabelas Hawkins, .50cal with 1:48 twist barrel that is 28" long. I orginally shot it the first time using pyrodex 70gr pushing a Great Plains 385gr conical. Not bad at the 25yd mark, it was a clover leaf. At 50 yds it was running about 6" high and at 100 yds, it was 8" low. The rear sights were very loose and difficult to see. Sooooooo.... I went out and got FFF Goex (they ran out of FF)and fiber optic sights so I can see better. Still planning to use the conicals because I am gearing up for Elk and deer. So my question would be, what be a good begining charge to start sighting in all over again?

Thanks for all your help, hoping to put meat in the freezer this year!!

 

[Black Hand]

Why conicals for deer and elk? A patched round ball will do a fine job on both out to 75-100 yards. Most of us don't have any business shooting farther than that at an animal with a muzzleloader.....

Start at 50gr FFFg and work up until you find the best load for your shooting combination.

 

[madc0w2000]

Thanks Black Hand!! I have these conicals left over from the inlines. Next year, I am planning to try my luck with PRB. Planning to get a drop in .54cal for it next year, just want a little bit more lead flying in the air.

 

[E Poffinbarger]

Madcow:

Bremerton, home of that somewhat oversized clam, how well I remember.

I got no problems with a Cabela's rifle, I own one in .54 caliber for patched round balls.

I also agree with other posters in that a well placed patched round ball will produce the same .50 caliber sized hole in a game animal.

I would further suggest that up to 100yds a patched round ball load will produce a tighter group and flatter tragectory with considerably less powder than an overweight conical.

Just in case you may have read that I shoot a big solid lead 425gr Minie in one of my rifles, Reason: Fast Twist, Shallow Rifled Barrel.

Osage

 

[madc0w2000]

Oh yes.... the famous gooeduck, how they got that name I will never know! Another reason I am shooting conicals is because time is short for me until hunting season. Don't have that many free weekends to be out finding what is what. Now next year, that is a different story. I will have the whole spring/summer time frame to tweak the PRB thing down and I might even have that .54cal barrel by then.

 

[50cal.cliff]

Congrats on coming back from the dark side (inlines)! :rotf: :rotf:
Conicals are OK I have used them in a .50 before. They were homecast. Probably what most would call a minie. Sometimes terms get used too loosely around the camp. Wern't my gun I was using at the time but, once I got the charge figured out they were fairly accurate.

 

[madc0w2000]

I really want to try my hand at the PRB, but I got the hawkens kinda late, so had to use what I know would work in a pinch. I really want to get a .54cal barrel for her and really work on the PRB, thinking of using the teflon patching material. Big thing is, as long as I can drop the critters, that is all that matters. Freezers are kinda bare, since someone helped themselves to all of our venison when the house was being rebuilt.

 

[longcruise]

Suggest somewhere in the 80 to 100 grains of the 3f. That trajectory you were getting is crazy. Seems almost certain that it is caused by a sight problem.

Agree with you on the prb. Leave it for next year and concentrate on this years load for now.

I'm a prb "believer" :wink: too, but I'd suggest that you get a .54 GM slow twist for your prb barrel for next year and stick with the conicals this year.

 

[feyx0006]

As somebody in very similar shoes to your own (recently started into trad MLing, same rifle, etc.), I can say this from my limited experience. I have tried both conicals (Maxi Hunters) and PRB. I am dead-on with conicals at 50 yds and "in the black" at 100 yds using 100 grs Goex FFg. My PRB's are dead-on at 50 yds, but all over the page at 100 using 90 grs FFg. Obviously I have a lot of work to do in trying to work up my hunting loads. I also worry a bit that I get my best conical accuracy by exceeding the "Max Loads" for conicals provided in the manual (80 grs FFg). From what I have learned on this kick-A forum, using FFFg requires a roughly 10% reduction in powder charge. Hopefully some of this helps.

 

[Walks with fire]

I once had a problem with great accuracy at 50 yards but poor accuracy at 100 yards. At the suggestion of a forum member I went up .005 in ball size and a little thicker patch. Problem solved and quite happy with it.

Something is not right with your trajectory though; even with a conical 6" high at 50 should not leave it hitting low at 100.

 

[jgunn286]

I shoot prb and Lee R.E.A.L 250 gr bullets from my New Englander which has a similar barrel, both with 70gr of FFg powder. It shoots the same point of impact with either and both loads drop a deer equally as well.

 

[Vaino]

Formerly used .50 cal. 410 gr. Buffalo Bullets in a TC Hawken w/ 100 grs. 2f and this load was very accurate and killed a few elk. The problem w/ this load was that a 50-60 yd. zero was necessary because the midrange height at a 100 yd zero was excessive. This rifle is still a loaner to someone who is starting MLer elk hunting but who also is told of the guns limitations. For the last 8 yrs. I've used a .54 "Hawken" w/ a PRB and 120 grs. 2f and this combo is much more versatile w/ a zero at 100 yds and has killed a few elk and deer. The midrange height and 100 yd. drop you're experiencing indicate more powder is needed once the sight problem is fixed.......Fred

 

[John Taylor]

The 1 in 48 twist has aways been something to talk (argue) about. To fast for a round ball and to slow for a conical.My first T/C was over 30 years back and beings it has the same twist it should be close to what you have. I found that a 70 grain load of 2F did fine for the PRB but the conical took more than 100 to shoot good. Others that I knew at the time were using 110 of 2F with the Maxi ball. I didn't like all the recoil so stayed with the round ball. Now I shoot a 62 with PRB and don't worry about knock down power, I got plenty.

 

[madc0w2000]

Thanks to you all, great information!!! I got the new sights (fiber optics, front is red and rear is 2 green dots)this will DEFINATELY improve my sighting in. I got the 3F Goex (wanted 2F but they were out)because I have heard it is suppose to be more consistent then Pyrodex. So the main thing is, getting time to get to the range and shoot some lead to see how I do. Thank you again guys for all your help!!!! Will post pics if I get the "big'en"......

 

[Runner]

One, back off the powder you are using. I hunt with 70 grains under a roundball for deer. That is plenty for 200 pound bucks at 60 yards as I have proven more than once now.It is fine out past that too, but I don't set up to get long shots with roundball. So far I have let everything walk out past that with roundball. Most deer I kill are within 30 yards.

With roundball, you need a tight ball patch combination for best accuracy in that gun from my experience and all I have read. I use a 495 with a medium thick patch in my fifty. You definately need a short starter to start it.

If I was going to attempt elk with a traditional styled 50, I would load a conical on my first hunt myself. I am assuming that the gun you have is 1-48 twist. The 385 Hornady HP HB is a very good bullet for guns in that twist and should hold accuracy from 50 grains to about 100 grains of 3f. 80 should be about right on the recoil threshhold for comfortable shooting. 100 kicks pretty bad. I use the Lee target Minnie over 90 grains of 3f in my slug barrel. It is good to a lot farther than I have any right shooting irons at something alive!