smooth bore accuracy

[pathfinderifh]

Has any one else noticed that the smaller bore smoothies seem to shoot straighter than the larger ones? :: The reason I ask is I have I have 5, A.40,.50,.54,.62,.75. The .40 will out shoot all of these and most of my rifles. It may be a little unfair to compare 'Ole Wormy to the others because the man who originaly had Her had Bill Large[who's gone now :cry:] do his magic on the barrel. It's taper choked .015 from breech to 13" from breech,then jug choked for 2" 3" from muzzle. Some day when I get the time I'll try to duplicate these dimentions on one of the others to see how it works out. But strait off the bench,smaller seams better.

Pathfinder

 

[AZ-Robert]

That is surprising. I thought the conventional wisdow was that the mass of the larger balls helped stabilize them a bit - along the lines of heavier shot giving tighter groups than small shot.

 

[Deadeye]

Last weekend I shot a 5 shot group at 100 yds. with a 20 ga.
(TC .54 rebore to 20) with PRB and 100 gr. 2F, 2 7/8"
offhand. I think the big bores can hold their own against the smaller ones. Course I did have a rear sight on this one.

 

[Gaze]

That is surprising. I thought the conventional wisdow was that the mass of the larger balls helped stabilize them a bit - along the lines of heavier shot giving tighter groups than small shot.

Sam Fadala insists that the big balls are better, and the bigger, the better. [I have trouble understanding his writing. Either I have sniffed too much Bullseye smoke or he has sniffed too much black power smoke.]

Fadala's case (as I understand it) is that the big ball has much greater mass relative to its imperfections.

 

[Mike Brooks]

I've shot .50 , .55 , .62 , & .80 all patched round ball smooth bore and found the .50 & .55 to be the most accurate. I've never found that Sam Fadala could tell the difference between a large rock and his head.... :youcrazy:

 

[Gaze]

Mike Brooks: I've never found that Sam Fadala could tell the difference between a large rock and his head.... :youcrazy:

That explains why I could never identify the second guy from the left.

 

[ffffg]

there is no doubt that a bigger round ball will be more accurate.. that is if its fired from a 100 pound gun in a vice... its the same problem with all guns, where powder charges get larger than what the shooter can absorb properly. especially in black powder guns where long barrel time is moveing the shot in every preciveable direction depending on holding diferences.. of course your milage may vary.. ball deformation in small bores is difficult to master,.. so we all have difficult paths to follow, no matter what we choose.. dave

 

[Swampman]

I believe that larger projectiles are more likely to be affected by voids. I don't see much use for small bore smooth guns. If you can't shoot a good dose of shot out of a gun, you may as well have a rifle.

 

[Mike Brooks]

I believe that larger projectiles are more likely to be affected by voids. I don't see much use for small bore smooth guns. If you can't shoot a good dose of shot out of a gun, you may as well have a rifle.

I've always found the 28 ga. and 20 ga. if properly loaded to be a vey effective shotgun. The key here is "properly loaded". I've always loaded a 28 bore with 1 1/8 to 1 3/8 of shot and at least 70 to 80 grains of powder along with some tight sealing cards and/or wads. Long barrels are a plus for small bores too.
I've got a flint double 18 ga. that grinds skeet to dust with 5/8ths oz loads. I shoot it as well as I do my 12 bore. massive loads of shot aren't always needed to get the job done, but many hours of work at the pattern board are absolutly vital if you ever expect to hit anything with shot. Of course it depends on what you're trying to kill, and the shooters skill level has probably the greatest to do with missed birds no matter what the bore size of the gun is or how much time is spent at the patten board.
Back to RB. I spend alot of time at Friendship and watch the smoothbore scores with interest. The smallest bore they alow for most smooth bore matches is 28ga. and , predictably it is the 28ga that is always at the top of the winners list. Infact it's somewhat rare to see anyone shooting a 20ga or larger that is competative.
My own experience goes against the experts that write columns in the glossy paged magazines. Smaller bores have always shot RB better for me. Of course I've only been doing it for 25 years..... ::

 

[AZ-Robert]

Mike, what is your target load for that PRB in a 28 gauge?

What is your shot load (and powder) for the 20 gauge?

 

[Mike Brooks]

Mike, what is your target load for that PRB in a 28 gauge?

What is your shot load (and powder) for the 20 gauge?

Varies widely from gun to gun.
My old Type G trade gun with the 48" barrel shot 55gr. 3fff and a .530 ball and .020 wonderlube patch. I used that for target or hunting. This was a very light barreled gun, and I think that had something to do with the lighter load it liked....something to do with barrel harmonics I suppose. I used to call it "The Iron Whip". You could feel the barrel seem to whip as the shot was fired. This was especially true with heavy shot loads.
I had an old 20 ga. that I shot most of my deer with. It had an old 41" Gostomski barrel in it. That gun hated patches, just wouldn't shoot at all with them. It did however shoot extreamly well bare ball. I used 60 gr. of 2ff and a .600 ball I allawys fouled the barrel before the first shot. It liked an 1 1/4oz shot load and a nitro card between the shot and powder, and a overshot card on top. It hated cushion wads.
Each and every smooth bore I've ever had liked different loads, the trick was finding that load that worked.

 

[David Teague]

Last weekend I shot a 5 shot group at 100 yds. with a 20 ga.(TC .54 rebore to 20) with PRB and 100 gr. 2F, 2 7/8"
offhand. I think the big bores can hold their own against the smaller ones. Course I did have a rear sight on this one.

"Last weekend I shot a 5 shot group at 100 yds. with a 20 ga. with PRB and 100 gr. 2F, 2 7/8" offhand.

:what:

No wonder they call you Deadeye...

I've owned rifled cartridge firearms that couldn't shoot better than 3 inches off the bench at 100 yards...

 

[AZ-Robert]

My own experience goes against the experts that write columns in the glossy paged magazines. Smaller bores have always shot RB better for me. Of course I've only been doing it for 25 years..... ::

A "seasoned authentic" who also can shoot AND build historically accurate guns. :hatsoff:

I've always found the 28 ga. and 20 ga. if properly loaded to be a vey effective shotgun.

If you had to narrow it down to one bore as a do-it-all gun, which would you like better?

 

[bnail]

Hey A-Z, he'd BETTER say 28 ga.! . . . 44" Getz swamped C weight to be specific! :winking:

 

[Mike Brooks]

If you had to narrow it down to one bore as a do-it-all gun, which would you like better?

Most guys shoot mostly round ball and only occasionaly shot. The 28 bore will shoot circles around a 20 bore (there are alway exceptions :winking The 20 bore probably shoots shot a little better , but loaded properly the 28 bore gives up very little against to 20 bore in shot patterns.

 

[Gemoke]

Dead EYE WILL YOU TEACH ME TO SHOOT!!! 2 7/8 INCH GROUP AT A 100 YARDS,WITH A SMOOTHIE OFF HAND.
CUT FINGER :hmm: :hmm:

 

[Deadeye]

Gemoke, You don't need me to teach you, you need to devote
your life to shooting and almost daily practice for about 40 or 50 yrs. Shooting competition for 50 yrs. helps to,especially pistol competition where you really learn trigger control. What I was trying to say wasn't how good I could shoot but that most of the guns made today will shoot well if the shooter can do his part, even a rebored TC barrel. There's no answer to a question like "how good will a smoothie shoot"
except "as good as you can shoot it".

 

[Rusty Old Gunns]

Smaller always seems to be more accurate.

Ask your deer hunters. Most prefer a .50 to the .54 or .58.

This is because the .50 has the flattest trajectory. Why? Damned if I know. Maybe it's the fact that the weight and mass of the larger balls loose energy more quickly, so more powder is needed. Also, the arch of the trajectory is greater in the bigger balls, so you have to work your load out and be very aware of your point of aim for 25, 50, 75, and 100 yards.

The flatter the trajectory, the less margin of error.

Just my thoughts on it.

As for me though. Give me a 20 gauge fowler, a sharp knife and a pound of powder and "Pacco's a happy boy".

 

[big bore 75]

Zonie posted a balistic example a while back ,it was intersting to show that for some reason the 54 had more retained energy than the 50, I thought that strange, but ok, I have liked 54 and just about everything I own has either been converted to 54, i.e. barrel exchange or built with the 54 in mind, only have one 58 and thats my custom fayetteville confederate rifle, and a tulle that is in 24 ga. (58) but is more accurate using 535 round ball , I guess it goes with the theory, :results:
bigger is better. :results: bb75

 

[roundball]

Smaller always seems to be more accurate.
Ask your deer hunters. Most prefer a .50 to the .54 or .58.

Considering PRB's in .45/.50/.54/.58 calibers...I don't measure group sizes with a micrometer but all my rifles/calibers are accurate...nothing different between them jumps out except for the .58cal x 1:70"...it is so accurate it's spooky...seems like I just have to point it towards the center of the target and it ends up in the bullseye...80grns Goex 2F, 90grns, 100grns...doesn't matter...incredibly accurate.