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JoeVitullo

32 Cal
Joined
Dec 17, 2022
Messages
4
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Location
NJ
Hello,
I need help with a T/C Hawkin .50cal rifle. It is shooting very high at 25yards and not on paper at 50yards. I am only shooting PRB. I tried .495 and .490 balls, I tried 3 different thickness patches, 2F, 3F all different grains from 50-100. I backed the rear sight all the way down and wasn’t enough adjustment still. I put a new Williams fiber optic front/rear sight which were higher and still didn’t change anything. It’s a rifle passed down to me and really trying to get it to work but at a dead end right now. I haven’t been able to find my patches after a shot when at the range because the ground is dirty. Any suggestions???Thanks
 
We'll sure try to help, It could be a barrel fitting issue,
Does it have a proper wedge key?
Do you have experience with ML rifles prior to this one?
Can you share photo's of the rifle with us?
 
Necchi is correct in that we need photos of the rifle, barrel and sights. However, something is confusing here. You say it was shooting high with the first sight and you backed it down and it still shot High. Then you put a taller rear sight on - if so - it will shoot even higher than the first one???

If the first sight was/is an original - it sounds like someone has put a short front sight on it. To correct the first front sight (adjusted all the way down and shooting high) you would need a taller front sight.
 
This is an issue where in person help is begged for. However, my first thought was a sight problem. I have never liked TC factory sights. You do not state if those high hits are grouping well. Messing with changing sights before you work up an accurate load is a back ward approach.
 
Thanks for the replies. The groups were well with both 2f and 3f using .490 prb. I originally had the factory rights with it and went with the Williams fiber optics. The William sights are a little taller in the front and I think the same height for the rear sights. It was shooting high no matter what I changed. I have just basic knowledge of muzzleloading, I don’t have a lot of experience. It does have the proper wedge key.
 

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What does your sight picture look like? Are you trying to cover the target with the front sight, or are you leveling the front sight with the top of the rear sight and holding the target directly on top of the front sight (six o'clock hold)? BruceHH is correct if you are using the six o'clock hold with the rear sight bottomed out, you would need a higher front sight only. If you are covering the target with your front sight that very well could be the problem, because you can't see where the actual hold on the target is when it is covered causing you to shoot high. The six o'clock hold is the best sight picture when shooting open sights. I use a 1.5-2 inch dot at 50yds (when my eyes were better I used a 1 inch dot) setting the dot on top of the front sight for my sight picture. DANNY
 
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This is an issue where in person help is begged for. However, my first thought was a sight problem. I have never liked TC factory sights. You do not state if those high hits are grouping well. Messing with changing sights before you work up an accurate load is a back ward approach.
I'm going with sight problem as well. Or at least an improper sight picture.

I can't imagine anything else causing high at 25 and not on paper at 50.

A tall rear sight and a low front sight will send balls into the stratosphere.
 
I had a similar issue with my Hawken. Lower your rear sight all the way. If the factory rear sight sits lower you may need to swap it out. I had to file my rear sight to lower it even more. At 50 yds its still 2 inches high.

This is all assuming you have the correct sight alignment
 
Is this a T/C Hawken with the original adjustable sights. This will be a bead front sight and a round notch in the rear sight. The proper sight picture will be to center the bead at the top of the post in the rear sight notch. Then I would put that bead in the center of the bull.

Now I see that @JoeVitullo has replaced the T/C sights with the Williams fiber optic sights. Not sure what that sight picture would look like.
 
This is my suggestion. You replaced the front and rear sights with the Williams fire optic sights. Call Williams company and speak with one of their technicians. Explain your problem to them. They will ask for sight height measurements. You said it was the T/C Hawken model, so the barrel should be a straight wall octagon. The techs at Williams are top notch. They helped me get the right sight combination for my last build. That rifle was built to teach new shooters how to align the sights.
 
When I was using the factory sights I had the bead sitting in the notch and aimed that bead right in the center of the bullseye. Now with the Williams sights. I have a 3 dot look. I align them all flush with each other and have the middle bead again in the center of the bullseye on the target. I will call Williams too and see what they say. Thank you guys for all the replies. I will keep you updated on the progress.
 
I ran into this problem with a TC Tree Hawk, factory sights shot at the moon adjusted all the way down. I kept the factory rear but ordered an extra tall fiber optic front sight, it was probably 3/16" taller than a factory front. This got my groups down into the rear sight adjustability range, the front sight was so tall it looked odd but you have to go with what works.

I believe your Williams rear sight is taller than a TC factory sight as well, which would contribute to the problem.
 
I ran into this problem with a TC Tree Hawk, factory sights shot at the moon adjusted all the way down. I kept the factory rear but ordered an extra tall fiber optic front sight, it was probably 3/16" taller than a factory front. This got my groups down into the rear sight adjustability range, the front sight was so tall it looked odd but you have to go with what works.

I believe your Williams rear sight is taller than a TC factory sight as well, which would contribute to the problem.
Yes I believe your right, Im going to put the factory rear sight back on and try that. Thanks
 
Just looking at your photos the rear sight may just be too high for the front sight if it is in its lowest setting. Did it also shoot high with the factory sights?
 
I have the same issue with my TC Hawken 50 no matter what powder patch combo I use it still shoots high. Lowering the rear sights all the way was very uncomfortable for me. I also had my traditions deer hunter with me and it preformed flawlessly. The only conclusion I could come to the front sight is to short but it doesn't look to been filed down.
 
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I need help with a T/C Hawkin .50cal rifle. It is shooting very high at 25yards and not on paper at 50yards.
How high is ‘very high’? First thing is to shoot at a bigger target, one that you can hit consistently. Before fiddling with the sights (I suggest going back to the factory sights), work with loads until you have 5 shot groups (no matter how high) at 50 yards with all 5 shots touching. Then measure how high above that group is above your point of aim. Once you have that information it is simple math to figure how much you have to adjust your sights. For example, say ‘very high’ is 12” at 50 yards. Your T/C Hawken should have 21” between it’s front and rear sights. An adjustment of .144” down with the rear or up with front sight (or any .144” total between the two) should theoretically zero your gun.

So how high is ‘very high’? And are you sure you are shooting over your target and not under it?
 
Somebody put Williams Fire Sights or something on it. I don't particularly like those, and that is likely the cause of your trouble. Shoot a group first. If you can keep them on paper in a fairly tight group somehow, then at least you can eliminate barrel problems, barrel mounting issues and marksmanship issues.

Next, you need a taller front sight. Easiest way I found was to take a wad of modeling clay and make a temporary front sight. Move your rear sight to the center of it's adjustment, then put your wad of clay on the barrel... or even on the existing front sight. Form it into a sight and shoot it. Make your adjustments by making the front sight either taller or shorter. When you get it on target, measure the height of the clay sight and you will know how high the replacement sight should be.

There are other ways, but this one works well enough and is quite a bit cheaper than ordering sights of different heights to try.

I believe there is a formula as well that sort of works.

Before you start this, though, consider whether or not you actually LIKE the sights that are on the gun. I personally would get a Williams FP aperture sight and see if you can make it work with the existing front sight... but your mileage may vary.
 

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