Roundballs and Shoulder Shots

[Bob J]

The only deer I've killed to date with a roundball was a doe at about 15 yards from my treestand. The GPR's load was a .530 ball powered by 110 grains 2f. The ball went thru both shoulders, the deer sprinted about 75 yards and dropped.

Now I'm using 80 grains 3f and a .535 ball in the flintlock. Does it make sense that a shoulder shot will take out at least one shoulder and both lungs? Wouldn't this be better than the often-recommended "right behind the shoulder" shot?

 

[Blizzard of '93]

through the shoulder may get the spine but too high for a good heart/lung shot. aim for shoulder rear and drop down halfway to get both lungs and heart junction. shoulder shot will put 'em down for good tho. they wont go far. don't pull too far back, that's bad.

 

[roundball]

The only deer I've killed to date with a roundball was a doe at about 15 yards from my treestand. The GPR's load was a .530 ball powered by 110 grains 2f. The ball went thru both shoulders, the deer sprinted about 75 yards and dropped.

Now I'm using 80 grains 3f and a .535 ball in the flintlock. Does it make sense that a shoulder shot will take out at least one shoulder and both lungs? Wouldn't this be better than the often-recommended "right behind the shoulder" shot?

In my experience, a deer shot from a tree stand is usually close enough to get a steep enough downward angle to drive a ball through a shoulder, through the heart or at least the lung area, and out the bottom...if using a large enough ball to carry the penetration, and that gets the best of all worlds.
The key to that shot is that the heart is still kept in the picture if at all possible, and at a minimum, the very lower sections of lungs are involved if the heart is below the angle...plus there's the benefit of a broken shoulder, if a large enough caliber ball is used.

On the horizontal from a ground sit or still hunting, IMO, a shoulder shot is not as 'automatic' as with a .30-06 because the massive shock effect in not there to disrupt the spinal column and personally I don't take them. On the horizontal, a ball could punch straight through a shoulder and out the other side without hitting the spine or going through the lungs...and the deer is still very much alive.

My priority on the horizontal is still always the heart just like from a treestand but I can't get the heart with a horizontal shoulder shot...POI is too high. With the smaller .440 & .490 I want an easy entry and wait until I can slip it right past the little point of an elbow down very low straight through the heart. If I'm using a bigger heavier .54/.58/.62cal ball, it's not as important to have a clear line to the heart from the broadside as those heavy balls will drive through the heart from almost any angle on a clockface around a deer's body...a benefit of using larger caliber patched balls driven by max/near-max powder charges for deer hunting.

 

[xxgrampa]

greetings dixie,

don't think the shoulder shot on a deer is all its cracked up to be..

when dressing a deer, notice how the shoulder is connected.. it ain't.. it's more of a blade that fits against the chest and held there with muscle.. a ball thru the shoulder, just pokes a hole in it. nothing breaks.

howsomever, it may bloodshot a lot of meat..

think its best to take the shot like most people said, hit them rite behind the 'elbow' on a level shot. or like the r.b. said, use enuff of a load to take the heart out 'around the clock'

good luck and ..ttfn..grampa..

 

[xxgrampa]

oooups, just read the blizzards and r.b.'s post again. think i repeated what they said.. sorry guys... :redface:

tt.g

 

[jethro224]

I agree with the rest of these guys. The shoulder is not a vital organ. Depends on what else you hit too.

Look at some deer anatomy pics. Aim for the top of the heart. Take out both lungs and the heart and you got a dead deer. If you hit a little high, you'll still get both lungs. A little low will get the heart. You get a couple inches of good front and rear too.

A clean shot thru the ribcage will hardly damage any meat and will take 'em down. A well-hit, dead deer may just fall over or may run 150 yards. A lot depends on their state of mind when you shot. A spooked deer that's been run all over the county , and shot at along the way, will be pumped full of adrenalin and might go extra far. I've seen calm deer take arrows thru both lungs, flinch, look around, and go right back to what they were doing. Then fall over dead. The buck I shot last year with a round ball thru the lungs did the same. A doe the year before ran about 50 yards.

Good luck out there this year! :hatsoff:

 

[CoyoteJoe]

I agree as well. The shoulder is not a sure "take down" but is sure to damage some meat, I try to go just behind the shoulder with roundballs or with modern centerfire rifles. If I hit the off-side shoulder on the exit, well that sometimes can't be avoided but that is not my intent.

 

[BrownBear]

We like our shoulder roasts too much for shoulder shots if I can avoid them. Lung or heart/lung just behind the shoulder does fine, though I usually shoot a little higher in the lung than most folks here talk about- because we really like heart, too. Mess up too much meat on a shot and my wife gives me The Look. That's enough to make anyone pick their shots carefully!

 

[gmww]

Just a little food for thought on shot placement. I believe it should be place based on how to get to the vitals. I've pretty much been a shoot behind the shoulder and lung/heart hunter.

Then I went to Texas and was hunting some exotic free ranging thing called an Aoudad (sp?). The guide explained that I needed to shoot through the shoulders on broadside shots because the animal's from that region have their vitals more forward. :hmm:

At any rate depending on how the animal is presented to me will depend on where the placement will be to get to the vitals. With the exception of a Texas heart shot.

 

[Dphar]

The only deer I've killed to date with a roundball was a doe at about 15 yards from my treestand. The GPR's load was a .530 ball powered by 110 grains 2f. The ball went thru both shoulders, the deer sprinted about 75 yards and dropped.

Now I'm using 80 grains 3f and a .535 ball in the flintlock. Does it make sense that a shoulder shot will take out at least one shoulder and both lungs? Wouldn't this be better than the often-recommended "right behind the shoulder" shot?

At 15 yards I would be tempted to use a head shot. Unless teh animal is on about the same level as the gun a shoulder shot that gets both is hard to do. The angle of penetration is wrong if the gun is much above or below the animal.

Vital organs. Most species of deer have vital organs behind the shoulder region. I say region since the shoulder and the shoulder blade are 2 different things .
If you shoot a deer 1/3 of the way down from the top of the back and right over the front leg with the animal standing normally on all 4s its not likely to run off unless its a moose and probably not then. This shot will strike or heavily shock the spine and the animal will die where it stood in most cases. They can get back up after a shock to the spinal column but if its under the spine over the front leg they won't get far.
it is nearly impossible to stop a deer from running off unless the brain or spinal column is struck or heavily shocked.
They have a programed reaction to run like hell from anything, especially whitetails. Even if they bullet is not initially felt as is sometimes the case it would seem. The noise will put them to flight.A deer can cover 75 to 200 yards in a matter of seconds. if the deer lives 10-20 seconds or even 5 and can run flat out for that time they can cover a LOT of ground.

Dan

 

[Bob J]

Thanks for the replies, everyone. It seems the double-lung shot and "just above the heart" to do major arterial damage is about as good as it gets.

 

[Stumpkiller]

Hunt with a round ball more like an arrow than a modern bullet. Try for a double lung first or a heart shot second (depending in angle). The shoulder with a 1/2" hole poked through it lacks the "impact" of a high power round with lots of hydrostatic shock blown through the spongy lungs and tissue behind.

 

[Kentuckywindage]

Does this help with an idea where its good to place a shot? Blood trail was huge.

 

[captaincaveman]

I never shoot for the shoulder, Just my opinion though. I gun hunt the same way I bow hunt (trad bows are my other passion). double lung = meat. Why would anybody want to shoot the heart? Next to backstrap it's the best part

Josh

 

[roundball]

"...Why would anybody want to shoot the heart?..."

Here's two reason why I do:

1) Take out the pump with a lead round ball, they kick up their heels, make a mad dash for 25-35yds and fall within sight;

2) I don't eat venison at all, and no organ meat regardless of the animal it came from;

 

[Mad Professor]

A shoulder shot vs heart/lung shot is just a way to waste a lot of good meat.

 

[tg]

The range and caliber will determine the merit of a shoulder shot, I have taken deer up close like this and dropped them, didn't find the rb damaged a lot of meat, a conical would probably mes things up a bit.

 

[Slamfire]

I agree as well. The shoulder is not a sure "take down" but is sure to damage some meat, I try to go just behind the shoulder with roundballs or with modern centerfire rifles. If I hit the off-side shoulder on the exit, well that sometimes can't be avoided but that is not my intent.

If I can hit the offside shoulder after the ball passes through the lungs and aorta I'll do it every time. You can't expect to knock a deer down braking a couple of ribs and having the ball pass through, essentially air in between. It may happen, but you can't count on it. A solid hit on a big bone will knock down most deer, but not all of them.

 

[Headhunter]

Well, I can say that after hunting with the patched round ball for almost 30 years, I have been very lucky. I have had Broadside, Quartering to, Facing, quartering away straight up and straight down shots.

I have had Neck shots, behind the shoulder shots, Shoulder shots and behind the head shots. All using the Patched round ball. All ended up with a dead deer on the ground.

My Preference? 30 yards, Broadside, Right behind the shoulder. Puts them down quick, usually within sight.

Headhunter

 

[Runner]

The neck shot works great if bone is hit. The head shot works great if you hit spine or the brain case. The shoulder shot at close range stuns the spine and drops them for a few seconds usually. The other damage kills them.
Behind the shoulder middle of body and they run about 25 to 50 yards and they pile up. It damages the least amount of meat.
The surest shot on a deer is if you find where the front curve of the rear ham comes up and fades into the body. It will cut all kinds of large blood vessels and will also stun the back legs a large percentage of the time. They bleed out in secounds. It also tends to rupture intestines and tears up some of the best meat on the deer. It also requires that you hit a softball sized target to do it right.
In the end, a 30 yard broadside relaxed feeding deer hit right behind the front shoulder will do the job everytime with the least damage to the meat. Having said that, I like the high shoulder shot if I need the deer down right there. If you can shoot behind the shoulder and hit the off side leg, you have the best of both worlds. Massive trauma and the deer has to waste seconds attempting to get back up. It also gives you a trail marked by that bad leg if you are in heavily populated deer country where tracking can be a problem if you don't have a blood trail.
I bone the shoulders and grind the meat, so shooting thru the shoulder is not a problem for me.